2018 Green Bay Packers Season Thread: 6-9-1: Mike McCarthy Fired, Philbin Interim HC

[homer]

Curious what others think of this article:

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2801077-packers-put-aaron-rodgers-in-impossible-situation-and-he-keeps-delivering?utm_source=cnn.com&utm_campaign=editorial&utm_medium=referral

 

In particular:

Rodgers' ability to overcome nearly any situation is his greatest quality. He's never received enough help compared to other organizations that feature legitimate franchise quarterbacks.

 

Ben Roethlisberger could lean on Hines Ward, Antonio Brown, Heath Miller and Le'Veon Bell during different points in his career. Drew Brees has more weapons than nearly any quarterback in the league right now, including the league's best backfield. Tom Brady once set NFL records throwing to Randy Moss, and he's had the ultimate security blanket in tight end Rob Gronkowski for the last nine seasons.

 

Green Bay's future Hall of Fame signal-caller has never had the same luxury. It's only gotten worse over time.

 

Donald Driver and Greg Jennings were a nice duo at the start of Rodgers' career, and Jordy Nelson developed into his favorite target over the years, but Green Bay's utter lack of investment around the quarterback is startling.

 

Jordy Nelson

James Jones

Greg Jennings

Randall Cobb

Davante Adams

 

All very good receivers. NFL HOF? Probably not but all had 1000 yard seasons (well Adams was @997 but he's very capable of that). Not to mention JerMichael Finley who would have been a top 10 tight end before the injury. I don't disagree that they've been bad about turning over the receivers recently but on the whole I think his options have been pretty good.

[pacopete4]

Compared to Favre, Rodgers has had way better options around him over the course of his career.

[jerichoholicninja]

The guys Rodgers has thrown to have been very good, but no one great. Big Ben, Brady, Brees all had much better WR's and all have had a solid running game at some point. Lacy had one good year, Starks put together a string a good games to win a super bowl, and maybe Rogers was QB when Ryan Grant was around, I don't remember. Otherwise there has been zero ground game for Rodgers to work with.

[pacopete4]

Can’t have a ground game if you never run the ball.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Can’t have a ground game if you never run the ball.

 

Exactly. The lack of use of Aaron Jones this year, and especially last night, was horrible. He is electric with the ball in his hands. I don't care if he isn't as good as Williams at blitz pickup. If you have a running threat, the defense isn't going to be blitzing the heck out of you.

[homer]

Can’t have a ground game if you never run the ball.

 

Exactly. The lack of use of Aaron Jones this year, and especially last night, was horrible. He is electric with the ball in his hands. I don't care if he isn't as good as Williams at blitz pickup. If you have a running threat, the defense isn't going to be blitzing the heck out of you.

 

Normally Rodgers destroys blitzes. He must really not have a connection with those rookies. I think some of it is the offense though. Too much freelancing.

[pacopete4]

People are so stuck on Jones. Yeah he’s a good back but it’s more than just his use, it’s a commitment from MM and AR. Williams and Montgomery are fine back as well. Run the damn ball.

[Baldkin]

Compared to Favre, Rodgers has had way better options around him over the course of his career.

 

Favre is the only guy who had a HoF level WR on his team. Freeman, Brooks, Driver, Sharpe, Javon Walker, Chmura, Ahmann Green.

 

I mean, nostalgia is what it is, but I'd take that group over Jordy, Jennings, Driver, Cobb, Adams, Finley(?) and... who at RB? I mean, I have no idea.

[superfly]

Compared to Favre, Rodgers has had way better options around him over the course of his career.

 

Favre is the only guy who had a HoF level WR on his team. Freeman, Brooks, Driver, Sharpe, Javon Walker, Chmura, Ahmann Green.

 

I mean, nostalgia is what it is, but I'd take that group over Jordy, Jennings, Driver, Cobb, Adams, Finley(?) and... who at RB? I mean, I have no idea.

 

Josh Gordon............................

[BillScottCanRake]

It sure would help if Aarron were playing better. In particular, getting the ball out on time and accurately.

