Schoop news (Latest- Non-Tendered)

[TURBO]

Brewers general manager David Stearns was non-committal Tuesday when asked if the club will tender a contract to Jonathan Schoop.

 

"That's a discussion we're going to have to continue to have over the next several weeks to a month," said Stearns. Schoop, 27, struggled with a .202/.246/.331 batting line and just four homers over 46 games after being acquired from the Orioles at the trade deadline. He made $8.5 million in 2018 and is eligible for a raise in arbitration this winter before hitting free agency after 2019. The Brewers would surely field interest on the trade market before considering a non-tender.

 

 

Source: Adam McCalvy on Twitter

Oct 23 - 3:22 PM

[jonescm128]

I think the Brewers keep him. They need a RH power bat and that is what Schoop is. Yes, he was terrible with the Brewers but he hit .293 with 32 home runs a year before.

[NYChez]

If they're going to make decisions based on a player's one career year, perhaps they should also bring back Sogard to see if he can re-live his .393 OBP magic.

[FVBrewerFan]

Stearns said something very similar about Moose. Theres a chance he'll be back, but no way Schoop will be.

[BrewFan130]

I do understand Schoop May be eligible for a raise, but during the arbitration process I’d find it difficult for his manager to be able to substantiate a raise with his 2018 production as support.

 

That aside, if the Brewers plan on keeping him they need to address his use. I believe that Schoop can be an effective and productive player for the Brewers, but not in the type of role he was used in this past September and October. I think he is a player that needs everyday ABs as a starter to be an effective batter. There are some players that can be effective off the bench as pinch hitters, but Schoop is not one of them.

[trwi7]

I do understand Schoop May be eligible for a raise, but during the arbitration process I’d find it difficult for his manager to be able to substantiate a raise with his 2018 production as support.

 

The problem is the arbitration system is still archaic. You can have a salary reduction of more than 20% and a reduction in salary pretty much never happens. Jimmy Nelson will probably make the same amount of money next year as he did this year if not slightly more despite not pitching in over a year. And they don't look at just the previous year and they don't really look at things like OBP. They see an average of 26 homers and 93 RBIs the last 3 years. Also working against the Brewers is him making $8.5 million last year. Like I said there is almost never a reduction in salary so the minimum we could offer is $8.5 million and even if he counters with $10 million, he'll probably win.

[PinaMadness]

Translation: "No"

[SomewhereInTime]

Thank god, Schoop is an absolutely terrible baseball player and has no business being anywhere near this team in the future.

[Pugger]

Thank god, Schoop is an absolutely terrible baseball player and has no business being anywhere near this team in the future.

 

He's not terrible defensively. It is a real mystery why he couldn't hit at all once he was traded to us. But I don't want him back either. He belongs in the AL.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Schoop is basically Jesus Aguilar with the athleticism to play 2B. I have no doubt that he is capable of getting hot and carrying the team on his back for stretches, but as we saw, when he slumps, it's a hard, hard slump. He just doesn't have the OBP skill to sustain himself as a solid player through cold stretches.

 

If the Brewers had a few better OBP-type players, I wouldn't have a problem bringing back Schoop. But right now, Shaw (or Moose), Aguilar, Pina, Santana and Braun all bring similar streaky "all-or-nothing" offensive profiles, and I just don't think you can fill the lineup with those types and still have any consistency. It would be another year of a feast or famine offense.

[Jimbo]

Arbitrators tend to look at old school stats and not money ball metrics. This wouldn't work in the Brewers' favor.

[TURBO]

 

I think he is a player that needs everyday ABs as a starter to be an effective batter. There are some players that can be effective off the bench as pinch hitters, but Schoop is not one of them.

 

Agree on this, I felt the same way about Santana. Players, most anyway, are most productive when they see regular at bats. Starting every other day, or once or twice a week, for most guys isn't going to see production.

[BrewersSuperCollector]

Thank god, Schoop is an absolutely terrible baseball player and has no business being anywhere near this team in the future.

 

Really? You actually believe this?

[MrTPlush]

 

I think he is a player that needs everyday ABs as a starter to be an effective batter. There are some players that can be effective off the bench as pinch hitters, but Schoop is not one of them.

