Joakim Soria to the Brewers, Medeiros and Perez (not Hernan) to White Sox

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Oh no, our farm system is worse but our big league team is better. Shoot.

 

In no way does trading Kodi mortgage the future of the club. Another first round bust, yes, but he is a high risk middle reliever with a funky delivery whose fastball velocity has dipped in recent years and has command issues. Yes he has a good slider but so do hundreds of other guys. Man, so many prospect huggers out there.

 

I'd argue that today's deal makes him the exact opposite of a bust. Picking him ultimately made the MLB team better, which is all you want out of a draft pick.

 

Now, if you want to see a bust, go look at Clint Coulter's numbers.

[djd1228]

So Gatewood is the only one left of those top 3 in '14. I think grabbing "athletes" in that draft turned out to be a very good call. Kodi was the # 12 pick but if i remember right got underslotted pretty significantly so we could grab Jacob and Monte. Overall netted us 1.5 years of an "elite" reliever (i'd classify his '18 numbers as elite) and a significant piece to the Yelich trade. I think Jake probably has about similar value as Kodi but we'll see I guess.

[djd1228]

So Gatewood is the only one left of those top 3 in '14. I think grabbing "athletes" in that draft turned out to be a very good call. Kodi was the # 12 pick but if i remember right got underslotted pretty significantly so we could grab Jacob and Monte. Overall netted us 1.5 years of an "elite" reliever (i'd classify his '18 numbers as elite) and a significant piece to the Yelich trade. I think Jake probably has about similar value as Kodi but we'll see I guess.

[SRB]

1-year/$10 million is not "very expensive" for a backend RP these days

 

We gave almost half that to Boone Logan, and elite RP generally get paid by demanding multi-year deals (when RP are very volatile)

 

They should absolutely pick up Soria's option next year

[Point Beer Is Best]

This is a disappointing end to the Brewers career of a former 1st round pick.

 

Boy, if I had a nickle for every time I heard that...

[Roderick]

As long as we add an impact bat and league average starter this makes sense. Otherwise, improvIng your Best area and ignoring especially the lineup makes no sense.

 

Even though Soria is controlled for next season, I agree that this just means more is coming.

 

But, I don't think it necessarily has to be a starter (at least from outside the organization). But there has to be a bat coming, because we need a lead for these relievers to protect.

[bill hAll Star]

If losing Medieros for a light-out reliever makes you mad, I imagine the next few days are gonna suck for you.

 

Soria is not a "lights out" reliever. He's a 34 year old having a good season, coming off decent but not great seasons in 2016 and 2017.

 

This is a disappointing end to the Brewers career of a former 1st round pick (and 12th overall).

 

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/news/article/41572/rubbing-mud-joakim-soria-slider-monster/

[MilwaukeeBeers]

Yikes saw a future as a high leverage reliever for Kodi. Thats another botched first rounder.

 

How in the world is that a botched first rounder? He had tons of talent, was putting it together this year, and they leveraged that into a reliever with a ton of value and future control. I don't know if you understand how this works.

Eric Arnett, Jed Bradley, Clint Coulter, Victor Roache... yes I consider Medieros to be another botched first by the Seid era. Considering we were picking 12 a high leverage reliever is not great. I’m glad we were able to get value out of him.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Medeiros still needs 1+ years of development before he would have been an option for a MLB role - based on the bullpen shuttle and how DS appears to manage the 40 man roster, there are very limited spots on it for minor league arms that can't contribute in Milwaukee next season.

 

Before this trade, the Brewers had 21 pitchers on the 40 man roster. Of that list, I came up with the following guys who would potentially (potentially = I wouldn't have a heart attack if Medeiros had replaced them and the Brewers saw them leave) be considered expendable to make room for new additions:

 

Asher

Barnes

Diplan

Houser

Jennings

Lopez

Miley

Wilkerson

 

Jimmy Nelson will presumable be off the 60 day DL, so he automatically takes one of those guys' 40 man spots. Let's assume Miley or Wilkerson goes when Nelson comes back. Then you start sacrificing MLB contibutors or arms that still may profile as starters off the 40 man to make room for Medeiros - not to mention arms like Ortiz, Ponce, Supak, Uhen, Bickford, Kirby, and Devin Williams are in the same boat as Medeiros would have been in terms of potential pitchers at Rule 5 risk.