 

I know he hasn't been practicing and I know Cobb and Allison haven't played for a couple of weeks, but he's missed a bunch of easy throws he normally makes. And probably worse he has not pulled the trigger on some throws that could have been big plays. There was on play on Monday where he move Montgomery to the slot to go to a 5 wide look, and Montgomery beat the linebacker badly at the LOS. Rodgers had an easy throw to Montgomery running a slant which wouldhave probably been at a least 30 yard gain, but instead he doesn't make that throw and ends up taking a sack. This isn't an isolated thing; outside of the second half of the game against the Bears he has been very ordinary most of the time.

 

Don't get me wrong, I love Rodgers and wouldn't trade him for anyone right now, but guys are open, and they are open on time. He has got to be better getting the ball out on time and accuarately and let the big plays happen more organically instead of trying to force them, which is what he appears to be doing a bit. If Rodgers can get back to getting the ball to the open guy on time and the become more committed to running the ball this offense can be just as good as it was in2014 or the "run the table" offense. Both of those offenses where good enough to get to or win a Super Bowl.

 

Yes, I'd love for them to upgrade the WR position, but they have enough there now to win if they get good QB play.

[homer]

Patrick Peterson wants to be traded. Yes, please.

[pacopete4]

Patrick Peterson wants to be traded. Yes, please.

 

Chandler Jones would be fun.

[nodakfan17]

I wonder if there’s anything in the Raiders fire sale that could help the Packers? I’m not advocating for any particular player or demanding they make a move, but if there’s good value to be had for a late round pick, I’d like to see them make that move.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

I wonder if there’s anything in the Raiders fire sale that could help the Packers? I’m not advocating for any particular player or demanding they make a move, but if there’s good value to be had for a late round pick, I’d like to see them make that move.

 

I might think about throwing a low-round pick at them for Bruce Irvin or Tahir Whitehead. They have a couple solid guards, but they are both pretty highly paid.

[nodakfan17]

This article suggests HHCD is on the trading block, citing a ‘reliable source.’

 

They’d likely get a 3rd or 4th round compensatory selection when he leaves in free agency after this season. Who would give up more than that to rent HHCD? Not to mention, the Packers sort of need him.

 

https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/2018/10/28/18034564/ha-ha-clinton-dix-on-the-block-tramon-josh-jones-breeland-brice-whitehead-greene

[PeaveyFury]

Yeah, that's an odd story. As noted at the bottom, you'd probably think the Packers were more in the market to acquire a safety, rather than giving up HaHa, who has played much better this year after a mediocre 2017.

[adambr2]

More news on Monty today. After reading this, reinforces even more that they should cut him.

 

Aaron was hot," said one Packers coach. "And he had a right to be. He yelled, 'Take a (expletive) knee!' He was very, very mad."

 

In the eyes of many of Rodgers' teammates, his ire was justifiable. According to more than a half-dozen Packers players and coaches who witnessed it, Montgomery had thrown a tantrum of his own on Green Bay's previous offensive series, becoming noticeably enraged on the sideline after being removed from the game. At least one player believed there was carryover from that incident to Montgomery's decision to disregard his coaches' instruction and return the kickoff.

 

"They took him out (the previous drive) for a play and he slammed his helmet and threw a fit," one Packers player said. "Then (before the kickoff) they told him to take a knee, and he ran it out anyway. You know what that was? That was him saying, 'I'm gonna do me.' It's a (expletive) joke.

 

"I mean, what the (expletive) are you doing? We've got Aaron Rodgers, the best I've ever seen, and you're gonna take that risk? I mean, it's '12'! All you gotta do is give him the ball, and you know what's gonna happen."

 

#MichaelSilver #NFL

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

More news on Monty today. After reading this, reinforces even more that they should cut him.

 

Aaron was hot," said one Packers coach. "And he had a right to be. He yelled, 'Take a (expletive) knee!' He was very, very mad."

 

In the eyes of many of Rodgers' teammates, his ire was justifiable. According to more than a half-dozen Packers players and coaches who witnessed it, Montgomery had thrown a tantrum of his own on Green Bay's previous offensive series, becoming noticeably enraged on the sideline after being removed from the game. At least one player believed there was carryover from that incident to Montgomery's decision to disregard his coaches' instruction and return the kickoff.