 

Agree on this, I felt the same way about Santana.

 

I guess that would explain Domingo Santana's substitute line of : .324 .375 .622 .997

 

Or I guess his PH stats only (not including a second PA after coming into a game): .414 .469 .793 1.262

 

Or maybe his stats in the second half where his play was entirely limited every single time: .409 .458 .909 1.367

 

 

.796 OPS over his career as a starter... 1.114 OPS over his career PHing.

[JohnBriggs12]

The Brewers could likely go out and sign Dozier on a one year deal for slightly less than what Schoop would get in arbitration. Dozier should be looking to re-establish his value on a one year deal. Now both guys are coming off really down years, but Dozier has much better on base skills (70 walks despite hitting just .215) and won a gold glove in 2017. I think some progression to the mean of his career numbers can be expected.

[TURBO]

 

I think he is a player that needs everyday ABs as a starter to be an effective batter. There are some players that can be effective off the bench as pinch hitters, but Schoop is not one of them.

 

Agree on this, I felt the same way about Santana.

 

I guess that would explain Domingo Santana's substitute line of : .324 .375 .622 .997

 

Or I guess his PH stats only (not including a second PA after coming into a game): .414 .469 .793 1.262

 

Or maybe his stats in the second half where his play was entirely limited every single time: .409 .458 .909 1.367

 

 

.796 OPS over his career as a starter... 1.114 OPS over his career PHing.

 

 

Actually I was speaking about the first half of the season where he was sent down...I don't think his sporadic playing time the first half did him, or the Brewers any favors.

[jonescm128]

If they're going to make decisions based on a player's one career year, perhaps they should also bring back Sogard to see if he can re-live his .393 OBP magic.

 

He may not be as good as his 2017 but he is still a good player. $10 million good? Probably not but he can still be valuable

 

2015 - .279/.306/.482, 17 2Bs, 15 HRs

2016 - .267/.298/.454, 38 2Bs, 25 HRs

2017 - .293/.338/.503, 35 2Bs, 32 HRs

2018 - .233/.266/.416, 22 2Bs, 21 HRs

 

A career OPS of .738 is pretty valuable in this league (for comparison Moustakas career OPS is .737)

 

I think they tender him just for the fact that they gave up three players to get him. You can't just let him walk.

[adambr2]

If they're going to make decisions based on a player's one career year, perhaps they should also bring back Sogard to see if he can re-live his .393 OBP magic.

 

He may not be as good as his 2017 but he is still a good player. $10 million good? Probably not but he can still be valuable

 

2015 - .279/.306/.482, 17 2Bs, 15 HRs

2016 - .267/.298/.454, 38 2Bs, 25 HRs

2017 - .293/.338/.503, 35 2Bs, 32 HRs

2018 - .233/.266/.416, 22 2Bs, 21 HRs

 

A career OPS of .738 is pretty valuable in this league (for comparison Moustakas career OPS is .737)

 

I think they tender him just for the fact that they gave up three players to get him. You can't just let him walk.

 

Sure you can. I agreed with a lot of what you said until that last bit.

 

What we gave up should not factor into the decision at all. That part is done. We gave up what we gave up and we can't control it now. What we should evaluate is the amount we would have to pay him against the production we expect to receive.

 

Anything else is just noise, ego shouldn't control a move.

[tmwiese55]

Your Moose comparison made me remember this thing I noticed on the scoreboard during the playoff when they put OPS next to the players names. Braun by many here is talked about like this washed up overpaid bum who needs to be benched, etc. Keyword, overpaid. Whereas Moose is generally liked and many willing to pay up 15 mill for him. Note, of course I have no idea if same folks are saying both things. Just general vibes here. Braun's OPS this year was 782 and Moose was 774. They were basically tied last year too. I also know that Moose is healthier and plays 3B, just found it interesting when I noticed it on the board.

