If the Brewers miss the playoffs....

[coolhandluke121]

He did get a quality mid rotation pitcher back from Segura at least.

 

He got a fluky 140 innings and then a #5 starter and he guaranteed the #5 starter's contract for no reason.

 

*ducks*

 

It's true. Chase was ridiculously lucky with his FB/HR rate last year. I think that contract probably helped his trade value slightly, but it's debatable.

[tmwiese55]

Yea I'm not trying to make Anderson out for more than he is. But even with his regression this year that we all figured was coming he's been generally fine, below 4 era all year pretty much. Contract is only through next year. I'm just saying he did get something of legit value back

[FVBrewerFan]

 

You entirely dismissed Sveum's response. Not sure why you keep asking questions, since you have clearly made up your mind. Bordering on trolling actually. Stearns and Counsel are horrible, no matter what anyone says. Kato would be proud.

 

Oh ya, thanks for the Kato joke bud.

 

 

You're welcome!

[OldSchoolSnapper]

It is too disingenuous. It almost always is in these conversations because we have no idea what avenues were explored to trade those guys. If he called up every team in baseball and that was all he could get, what choice does he have if he doesn't want a noodle-arm K-prone OF?

 

I don't personally lose any sleep over trading Khris Davis, but I, like Stearns, don't like those kinds of players anyway.

[bill hAll Star]

He did get a quality mid rotation pitcher back from Segura at least.

 

He got a fluky 140 innings and then a #5 starter and he guaranteed the #5 starter's contract for no reason.

 

*ducks*

 

You're correct, though I still think Anderson is probably worth his 2nd guaranteed year money next year. If nothing else, they can probably trade him for an equally iffy player at a different position.

[PeaveyFury]

Adam Lind could also be included if we've already seen the best of Freddy Peralta.

 

Come on, man. You can't say something like this and make much of the board discount the validity of your other points. Distortion works both ways- now you're expecting Peralta to be fodder from here? I'm somewhat convinced that there are people in this (and any, really) fanbase that would come away with criticisms of a season even if we won the World Series.

[PeaveyFury]

There was neither a monetary reason nor a production reason for trading Davis off.

 

This is only true if you put zero value on defense. His defense was so bad his last year in Milwaukee that it eroded nearly all of his offensive value. Despite Oakland's ability to use a DH, Davis has STILL played enough in the field to tally an impressive -1.3 defensive WAR this year after -2.1 last year. That's right, -1.3 WAR for the whopping 11 games he played the field this year so far. He's epically bad in the outfield.

[Brewer Fever]

It is too disingenuous. It almost always is in these conversations because we have no idea what avenues were explored to trade those guys.

 

Hammer meets nail on the head. We really never have full knowledge of anything that transpires. That's why all we can really do is add up the hits and misses of what the Brewers DO ACTUALLY DO. The minimum we can ask as fans is they be right more than they're wrong. And to take it one step further, our market size requires the "hits" to significantly outweigh the "misses". And Stearns and Co. are the first to admit that.

 

Let's make this real simple...

 

Who here thinks the Brewers should fire Stearns and take the chance on finding someone better?

 

My answer is: God help you, if you think the odds of finding someone better are high enough to take that risk.

 

And if turns out that every single member of this forum thinks Stearns is who we want making these decisions, then why the heck are there all these wasted keystrokes expecting perfection from a human being? Because that ain't ever happening.

 

I actually believe there are some here who think the Brewers should fire Stearns and get someone else. And I'm 100% sure there will be even more if the Brewers miss the playoffs. I think those people should be bold enough to go on record.

[bill hAll Star]

Stearns did jettison, Khris Davis, Will Smith, Scooter Gennett, He sold low on Jean Segura.

 

Martin Maldonado for little or no return.

Adam Lind could also be included if we've already seen the best of Freddy Peralta.

He also spun off the prospects he acquired in the Lucroy trade for a handful of veteran rentals.

[Brewer Fever]

I'm somewhat convinced that there are people in this (and any, really) fanbase that would come away with criticisms of a season even if we won the World Series.