 

"They took him out (the previous drive) for a play and he slammed his helmet and threw a fit," one Packers player said. "Then (before the kickoff) they told him to take a knee, and he ran it out anyway. You know what that was? That was him saying, 'I'm gonna do me.' It's a (expletive) joke.

 

"I mean, what the (expletive) are you doing? We've got Aaron Rodgers, the best I've ever seen, and you're gonna take that risk? I mean, it's '12'! All you gotta do is give him the ball, and you know what's gonna happen."

 

#MichaelSilver #NFL

 

That is pretty damning. I think if he were a more important player on the team, Montgomery would be safe. But he's a 3rd string halfback who has failed to capitalize on the promise he showed his first two seasons both as a WR and as a RB. McCarthy knows that if he doesn't come down on someone who basically showed insubordination, it's going to make him look weak, and he'll lose the locker room even more. Because of that, I think Montgomery is gone today.

[abqbrewer]

I can deal with players making mistakes (I'm not perfect at my job), but if its true that he brought the ball out bc he was angry there is NO excuse. He needs to be gone immediately.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

I don't blame him. What he did is selfish and he should be cut, but this is their livelihood and the Packers, other than keeping him on the payroll all this time, really stunted his career. First taking a WR and forcing him into the RB spot, he does it 100% loyally, then through injuries and offensive sputtering basically sees himself carved out of the offense. That all came to a boil yesterday when he is taken off the field and then tries to do what most athletes do at one point or another - "make something happen."

 

I'm sure at some point Ty had a case of "everything I've done for this team and this is how they treat me." Again, what he did wasn't right and he is probably out the door, but I empathize with what he did. Wanted to prove he can "make a play." Just another example of a player completely mismanaged by McCarthy, Thompson, or whoever is responsible for the dumb positional musical chairs they had going on with him. He has been totally jerked around by the Packers.

 

Even prior to this it will be slim picking for him finding a new job. Nobody knows what kind of WR he is and nobody took him seriously as a RB.

[PeaveyFury]

I don't blame him. What he did is selfish and he should be cut, but this is their livelihood and the Packers, other than keeping him on the payroll all this time, really stunted his career.

I'm sure at some point Ty had a case of "everything I've done for this team and this is how they treat me." Again, what he did wasn't right and he is probably out the door, but I empathize with what he did. Wanted to prove he can "make a play." Just another example of a player completely mismanaged by McCarthy, Thompson, or whoever is responsible for the dumb positional musical chairs they had going on with him. He has been totally jerked around by the Packers.

 

 

I think this is a pretty big conclusion to jump to. Isn't it at least PLAUSIBLE that they saw enough of him as a WR to feel that he wasn't a player that would stick there long-tem? They certainly had more of an opportunity to evaluate him there than you as a fan have. Perhaps they felt that the H-back/slash-type role was his ceiling with the team. I don't consider that 'jerked around.' Is it possible that they did him a disservice? Sure. It is more likely that they felt that the shift was in his best interest? Seems more probable than not to me.

 

They've been short on WR for basically two seasons now and don't play him there. Which seems a clear indicator that they don't feel he's an asset there.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

My only point is that a lot of players would have been a lot less willing to change positions than Monty was, especially from WR to one where the average career is 2-3 seasons and the average salaries less. Most pro athletes would have put up a way bigger stink about that. And I think it is funny how fans hold athletes to such a high professional standard. The ladies at my office go into a tizzy if you ask them to color code stuff differently, I can't imagine telling a pro athlete you want him to change positions, much less in GB where you will probably get 6 carries a game.

 

I think he was fine at WR, but when they went through that experiment they were so loaded there it was unlikely he would play. It was McCarthy's genius way of getting his "best athletes" on the field. Throughout the first offseason after he switched to RB, numerous scouts thought it was a joke and made comments that he was never going to be a RB. Then the Packers go out and get a bunch of RBs, which made it all the stranger. What was aggravating though, is that they almost never seemed to utilize packages that would create those matchups. You basically never saw the Bennett/Kendricks 2TE mistmatches everyone was dreaming of last year (before he was hurt), and you rarely saw them spread Montgomery out to get him matched up with LBs and etc. He seemed so hell bent on making him into this power runner he isn't.

