2B/3B Options

[FVBrewerFan]

If you go with a platoon and they stink, it will put a lot more pressure on Stearns and Co to rush Hiura. If they find a decent one year guy, it will allow that process to play itself out on its own. Either Hiura takes and forces his way up or he spends a year in AAA getting better. Very risky in more ways than one with going with just Perez/Cory.

 

First, they're not going to rush Hiura no matter what. Stearns and CC have both talked about this in the past, they won't bring up a player until they are "ready." That's not just numbers, but if they feel the player is mature enough, etc.

 

That said, I see your point if the platoon fails then what? Well, same thing could happen with almost all the names people are throwing out there. And if you look at their numbers, they've both been pretty consistent if used in a strict platoon. Anything can happen, but hard to see that platoon hitting under .700 as a floor, and the ceiling is .800+

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Count me among the (very) few here who like the idea of Josh Harrison on this team. I think he could put up solid numbers (.260-.270 average, .700-.725 OPS) in Miller Park and play a steady 2B on defense. If Keston proves ready for a promotion mid-year, Harrison doesn't strike me as the type who is going to sulk, and I think he'd be energized playing for a title contender. Plus, he is not a heavy K guy, so that would be a nice change of pace after watching Villar and Schoop flail away at that spot most of last year.

 

My first choice would be Marwin Gonzalez, followed closely by Moose on a 2-year deal, but I wouldn't mind Harrison at all. He's a veteran who is well respected in the league and has always played the game the right way. He would bring a dose of energy to the team as well.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Count me among the (very) few here who like the idea of Josh Harrison on this team. I think he could put up solid numbers (.260-.270 average, .700-.725 OPS) in Miller Park and play a steady 2B on defense. If Keston proves ready for a promotion mid-year, Harrison doesn't strike me as the type who is going to sulk, and I think he'd be energized playing for a title contender. Plus, he is not a heavy K guy, so that would be a nice change of pace after watching Villar and Schoop flail away at that spot most of last year.

 

My first choice would be Marwin Gonzalez, followed closely by Moose on a 2-year deal, but I wouldn't mind Harrison at all. He's a veteran who is well respected in the league and has always played the game the right way. He would bring a dose of energy to the team as well.

 

I do like that Harrison can also play 3B...not that it would be hard platoons, but adding Harrison gives the Brewers a ton of flexibility playing righty/lefty matchups and being a versatile bench option - particularly if Hiura sets the world on fire in AAA and fully deserves to be in Milwaukee later this season. Plus, I think he can easily be signeed to a 1 year deal, while Marwin is going to probably be a 3-4 year contract.

[A Swing and A Drive]

Great points by Joey Meyer Bombs and Fear the Chorizo!

[SRB]

I'm not so sure Marwin is going to get a huge payday when more consistent guys like Lowrie/LeMahieu have settled for 2-year deals and questionable playing time.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

I'm not so sure Marwin is going to get a huge payday when more consistent guys like Lowrie/LeMahieu have settled for 2-year deals and questionable playing time.

 

That's my hope. Marwin is young enough, too, to be a core guy for the team's full window. I wouldn't have any problem signing him to a 3-4 year contract, provided the per year average is palatable.

[NYChez]

If they wanted a guy like Harrison, wouldn't they have just held on to Schoop?

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

If they wanted a guy like Harrison, wouldn't they have just held on to Schoop?

 

Big difference between $4-5 million and $10 million. Also, Schoop was a K machine last year, and Harrison rarely Ks.

[A Swing and A Drive]

I doubt the Brewers pony up the money for Grandal if the decision to non-tender Schoop isn't made, either.

[Eye Black]

Danny Valencia is a solid option to platoon with Shaw and should only cost a couple million. He is a fantastic hitter against lefties.

I am copying a comment RollieTime made in the 2019 Lineup thread in the Major League forum.

 

He is correct that Danny Valencia could likely be signed for a small financial commitment. I think Valencia could actually be a better offensive upgrade than any of the realistic 2B options remaining. Valencia mashes left-handed pitching.

 

Valencia’s wRC+ versus LHP the last few seasons:

 

2014: 135 wRC+

2015: 128 wRC+

2016: 153 wRC+

2017: 119 wRC+

2018: 132 wRC+

 

Travis Shaw is awful against LHP (66 wRC+ last year). If Valencia was available to bat against LHP he would project as one of the Brewers top four hitters (against LHP). With the Cubs being so lefty heavy Valencia could certainly add another solid bat versus the Northsiders. It would also take the pressure off needing to make a splash at 2B, and especially if the team believed that Keston Hiura could take over the 2B job by June.

[BlazingGunz]

Isn't he (Valencia) a club house cancer though? I believe he has gotten into multiple fights with team mates and even put Billy Butler in the hospital with a concussion. I think he is known to be a hot head and not much fun to be around...no thanks.