 

I'm 100% convinced of this. It's really, really sad.

[FVBrewerFan]

I'm somewhat convinced that there are people in this (and any, really) fanbase that would come away with criticisms of a season even if we won the World Series.

 

I'm 100% convinced of this. It's really, really sad.

 

I guarantee someone would point out it took longer than it should have. Then again, when they win the WS I'll be half in the bag running naked down Wisc Ave with the ball and glove logo painted on my chest, so I won't be reading those comments.

[liveforoctober]

I'm somewhat convinced that there are people in this (and any, really) fanbase that would come away with criticisms of a season even if we won the World Series.

 

I'm 100% convinced of this. It's really, really sad.

 

If you were a Packers fan during the 2010 season ... this is absolutely confirmed. The hatred of Ted Thompson led many to actually have mixed feelings of the Super Bowl win because 1) TT would receive credit and 2) his leash would be extended.

 

The same would be true here albeit to a much lesser extent. If the Crew catches fire and goes the whole way this year ... there would be a trail of "we got really lucky and we still haven't put together a team for sustained success" jabber that would find its way here.

 

I'm not mad at those who are never satisfied, it is just foreign to me is all.

[YelichPosse]

Stearns did jettison, Khris Davis, Will Smith, Scooter Gennett, He sold low on Jean Segura.

 

Martin Maldonado for little or no return.

Adam Lind could also be included if we've already seen the best of Freddy Peralta.

He also spun off the prospects he acquired in the Lucroy trade for a handful of veteran rentals.

 

 

Thank you. I thought I was the only one who made faces when reading through that all.

 

For all the "mistakes" - remember at the time who those players were, what their stats told us at the time... and what we all thought of them at the time. Hindsight is 20/20.

 

He should be patted on the back for Chacin, Aguilar, Cain and Yelich moves, Shaw, Thames signing (even tho he K's a lot he's been exciting at a bargain price), things like that. Overall with the deck handed to him, he is doing well. Maybe not amazing. But sure not bad at all.

 

If we want to talk about CC's game or pen management - that may be another thing (I get annoyed with some things, but he does an ok job of mixing things up... I will not for the life of me understand what he is doing with Hader or when he actually uses him, but I digress...). But Stearns has done a bang up job overall.

 

Our job as crazy fans is tough however, especially as BREWERS fans... we have been through A LOT of bad things, and collapses. Dean Taylor.... Gary Sheffield.... guys like Chuckie Carr.... Ben McDonald and Jeffrey Hammonds signings.... That makes is more negative by nature. Can you blame us?

[danzig6767]

 

Segura is the worst of those moves IMO. He had already shown he could be a star in MKE and went through personal tragedy and lost himself. It wasn't really surprising that he caught on again and I thought they gave up too early, even at the time.

Segura had his career change for the better in the offseason after we traded him. In winter ball at the suggestion of former major-league outfielder Luis Mercedes, who also had worked with Robinson Cano and Edwin Encarnacion, he got Segura to change how he hit by lowering his hands a lot.

 

From that time on, Segura has gone from a guy who was awful for two straight years to one who has hit well ever since. He's said so himself.

 

Granted, blame certainly could be put on the Brewers coaching staff back then for also not getting Segura to try hitting like Luis Mercedes instructed, but that turned around Segura's career.

 

This type of stuff happens all around baseball where a hitter or pitcher leaves one organization and someone on the staff of the new team tweaks something with that player, leading to much better production.

[Jopal78]

Adam Lind could also be included if we've already seen the best of Freddy Peralta.

 

Come on, man. You can't say something like this and make much of the board discount the validity of your other points. Distortion works both ways- now you're expecting Peralta to be fodder from here? I'm somewhat convinced that there are people in this (and any, really) fanbase that would come away with criticisms of a season even if we won the World Series.

 

But you cannot have it both ways! If you absolve the GM for dumping good players like Segura, Davis and Gennett for nothing because he had no idea the players he was trading would turn out to be all-stars. You can’t give him a pass on Lind. He had an OPS of .820 his only year in Milwaukee, and solid career numbers. Unless clairvoyant, Stearns would not have known Lind’s career would fall apart after being traded.