 

If I were him, I'd have wished they just cut me so I could play WR somewhere else. It wouldn't be the first time the Packers have made guys play out of position. See Hyde, Micah; Randall, Demarious, and numerous DL/OLB.

 

Lots of weird roster construction the past few seasons. TT/MM or whoever was calling shots seemed to have this obsession with drafting "athletes" and making them play positions they aren't used to.

[craigharmann]

Is Montgomery gone yet?

[FVBrewerFan]

My only point is that a lot of players would have been a lot less willing to change positions than Monty was, especially from WR to one where the average career is 2-3 seasons and the average salaries less. Most pro athletes would have put up a way bigger stink about that. And I think it is funny how fans hold athletes to such a high professional standard. The ladies at my office go into a tizzy if you ask them to color code stuff differently, I can't imagine telling a pro athlete you want him to change positions, much less in GB where you will probably get 6 carries a game.

 

I think he was fine at WR, but when they went through that experiment they were so loaded there it was unlikely he would play. It was McCarthy's genius way of getting his "best athletes" on the field. Throughout the first offseason after he switched to RB, numerous scouts thought it was a joke and made comments that he was never going to be a RB. Then the Packers go out and get a bunch of RBs, which made it all the stranger. What was aggravating though, is that they almost never seemed to utilize packages that would create those matchups. You basically never saw the Bennett/Kendricks 2TE mistmatches everyone was dreaming of last year (before he was hurt), and you rarely saw them spread Montgomery out to get him matched up with LBs and etc. He seemed so hell bent on making him into this power runner he isn't.

 

If I were him, I'd have wished they just cut me so I could play WR somewhere else. It wouldn't be the first time the Packers have made guys play out of position. See Hyde, Micah; Randall, Demarious, and numerous DL/OLB.

 

Lots of weird roster construction the past few seasons. TT/MM or whoever was calling shots seemed to have this obsession with drafting "athletes" and making them play positions they aren't used to.

 

Doesn't matter, even if some of that is true. I have wanted MM gone probably longer than you have, but none of what you have written has anything to do with making a bone-headed play when the game is on the line.

 

Even if he didn't fumble, it was still a horrible decision- especially if he was specifically told to kneel down. So no, I don't have any empathy for him. In fact, these hybrid players are all the rage in the NFL today, so the Packers did him a favor. Problem is, he's just not explosive enough.

[tmwiese55]

My only point is that a lot of players would have been a lot less willing to change positions than Monty was, especially from WR to one where the average career is 2-3 seasons and the average salaries less. Most pro athletes would have put up a way bigger stink about that. And I think it is funny how fans hold athletes to such a high professional standard. The ladies at my office go into a tizzy if you ask them to color code stuff differently, I can't imagine telling a pro athlete you want him to change positions, much less in GB where you will probably get 6 carries a game.

 

I think he was fine at WR, but when they went through that experiment they were so loaded there it was unlikely he would play. It was McCarthy's genius way of getting his "best athletes" on the field. Throughout the first offseason after he switched to RB, numerous scouts thought it was a joke and made comments that he was never going to be a RB. Then the Packers go out and get a bunch of RBs, which made it all the stranger. What was aggravating though, is that they almost never seemed to utilize packages that would create those matchups. You basically never saw the Bennett/Kendricks 2TE mistmatches everyone was dreaming of last year (before he was hurt), and you rarely saw them spread Montgomery out to get him matched up with LBs and etc. He seemed so hell bent on making him into this power runner he isn't.

 

If I were him, I'd have wished they just cut me so I could play WR somewhere else. It wouldn't be the first time the Packers have made guys play out of position. See Hyde, Micah; Randall, Demarious, and numerous DL/OLB.

 

Lots of weird roster construction the past few seasons. TT/MM or whoever was calling shots seemed to have this obsession with drafting "athletes" and making them play positions they aren't used to.

 

He was very likely given that choice, switch or you're gong to be cut because you're not good enough at WR. I get how he could view it as jerked around or him thinking they were wrong about him at WR and is now mad about it. But one could just as easily argue that them changing his positions has kept him receiving an NFL paycheck for 2-3 years longer than otherwise. And again, he was likely given the choice and he chose to do it. Of course, that's speculation but it seems logical, I mean he's not a robot he can say No.