What should be DS targets

[brewmann04]

I was just curious what might some of the possible trade targets for our GM?

[MrTPlush]

Starting pitching is the biggest need in my opinion, followed by SS/2B (likely a super utility guy), C (likely backup), and then relief pitching (good value snag more).

[JohnBriggs12]

Cole Hamels or J.A. Happ are the logical targets. If I had to bet, one of those two is a Brewer by August 1st unless Miley returns and is in really good form leading up to the deadline. The focus has to be on having a rotation capable of competing in the postseason.

[adambr2]

I feel like we worry about our starting pitching a lot more than the Brewers do.

[wallus]

Why do we need starting pitching? Nelson will be returning and we have Burnes and Peralta not far away.

[mrn1ceguy]

I feel like we worry about our starting pitching a lot more than the Brewers do.

 

Agreed, and what do we do with the former Starting Pitcher we upgrade? By the end of July we are looking at Nelson, Anderson, Davies, Chacin and Guerra. Are we going to option any of Nelson, Anderson, Davies or Guerra? Are we going to release/BP Chacin? Even if one of those 5 get injured and put on the DL for a while, we are looking at Suter/Woodruff/Peralta/Burns as the 5th starter. Would it be worth spending the prospects to upgrade at that point?

 

Barring major injuries to multiple players leaving us with a late July set of Davies, Chacin, Guerra, Suter & Woodruff; I highly doubt we target a starter.

 

Moving Pina to backup C (Realmuto/Perez), getting a SS rental so we can release Sogard, move Saladino to backup IF and give Arcia more time (Machado) or starting clean with 2B (Merryweather?) are the only options I see being worthwhile (barring future injury).

[splitterpfj]

We're all going to keep talking about starting pitching, and I think that's warranted. The Brewers don't have terrible starters, but I wouldn't call their rotation a, "strength", either.

 

Perhaps the Brewers will target pitchers with multiple years of control at the deadline, if they do, that opens up quite a few names to at least consider, but if they go with rentals, here are some ideas:

 

Bartolo Colon (I can't resist putting the big fella on the list)

Patrick Corbin

JA Happ

 

If the Brewers go beyond just this season, I'm sure you'll hear Cole Hamels as a possibility, but I think that's a longshot. Hamels has a team option for next year at 20 million, with a 6 million dollar buyout. Beyond what he's making this year, the two teams would have to navigate through that, too. It's not impossible, but I'll bet against it.

 

If the Brewers focus on a longer time frame, Baltimore controls Kevin Gausman through 2020, and Dylan Bundy though 2021 - both guys have been erratic in their careers, but there's plenty of talent there, for sure. Dealing with the Orioles can be a pain in the butt, and they may decide to keep those guys, but I thought they were worth mentioning as possibilities.

 

Chris Archer has had one bad start in his last five - you know the rumors are coming if he keeps that up.

[adambr2]

I think people still beating the starting pitching drum are going to remain disappointed. They've got Jimmy coming back, Guerra has done a nice job, and Chase, Chacin and Davies aren't going anywhere. Jimmy is going to be your big deadline acquisition.

 

This is even assuming Peralta and Burnes don't crack the rotation at some point.

 

Our rotation is very average-ish, but most of the names being thrown out are just more of that same. Obviously if there's a Sale or Kershaw type being thrown around at the deadline, they'd be crazy not to go for it, but that's not happening.

 

I think people worry too much about whether this rotation is good enough to compete in the playoffs. This is a bullpen oriented staff and that would continue in the playoffs. These 5-6 inning outings from starters will probably turn into 3-5 inning outings, with the pen carrying the load every game which they can get away with because there's a lot more days off and you have more bullpen arms because of your smaller rotation.

[brewmann04]

WE don't know what we get from Nelson that a big question mark

[paul253]

I think people still beating the starting pitching drum are going to remain disappointed. They've got Jimmy coming back, Guerra has done a nice job, and Chase, Chacin and Davies aren't going anywhere. Jimmy is going to be your big deadline acquisition

 

I’d hate to go into the playoffs with this rotation. The team ERA for starting pitchers in currently 10th in the NL. Yes we get Nelson back but he’s coming back from a significant shoulder injury and counting on him to be the 2017 version of Nelson is risky. If we have a chance to upgrade the rotation we shouldn’t hesitate. I’d much rather do that than rely on a couple of rookies like Peralta or Burnes.