[adambr2]

Your Moose comparison made me remember this thing I noticed on the scoreboard during the playoff when they put OPS next to the players names. Braun by many here is talked about like this washed up overpaid bum who needs to be benched, etc. Keyword, overpaid. Whereas Moose is generally liked and many willing to pay up 15 mill for him. Note, of course I have no idea if same folks are saying both things. Just general vibes here. Braun's OPS this year was 782 and Moose was 774. They were basically tied last year too. I also know that Moose is healthier and plays 3B, just found it interesting when I noticed it on the board.

 

Yeah, said this on another thread but Moose seems to be pretty overrated here. Not a great hit tool, not fast, doesn't get on base much. Good power tool but certainly not off the charts.

 

We took him because he was available, didn't add much to the payroll and we felt Phillips and Lopez were expendable. He was a luxury add.

 

Unless someone wants to give us a king's ransom for Travis Shaw I'd leave it at that.

[MrTPlush]

I put a more detailed post in the rumors section, but I don't think it makes any sense to bring back Schoop or Moustakas. Neither is what we need and neither is cheap. If we want to spend money we can get a player that matches what we need (RHB good against LHP) with it in FA without much difficulty.

 

If either comes back it is because they don't want to hand out a multiyear deal and instead want to roll the dice on these guys.

[bjkrautk]

If either comes back it is because they don't want to hand out a multiyear deal and instead want to roll the dice on these guys.

 

With both of these guys, Schoop especially, the Hiura factor has to be considered. Barring injury or struggles at AAA, he'll be up at some point in 2019. If you're a free agent with options, why would you come to a team where you have a real chance to be benched by mid-season? Conversely, is the player who's willing to sign with Milwaukee knowing their top prospect is on the horizon at the same position likely to be better than your former All-Star?

 

Given Shaw's positional flexibility, I think there's a decent chance the Brewers will try to hold on to one of Schoop / Moose. Signing a stopgap to a multi-year deal would actually end up being more expensive than an additional 1-year for either player.

[coolhandluke121]

Your Moose comparison made me remember this thing I noticed on the scoreboard during the playoff when they put OPS next to the players names. Braun by many here is talked about like this washed up overpaid bum who needs to be benched, etc. Keyword, overpaid. Whereas Moose is generally liked and many willing to pay up 15 mill for him. Note, of course I have no idea if same folks are saying both things. Just general vibes here. Braun's OPS this year was 782 and Moose was 774. They were basically tied last year too. I also know that Moose is healthier and plays 3B, just found it interesting when I noticed it on the board.

 

Huge difference between KC and Milwaukee in OPS. Moustakas recently set a KC record with 38 hr's. Journeymen can do that in Miller Park. That doesn't completely invalidate your point, but the years of salary and the fact that outfielders are easier to replace should make it easy to see why someone can simultaneously want Moustakas and not want Braun. Moustakas also has been healthy.

[coolhandluke121]

If they're going to make decisions based on a player's one career year, perhaps they should also bring back Sogard to see if he can re-live his .393 OBP magic.

 

If it was based on career years only, Schoop could make $25m next season and it would still be an easy choice to keep him. Sogard was terrible his whole career and then had one good year. Schoop has had multiple seasons to justify keeping him. The problem is that his most recent one was so bad, but he just turned 27 and his only other bad year was at 22.

 

Really it's the people saying there's no way they should keep him who are basing everything on one year.

[Thurston Fluff]

If either comes back it is because they don't want to hand out a multiyear deal and instead want to roll the dice on these guys.

 

With both of these guys, Schoop especially, the Hiura factor has to be considered. Barring injury or struggles at AAA, he'll be up at some point in 2019. If you're a free agent with options, why would you come to a team where you have a real chance to be benched by mid-season? Conversely, is the player who's willing to sign with Milwaukee knowing their top prospect is on the horizon at the same position likely to be better than your former All-Star?

 

Given Shaw's positional flexibility, I think there's a decent chance the Brewers will try to hold on to one of Schoop / Moose. Signing a stopgap to a multi-year deal would actually end up being more expensive than an additional 1-year for either player.

 

Bingo. Schoop brings as much as anyone willing to play the role the Brewers are offering. The other possibility is he starts to hit better and becomes trade bait next year. If we could get something out of him until either Hiura or Dubon, maybe both, are ready we could get something for him to boot.