 

I think most organizations like to split their 40-man roughly down the middle between pitchers and position players - Medeiros was probably among the 3-4 arms in the system that the Brewers would have needed to choose to give 1, at most 2 40 man roster spots to in order to protect them from getting picked up and stashed on a rebuilding team's bullpen. Using Kodi as an asset to get 1.5 seasons of an established quality MLB reliever is dealing from a position of depth while the organization still has control over that value.

[bork]

 

Sorry if this is just wrong, but isn't Burnes going to hit innings limits too? I thought that was part of the BP move and then he gets ready to move to the rotation next year.

 

No, he's at 85 and threw 145 last year. One of the reasons the move to the bullpen was puzzling.

[jonescm128]

Oh no, our farm system is worse but our big league team is better. Shoot.

 

In no way does trading Kodi mortgage the future of the club. Another first round bust, yes, but he is a high risk middle reliever with a funky delivery whose fastball velocity has dipped in recent years and has command issues. Yes he has a good slider but so do hundreds of other guys. Man, so many prospect huggers out there.

 

I'd argue that today's deal makes him the exact opposite of a bust. Picking him ultimately made the MLB team better, which is all you want out of a draft pick.

 

Now, if you want to see a bust, go look at Clint Coulter's numbers.

 

Bust was probably the wrong word to use. I mean just another first round guy that doesn't make it (with the Brewers).

[lcbj68c]

Dumb. Of all the assets you could acquire for Medeiros, they choose another, largely unneeded, bullpen piece. Burnes better be shifting to the rotation immediately.

[SRB]

If losing Medieros for a light-out reliever makes you mad, I imagine the next few days are gonna suck for you.

 

Soria is not a "lights out" reliever. He's a 34 year old having a good season, coming off decent but not great seasons in 2016 and 2017.

 

This is a disappointing end to the Brewers career of a former 1st round pick (and 12th overall).

 

Soria was arguably the best closer in baseball at his peak with the Royals, and across the last two seasons the ONLY relievers (40+ IP) with a better FIP are Roberto Osuna, Craig Kimbrel, and Kenley Jansen.

[jonescm128]

Dumb. Of all the assets you could acquire for Medeiros, they choose another, largely unneeded, bullpen piece. Burnes better be shifting to the rotation immediately.

 

Why do people not see the value of a lock-down bullpen? This just means we wouldn't be forced to use a Jacob Barnes in a tie game or down by one.

[homer]

Dumb. Of all the assets you could acquire for Medeiros, they choose another, largely unneeded, bullpen piece. Burnes better be shifting to the rotation immediately.

 

Why do people not see the value of a lock-down bullpen?

 

Particularly on a team with starters that have trouble getting past the 5th or 6th inning.

[jonescm128]

If losing Medieros for a light-out reliever makes you mad, I imagine the next few days are gonna suck for you.

 

Soria is not a "lights out" reliever. He's a 34 year old having a good season, coming off decent but not great seasons in 2016 and 2017.

 

This is a disappointing end to the Brewers career of a former 1st round pick (and 12th overall).

 

Soria was arguably the best closer in baseball at his peak with the Royals, and across the last two seasons the ONLY relievers (40+ IP) with a better FIP are Roberto Osuna, Craig Kimbrel, and Kenley Jansen.

 

He changed his release point and has thrown the slider more.

 

"In 23 appearances since he discovered that new delivery, Soria is now up to 22 1/3 innings, 89 batters faced, 29 strikeouts, and a 0.81 ERA. He’s posting the best cFIP he’s had since he was an elite closer in 2009, and his current DRA- would be his best ever. Indeed, at age 34, Soria is pitching like his 24-year-old self, and has been one of the dozen best relievers in baseball."

[MoreTrife]

As long as we add an impact bat and league average starter this makes sense. Otherwise, improvIng your Best area and ignoring especially the lineup makes no sense.

 

100%. I'm much more concerned lately with our offense and starters. Fine with the deal but we need a bat. Sick of stagnate offense.

