Corey Kluber available?

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

The value on young starters is just too high to give up two in one deal. I think Ray, Burnes and Peralta for Kluber is a massive overpay. Plus, the Indians have Kluber and Bauer on the market because not only are they trying to save money they have too many starting pitching options. I could totally see a package headlined by Ray and Santana or even one of the Brewers' relievers (Knebel?).

[Vollbc74]

Ray, Santana, Peralta and Comp A pick would be my top offer.

 

I would also be willing to eat Kipnis as a bridge to Hiura if they took back Thames/Anderson

[TURBO]

I'd do Ray and Santana right now!

 

No way I move Burnes AND Peralta. In fact, I wouldn't move Burnes at all, and I'm not thrilled to let Peralta go either.

 

I enjoy the fact that we have 3 major league ready guys to anchor our rotation this year, trading them away, as a small market club is not wise.

[3and2Fastball]

Kluber is a potential difference maker for a team that finished one game away from the World Series. I'd trade Peralta or Woodruff plus Ray for him. Not giving up Hiura or Burnes though

[KeithStone53151]

I'd do Ray and Santana right now!

 

No way I move Burnes AND Peralta. In fact, I wouldn't move Burnes at all, and I'm not thrilled to let Peralta go either.

 

I enjoy the fact that we have 3 major league ready guys to anchor our rotation this year, trading them away, as a small market club is not wise.

 

This is about where I'm at with the 2 pitchers. Burnes is a hard no in almost all cases. Trout, Betts, Degrom, etc...I'd consider it, but Kluber isn't in that category and none of those targets are realistic right now. Burnes and Hiura are going to be special players, they are in a tier well above any prospects or the other 2 SP. Peralta and Woodruff are more expendable in the right deal. Someone of Kluber's caliber might be the right deal, we'll see if it works out.

[PDCBalla]

Since 2014 his lowest WAR (according to fangraphs) is 5.1 with a high of 7.4 but you don't think we should give up anything for him besides our #2 prospect (who isn't rated in the top 100). You can't get a Cy Young caliber pitcher for multiple years (team controlled through 2021) without giving up something of value.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

I'd do Ray and Santana right now!

 

No way I move Burnes AND Peralta. In fact, I wouldn't move Burnes at all, and I'm not thrilled to let Peralta go either.

 

I enjoy the fact that we have 3 major league ready guys to anchor our rotation this year, trading them away, as a small market club is not wise.

 

Would you do Ray, Santana and Knebel for Kluber? I think that makes sense for both teams. Indians need relief help, and Knebel would slot in well there. Would suck to lose him as a Brewer fan, but I think I'd rather trade an ML reliever than one of the young starters.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Since 2014 his lowest WAR (according to fangraphs) is 5.1 with a high of 7.4 but you don't think we should give up anything for him besides our #2 prospect (who isn't rated in the top 100). You can't get a Cy Young caliber pitcher for multiple years (team controlled through 2021) without giving up something of value.

 

Top prospect lists are for fans. GMs could care less. Ray is a young (24) 5-tool OF who was a very high pick and is finally living up to that potential. Value is high.

[PDCBalla]

He strikes out way too much to have as much value as you think he has.

[PDCBalla]

Tom

@Haudricourt

Someone familiar with what Indians are looking for in a deal for Corey Kluber tells me #Brewers could satisfy their needs. I'm just not sure how #Brewers would squeeze Kluber's $17 million salary into their budget. Seems to me they'd have to deal another salary away (Thames?).

[MrTPlush]

Tom

@Haudricourt

Someone familiar with what Indians are looking for in a deal for Corey Kluber tells me #Brewers could satisfy their needs. I'm just not sure how #Brewers would squeeze Kluber's $17 million salary into their budget. Seems to me they'd have to deal another salary away (Thames?).

 

Money would hardly seem as a problem. They are loaded with expendable guys they could trade to make space. Anderson and Thames being the main guys.

 

I would easily give up Peralta or Woodruff to make it happen, plus other decent pieces if that is all it takes is one of those two headline. I will roll the dice on Kluber staying healthy and not aging when it doesn't take Burnes or Hiura. Dude has been one of the best pitchers in baseball for half a decade.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

He strikes out way too much to have as much value as you think he has.

 

Florial has struck out anywhere from 29 to 35 percent of the time in the last 3 seasons, a very similar K rate to Ray, while Ray has shown quite a bit more power. Verdugo has shown high contact but little power. Nearly every prospect has warts.

 

Kluber would be fun, but trading two MLB-ready starting pitchers for him I just think is cutting off their head despite their face.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

 

Indians needs this offseason are OF, OF, RP, OF, C, 1B and more OF. A package of Ray, Santana, Thames and Knebel for Kluber and Kipnis makes some sense.

[MrTPlush]

A package of Ray, Santana, Thames and Knebel for Kluber and Kipnis makes some sense.