[brewerfan82]

Interesting, I didn't know about the Valencia/Butler incident. Here's an article on it:

 

https://www.sfgate.com/athletics/article/A-s-clubhouse-fight-Danny-Valencia-Billy-9177957.php

 

I think I would have punched Butler in the head as well, lol.

[Eye Black]

Interesting, I didn't know about the Valencia/Butler incident. Here's an article on it:

 

https://www.sfgate.com/athletics/article/A-s-clubhouse-fight-Danny-Valencia-Billy-9177957.php

 

I think I would have punched Butler in the head as well, lol.

Huh, I vaguely remember that incident, but had completely forgotten the players involved. Okay, cross him off the list then.

[yfinn6]

Interesting, I didn't know about the Valencia/Butler incident. Here's an article on it:

 

https://www.sfgate.com/athletics/article/A-s-clubhouse-fight-Danny-Valencia-Billy-9177957.php

 

I think I would have punched Butler in the head as well, lol.

Huh, I vaguely remember that incident, but had completely forgotten the players involved. Okay, cross him off the list then.

 

[SRB]

Good idea re Danny Valencia, Eye Black

 

Here are some more 2B/3B free agent/trade candidates who hit LHP well and could split time with Shaw at 3B or Spangenberg at 2B.

 

(2016-2018 splits)

 

Whit Merrifield, 138 wRC+ vs LHP (trade)

Danny Valencia, 135 wRC+ vs LHP

Jeff McNeil, 124 wRC+ vs LHP (trade)

Wilmer Flores, 120 wRC+ vs LHP

Asdrubal Cabrera, 117 wRC+ vs LHP

Starlin Castro, 110 wRC+ vs LHP (trade)

Josh Harrison, 109 wRC+ vs LHP

 

Of course, a few of those guys would be more expensive than others and would make Spangenberg obsolete, in which case Perez could give Shaw some days off at 3B.

 

Asdrubal Cabrera makes the most sense to me. Merrifield or McNeil might cost Hiura or a similar prospect haul. Valencia has the clubhouse issues mentioned above and limited versatility. Flores had weird reverse platoon numbers in 2018 and is questionable at 2B. Castro is expensive. Harrison has not been great recently and is not a huge upgrade over Perez.

[xisxisxis]

Interesting, I didn't know about the Valencia/Butler incident. Here's an article on it:

 

https://www.sfgate.com/athletics/article/A-s-clubhouse-fight-Danny-Valencia-Billy-9177957.php

 

I think I would have punched Butler in the head as well, lol.

Huh, I vaguely remember that incident, but had completely forgotten the players involved. Okay, cross him off the list then.

Cross him off the list? Billy Butler is a known dick and he thinks he can screw around with someone else's money. Then when Valencia tells him to mind his own business and Butler doubles down with his "*****" comment... I don't have a problem with how Valencia responded after Butler escalated the incident. I applaud Valencia for his control...

[brewerfan82]

SRB's list a couple posts back inspired me to update the 3 year splits from the original post, removing players who have signed and adding in a couple that have been discussed recently. Note, players are listed in order of total wRC+ and FanGraph's Def stat listed should be taken with a huge grain of salt:

 

[pre]IN HOUSE

3YR OPS 3YR wRC+

Rnk Player (Age, Positions) vsRHP vsLHP Total vsRHP vsLHP Total 3YR Def

--------------------------- ----------------- ----------------- -------

Travis Shaw* (28, 3B/1B/2B) .850 / .668 / .807 120 / 74 / 110 7.5

Cory Spangenberg* (28, 3B/2B/LF) .757 / .512 / .696 105 / 37 / 88 -5.5

Hernan Perez (27, 3B/OF/2B/SS) .666 / .786 / .706 73 / 103 / 83 1.1

Orlando Arcia (24, SS) .662 / .658 / .661 70 / 75 / 72 7.9

Tyler Saladino (29, 3B/SS/2B) .623 / .641 / .629 67 / 77 / 70 5.8

 

 

2B FREE AGENTS

3YR OPS 3YR wRC+

Rnk Player (Age, Positions) vsRHP vsLHP Total vsRHP vsLHP Total 3YR Def

--------------------------- ----------------- ----------------- -------

Asdrubal Cabrera^ (32, 2B/SS/3B) .788 / .796 / .790 113 / 117 / 114 2.6

Derek Dietrich* (29, 2B/LF/3B) .782 / .701 / .767 114 / 94 / 110 -15.3

Marwin Gonzalez^ (29, 1B/LF/2B/SS/3B) .786 / .753 / .776 115 / 106 / 112 -13.5

Neil Walker^ (33, 1B/RF/2B/3B) .780 / .724 / .767 111 / 98 / 107 4.8

Josh Harrison (31, 2B/3B/OF) .694 / .786 / .715 85 / 109 / 91 3.6

 