[markedman5]

From McCalvey

 

Fixing a typo: I asked David Stearns if he cared to shoot down this morning’s Zack Wheeler chatter. “I’ll let all of that be,” he said. “It’s fun for everyone.”

[brooks_quichenick]

I know they mentioned Burnes was going to come out of the bullpen the rest of the year but I wonder if this acquisition changes anything in that regard.

 

Thought the same thing. Maybe send him back to AAA to get stretched out

 

Sorry if this is just wrong, but isn't Burnes going to hit innings limits too? I thought that was part of the BP move and then he gets ready to move to the rotation next year.

 

He's only pitched 85.2 innings this season, threw 145.2 last season, so he's still got some room to work with

[jonescm128]

If losing Medieros for a light-out reliever makes you mad, I imagine the next few days are gonna suck for you.

 

Soria is not a "lights out" reliever. He's a 34 year old having a good season, coming off decent but not great seasons in 2016 and 2017.

 

This is a disappointing end to the Brewers career of a former 1st round pick (and 12th overall).

 

 

He has been elite since he altered his delivery and begun throwing the slider more. From BP:

 

"In 23 appearances since he discovered that new delivery, Soria is now up to 22 1/3 innings, 89 batters faced, 29 strikeouts, and a 0.81 ERA. He’s posting the best cFIP he’s had since he was an elite closer in 2009, and his current DRA- would be his best ever. Indeed, at age 34, Soria is pitching like his 24-year-old self, and has been one of the dozen best relievers in baseball."

[brewmann04]

hey maybe now the starters can go two innings and then had it over to the bullpen to finish out the game.,

[OnaBadger58]

Another reminder how the Brewers struggle to turn first round draft picks into star players.

 

I'm glad they could flip Kodi for Soria. I just wish they would get more out of those high picks.

 

A little premature to say that given he is 22 in AA w/ a 3.14 era and more strikeouts than innings pitched. The talent is obviously there. He was also an under slot first round pick which aloud the Brewers to sign both Gatewood and Monte Harrison. Given the failure rates in the MLB draft, I would say that was a pretty decent draft.

[anglotiger]

It's hard (for me) to find fault with this trade.

 

A quick glance at Baseball reference shows that Soria has a career ERA of 2.84, has a good K/BB ratio, doesn't give up a ton of home runs and has been outstanding this season. Add in that he's likely not "just a rental" (with the team option and the fact that the Sox are sending cash along with him) and that makes him an even more appealing acquisition.

 

As for the cost, well, Madeiros is a good (long-term) acquisition for the Sox but the Brewers have several young starters ranked ahead of him (in the minors as well as already at the MLB level) so, while the cost isn't cheap, they could afford to take the chance and part with him.

 

My apologies if anyone has already speculated this, but I was talking this over with a friend at work and the thought occurred to me - what if the person he's actually going to replace in the bullpen is actually Corbin Burnes? It seems highly likely that the price for a starting pitcher on the trade market is extremely high, perhaps higher than Stearns is willing to pay, and Counsell stated this week that Burnes will enter Spring Training next year as a starter. Is it possible that Burnes will be given a shot in the rotation now, and remaining trade chips used on a bat? I wouldn't mind seeing that, if you can't get a good starter for a reasonable price...

[MilwaukeeBeers]

From McCalvey

 

Fixing a typo: I asked David Stearns if he cared to shoot down this morning’s Zack Wheeler chatter. “I’ll let all of that be,” he said. “It’s fun for everyone.”

Heyman just tweeted the Mets think they can contend next year, so rival executives think they won’t deal him... Hahahahahahahahahaha that organization is the worst in pro sports.

[adambr2]

So Gatewood is the only one left of those top 3 in '14. I think grabbing "athletes" in that draft turned out to be a very good call. Kodi was the # 12 pick but if i remember right got underslotted pretty significantly so we could grab Jacob and Monte. Overall netted us 1.5 years of an "elite" reliever (i'd classify his '18 numbers as elite) and a significant piece to the Yelich trade. I think Jake probably has about similar value as Kodi but we'll see I guess.

 

Ehh. Drafting Trea Turner would have been a fine move too.