 

For who? Just the Brewers? They would have to be mighty high on Ray and mighty high on Santana. The former no one was high on last offseason before he stunk up the joint.

[KeithStone53151]

Tom

@Haudricourt

Someone familiar with what Indians are looking for in a deal for Corey Kluber tells me #Brewers could satisfy their needs. I'm just not sure how #Brewers would squeeze Kluber's $17 million salary into their budget. Seems to me they'd have to deal another salary away (Thames?).

 

Money would hardly seem as a problem. They are loaded with expendable guys they could trade to make space. Anderson and Thames being the main guys.

 

It's an obstacle, but you're right probably not a huge problem. Both guys have more value than their contracts. I know many are down on Thames, but he's put up good numbers when healthy and getting consistent at bats. He's better than quite a few DH's in the AL and could even be a candidate for a tanking team to give consistent AB and flip at the deadline...as he has the cheap option year.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

A package of Ray, Santana, Thames and Knebel for Kluber and Kipnis makes some sense.

 

For who? Just the Brewers? They would have to be mighty high on Ray and mighty high on Santana. The former no one was high on last offseason before he stunk up the joint.

 

Got a source on that? Because it would see to me that no one has any idea what type of value Stearns put on Santana in a trade. Just because no one met that price doesn't mean there's no value there. I don't understand that narrative.

 

Also taking on Kipnis' deal lessens the value going back to the Indians.

[BuckyBrewer61]

If you can get Kluber while keeping Hiura and Burnes, you do it now.

 

If you can get him while keeping Peralta and Woodruff too as some are suggesting (but I doubt is realistic), you do it yesterday.

[KeithStone53151]

 

Indians needs this offseason are OF, OF, RP, OF, C, 1B and more OF. A package of Ray, Santana, Thames and Knebel for Kluber and Kipnis makes some sense.

 

That's a weird trade. From a salary standpoint, the Brewers pieces are owed a combined $13.5M with arbitration estimates. Cleveland's players are owed $31.5M. Kluber has options that will certainly be picked up, while Kipnis has a $2.5M buyout on his option that will certainly be declined. Knebel and Santana are under team control through 2021, while Thames has an affordable option with a $1M buyout. I feel like the Brewers need salary relief, we are also giving up quite a bit of talent to take on a bad contract in Kipnis.

 

From a fit standpoint, we'd basically be a 1 stop shop for the Indians needs...for the most part. We'd also have a temporary 2b that we could shift to a LH 4th OF role when Hiura comes up. We would in this case, have to add relief help...but we keep our pitching talent intact.

[mattyo]

If you can get Kluber while keeping Hiura and Burnes, you do it now.

 

If you can get him while keeping Peralta and Woodruff too as some are suggesting (but I doubt is realistic), you do it yesterday.

 

Yeah I think this is the most realistic view of things. Which is why we won't be getting Kluber without including any of those 4.

[sveumrules]

Got a source on that? Because it would see to me that no one has any idea what type of value Stearns put on Santana in a trade. Just because no one met that price doesn't mean there's no value there. I don't understand that narrative.

 

If GMs didn't want to meet the price on Santana when he was coming off of a season where he posted 2.9 WAR & a 126 OPS+, what kind of price do you think they will pay to acquire him after 1.0 WAR & a 97 OPS+ with a two month demotion to AAA?

[wallus]

No way we get Kluber without Hiura, Burnes or Peralta. I would be happy if we got him with just giving up one of those guys.

[PDCBalla]

Morosi is going on live shortly on MLB network to talk Kluber FYI

[KeithStone53151]

Not specific to Kluber, but Haudricourt is in super salty mode on twitter right now responding to fans that want to see the Brewers add payroll. I understand his frustration and generally agree with him, but it's so much fun to see.

 

Tying it back to the thread, the very beginning of his twitter rampage started with a response to a guy upset that we aren't making more of a push for Kluber.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Not specific to Kluber, but Haudricourt is in super salty mode on twitter right now responding to fans that want to see the Brewers add payroll. I understand his frustration and generally agree with him, but it's so much fun to see.

 

Tying it back to the thread, the very beginning of his twitter rampage started with a response to a guy upset that we aren't making more of a push for Kluber.

 

I like when he gets salty with those idiots. Quality reading. Brewers Twitter is a goofy bunch of squirrels.

[Eye Black]

I think the financials are being somewhat overstated as a potential road block. I believe the Brewers have budgeted money to spend on pitching when the time is right. I don't think they have a fixed salary threshold etched in stone.

 

With the last two years of Kluber's contract being team options subject to buyout the risk is significantly mitigated. Obviously you hope to get three great years from Kluber, but if something catastrophic occurs you can pay the $1 million buyout and rid yourself of the financial commitment. That is a good framework to start with for a club that can't afford to be sunk with multiple years of dead money.