 

In exchange for a quality hitter, he got three A ball pitchers for Lind. One of them, Missaki, hasn’t even suited up the organization or played since 2015 and after having Tommy John. Carlos Herrera is pitching out of the pen in A ball to the tune of a 5+ ERA. Which brings us to Peralta. He currently is 0 WAR (or -0.1), and has trouble consistently locating his pitches. Admittedly, he’s a young and could learn command. He could also very well be the next Taylor Jungmann. The fans of this team are so starved for quality young pitching we’re willing to anoint anyone as the answer after one or two good starts.

 

To bring this back around to topic. Stearns has done the best he could to build his team. And clearly it is more a finished project than a team waiting for the prospects to arrive. Unfortunately, the 2018 version likely doesn’t have enough starting pitching to keep them around in the race.

[Brewever]

This thread shows that many people like the Doug Melvin approach to running a small market baseball team. It made us feel like one of the 'big boys' because we made splashy free agent signings and traded for big names. The national media loves big names too and we repeatedly had high expectations. Planning for the future isn't any fun, gotta trade those prospects and go 'all in'. If something doesn't go right, it's definitely the fault of the coaching staff. Gotta keep that revolving door moving.

 

What do we have to show for that?

 

On the other hand, we have the Stearns approach where a roster of complete garbage was quickly turned into a winning team mostly by picking gems off of the garbage pile. Two rebuilding years turned into two of the most fun years of watching the Brewers in my lifetime. If you really think about it, it's incredible that this team continually puts pressure on the Cubs. They shouldn't be doing this.

 

Ok, so this might shock you.

 

U prefer Stearns over Melvin.

[Brewever]

[sarcasm][/sarcasm]

This thread shows that many people like the Doug Melvin approach to running a small market baseball team. It made us feel like one of the 'big boys' because we made splashy free agent signings and traded for big names. The national media loves big names too and we repeatedly had high expectations. Planning for the future isn't any fun, gotta trade those prospects and go 'all in'. If something doesn't go right, it's definitely the fault of the coaching staff. Gotta keep that revolving door moving.

 

What do we have to show for that?

 

On the other hand, we have the Stearns approach where a roster of complete garbage was quickly turned into a winning team mostly by picking gems off of the garbage pile. Two rebuilding years turned into two of the most fun years of watching the Brewers in my lifetime. If you really think about it, it's incredible that this team continually puts pressure on the Cubs. They shouldn't be doing this.

 

Ok, so this might shock you.

 

I prefer Stearns over Melvin.

 

I never said I didn't like the guy, just that I wasn't has high in him.

 

Stearns will earn fans respect at different rates. Some were happy with him right away, others may have that respect next year.

[Brewever]

This thread serves to expose those who in no way expected the Brewers to contend this soon, (who in the event the Brewers now miss the playoffs) will turn around and blame the man responsible for contending this soon.

 

There are many not so kind names for people like that. I'll use a safe one - illogical. But oh, the temptation is definitely there to use much harsher terms.

 

 

I'm confused how that would tempt to to use a naughty word..is it that serious to you?

[Brewever]

 

The contributions of Aguilar, Jeffress, Miley, Pina's handling of the staff and to a lesser extent Saladino/Jennings have vastly outweighed the deficit brought about by Sogard, Zagurski, Miller, Kratz, etc and I don't know that it is really close.

 

 

I would not argue that those havent vastly outweighed the bad signings.

 

But we did miss the playoffs by 1 game. We all knew sogard didn't have it waaaaay before he eventually stopped playing.

[Brewever]

If folks don't think the Brewers have been pulling trash heap players and no names players until Stearns they've been watching an entirely different team than me the last 25 years.