3B FREE AGENTS

3YR OPS 3YR wRC+

Rnk Player (Age, Positions) vsRHP vsLHP Total vsRHP vsLHP Total 3YR Def

--------------------------- ----------------- ----------------- -------

Manny Machado (26, SS/3B) .841 / .891 / .855 121 / 136 / 125 19.0

Asdrubal Cabrera^ (32, 2B/SS/3B) .788 / .796 / .790 113 / 117 / 114 2.6

Marwin Gonzalez^ (29, 1B/LF/2B/SS/3B) .786 / .753 / .776 115 / 106 / 112 -13.5

Derek Dietrich* (29, 2B/LF/3B) .782 / .701 / .767 114 / 94 / 110 -15.3

Mike Moustakas* (30, 3B) .827 / .746 / .804 115 / 96 / 109 -0.4

Wilmer Flores (27, SS/3B/1B) .743 / .829 / .771 101 / 120 / 108 -11.5

Neil Walker^ (33, 1B/RF/2B/3B) .780 / .724 / .767 111 / 98 / 107 4.8

Danny Valencia (34, 1B/RF/3B) .699 / .867 / .751 90 / 135 / 104 -32.1

Jose Bautista (38, LF/RF/3B) .748 / .686 / .733 105 / 89 / 101 -25.6

Matt Davidson (28, 3B/1B) .691 / .823 / .726 84 / 124 / 95 -20.1

Josh Harrison (31, 2B/3B/OF) .694 / .786 / .715 85 / 109 / 91 3.6[/pre]

 

Edit: Nice find SRB, added Davidson to the list!

[SRB]

Thanks for the list MrAllen! I also learned that Matt Davidson was non-tendered by the White Sox and is a free agent. He hits LHP quite well but is more of a 3B/1B with so-so defense.

 

Career splits:

 

vs RHP - 87 wRC+

vs LHP - 118 wRC+

[brewerfan82]

The big thing that jumps out at me is the affirmation that a Spangenberg/Perez platoon does look pretty effective to begin the year with no further moves.

 

With that said, assuming there isn't a lot of money left to sign a bigger impact bat, Neil Walker would round out the offense pretty nicely. A righty Perez, lefty Spangenberg, and switch hitting Walker would give Counsell all sorts of flexibility to play with. Throw in Pina, Thames, and Gamel, and you've got a ton of depth and options coming off the bench.

[brewmann04]

I think DS is happy with the platoon unless he finds a guy to take a one year deal

[ebmackenzie]

Tampa needs a 1b they have the Ji man and newly inked Matt Davidson...and we have Thames on the cheap. Additional players may be added from our side...I was thinking out of options Houser.

 

David Robertson (.800OPS) would be a nice UT, 2B-40, SS-29, 3B-19, LF-4, DH-2, P-1, 1B-1

or since they also have several 2b ready to come up from their farm...

Joey Wendle, lefty bat (.789OPS) and current 2b starter and UT (2B-101, 3B-20, LF-16, SS-10, RF-1)

might be able to be had as well...on the cheap.

[Eye Black]

The big thing that jumps out at me is the affirmation that a Spangenberg/Perez platoon does look pretty effective to begin the year with no further moves.

The biggest problem with penciling Hernán Pérez in as a platoon partner is it limits his positional flexibility to fill in at other spots (i.e. 3B or corner OF). For instance if Pérez is at 2B versus left-handed pitching, than you have Shaw anchoring 3B and facing lefties. If no other infielders are added I would guess that Tyler Saladino would play 2B with Hernán Pérez at 3B in this scenario. The problem is do you really want to rely on having Pérez, Saladino, and Arcia all in your lineup when facing LHPs? IMO they either need to believe Hiura can have an impact by June, or they need to find someone that can thrive versus lefties.

[adambr2]

I'd like to note that Maurcio Dubon, our number 7 prospect, prior to his injury, was posting a .922 OPS for the Sky Sox in 2018. He was hitting. 348 away from home, albeit with less power, but not all of his numbers were Colorado inflated.

 

In 2016 for the Red Sox Portland AA club he posted an OPS over .900 in 269 PAs. Had a down year in Biloxi in 2017 but still contributed with good defense and 38 SBs. He's a true middle infielder that can either play 2nd every day or easily slide over and fill in for Arcia.

 

Some feel Dubon is overrated here, I think the opposite is true -- I think he's quite overlooked. By no means am I saying, "This guy is our 2B of the future." But if we are talking about a Spangenberg/Perez platoon at 2nd, Dubon absolutely belongs in the conversation as well.

 

My guess is that he starts the year at San Antonio, but if given an over/under of 100 PAs for him at the MLB level in 2019, I'll take the over.

[SRB]

I'm a big fan of Dubon but you're still penciling in a prospect to have a good first MLB season to rely on him.

 

In my ideal world the roster near the end of these season would have Hiura as the everyday 2B, Dubon as the backup SS/utility guy, and an offense-first bench infielder like Cabrera.

[82brewcrew82]

I think the plan is Moose, Cabrera or upgrade somewhere else based on the available options. Hiura is the play at second and I have little doubt about that at this point.