 

Of course Stearns hasn't been perfect and missed on some moves, but for the most part his eye has been very sharp as evidenced by a team of nobodies massively overachieving this year. Add in that he was smart enough to know that was fluky so he added two legit top tier players in Cain/Yelich I just don't see how we do not trust this guy at this point to keep this team competing for the next 5 years at least

 

Again, I think this is exactly their plan. A consistently above .500 team for several years and hope to get lucky and or pick their spots to 'go for it'. Some years you're going to come up a bit short which might happen this year.

 

 

I said It seems like Stearns has done it more. Not at all.

 

Don't forget about Chacin. Based on the contract and position maybe his best off-season signing. Well ok its right up there.

[Brewever]

Stearns did jettison, Khris Davis, Will Smith, Scooter Gennett, He sold low on Jean Segura.

 

Martin Maldonado for little or no return.

Adam Lind could also be included if we've already seen the best of Freddy Peralta.

He also spun off the prospects he acquired in the Lucroy trade for a handful of veteran rentals.

 

 

Thank you. I thought I was the only one who made faces when reading through that all.

 

For all the "mistakes" - remember at the time who those players were, what their stats told us at the time... and what we all thought of them at the time. Hindsight is 20/20.

 

He should be patted on the back for Chacin, Aguilar, Cain and Yelich moves, Shaw, Thames signing (even tho he K's a lot he's been exciting at a bargain price), things like that. Overall with the deck handed to him, he is doing well. Maybe not amazing. But sure not bad at all.

 

If we want to talk about CC's game or pen management - that may be another thing (I get annoyed with some things, but he does an ok job of mixing things up... I will not for the life of me understand what he is doing with Hader or when he actually uses him, but I digress...). But Stearns has done a bang up job overall.

 

Our job as crazy fans is tough however, especially as BREWERS fans... we have been through A LOT of bad things, and collapses. Dean Taylor.... Gary Sheffield.... guys like Chuckie Carr.... Ben McDonald and Jeffrey Hammonds signings.... That makes is more negative by nature. Can you blame us?

 

 

No friend, Nobody can blames us.

 

We have been through heck

[Brewever]

 

You entirely dismissed Sveum's response. Not sure why you keep asking questions, since you have clearly made up your mind. Bordering on trolling actually. Stearns and Counsel are horrible, no matter what anyone says. Kato would be proud.

 

Oh ya, thanks for the Kato joke bud.

 

 

You're welcome!

 

Yes!!!!!! Finally, I get that condescending know it all.

 

Trolling? Lol, how do you know my mind is made up? If it is why do I keep asking questions..hmmmmmm. Does that make any sense? Are you reverse trolling?

 

Also, When did I say Stearns was horrible? Oh, i didnt. I said i wasnt as high on him as others are. You shouldnt put words in peoples mouths or pretend you can read minds.

 

My questions didn't seem to bother Sveum(Mod), the guy who initially i had the back and forth with, yet it triggered you?

 

Oh ya, thanks for the Kato joke bud.

 

Maybe ya seen my opening sentence to this topic and you got a problem with that, seems like alot of angst coming outta nowhere, wouldn't shock me if you got those issues

 

Let's keep that whole context of my first response together. I understand you wanting to steer clear and make a joke out of it. It's too hard to own it, when you are wrong nowadays.

[clancyphile]

1. I would say the team is ahead of schedule on the rebuild - thanks to some EXTREMELY good acquisitions prior to 2017 (Thames and Shaw in particular) and some big help (Suter emerged as a solid rotation piece from a 31st-round pick prior to needing a Tommy John) that wasn't exactly expected.

 

2. My sense is that the schedule is/was 2020.

 

3. No. Could happen in 2019 if we have a bad collapse. Injuries to Davies/Suter/Anderson warrant a mulligan.

 

4. He could go this year, with the slumps Villar, Arcia, and Santana have suffered this year.

[Brewever]

Are we trying to be Houston, St Louis, Giants,...which sounds like the time we are emulating most? Or want to be..

 

I ask questions when I don't know the answer or just like hearing some of your guys opinions, some of you are really smart and no your stuff, just wish I could avoid those that think they are and do.

[tmwiese55]

We're trying to be STL as much as possible. That model fits us way better as a small market.