 

I’d argue starting pitcher and a super utility guy that can handle SS should be our two biggest targets.

[superfly]

I think people still beating the starting pitching drum are going to remain disappointed. They've got Jimmy coming back, Guerra has done a nice job, and Chase, Chacin and Davies aren't going anywhere. Jimmy is going to be your big deadline acquisition.

 

This is even assuming Peralta and Burnes don't crack the rotation at some point.

 

Our rotation is very average-ish, but most of the names being thrown out are just more of that same. Obviously if there's a Sale or Kershaw type being thrown around at the deadline, they'd be crazy not to go for it, but that's not happening.

 

I think people worry too much about whether this rotation is good enough to compete in the playoffs. This is a bullpen oriented staff and that would continue in the playoffs. These 5-6 inning outings from starters will probably turn into 3-5 inning outings, with the pen carrying the load every game which they can get away with because there's a lot more days off and you have more bullpen arms because of your smaller rotation.

 

Davies is overrated bigly. Guerra is 33 years old, and Jimmy could well not be in good shape until next summer for all we know. Let's not act like we have a wealth of goods at the SP position here. They're ok when they're on, but not world beaters.

 

There's several guys we could go after that aren't Kershaw types but might have upside in them. Blake Snell (or Archer I guess), Sean Manaea (or Trevor Cahill on the cheaper side for depth), Stroman/Happ etc.

[MrTPlush]

Freddy Peralta and Corbin Burnes are also irrelevant options for us. Peralta definitely will hit an innings limit rendering him useless and Corbin Burnes wil either hit an innings limit or just get gassed out. Peralta is way too shaky to put on a competitive roster minus emergency starts and Burnes has zero MLB experience.

 

Neither option is possible or a good idea.

[PeaveyFury]

In addition to what has already been said, I'll bet there's a long-ish DL stint in the future for one of the listed guys as well. That's just an inevitability in baseball, IMO.

 

Does anyone REALLY feel comfortable throwing a playoff rotation of some combination of Anderson, Chacin, Guerra, Davies, and an effectiveness-yet-to-be-determined Nelson?

 

Anderson/Chacin/Guerra/Nelson/acquisition seems a better bet to me...

[adambr2]

In addition to what has already been said, I'll bet there's a long-ish DL stint in the future for one of the listed guys as well. That's just an inevitability in baseball, IMO.

 

Does anyone REALLY feel comfortable throwing a playoff rotation of some combination of Anderson, Chacin, Guerra, Davies, and an effectiveness-yet-to-be-determined Nelson?

 

Anderson/Chacin/Guerra/Nelson/acquisition seems a better bet to me...

 

Well you're not going to have a 5 man rotation in the playoffs, you're going to have 4. So Nelson for sure, Anderson too unless he totally tanks, Guerra most likely, and then whoever the next best one is at the time.

 

I stand by what I said, that the playoff plan for the Brewers would be to get 12 outs or so with 1-2 runs or less allowed by their 'starters' and get 15 from the pen, which is totally feasible throughout the postseason with numerous days off and 9 guys in the pen.

 

People always want these theoretical aces which are neither available nor do we have the trade chips to acquire. Hamels has some really scary peripherals and flyball numbers which makes me doubt how effective he'll be late in the year. Not every veteran arm acquisition pitches like Verlander for the playoffs, and not every young arm just stinks in the playoffs. Look at Darvish.

 

All these names thrown around are just depth adds that are no real guarantee to be better than our current best 4 options. Archer is probably the one possible TOR pitcher that could be added, and he's absolutely no guarantee shown by his mediocre numbers this year. And he'll STILL cost Hiura+ to add. Is that really the best use of our resources?

 

We'll get Nelson back and go into August with him and what else we already have, my prediction. Anything that's good enough to be a clear upgrade in our rotation will be too expensive to justify the cost.

[Never Outhustled]

2B is a huge hole, and we'll upgrade that spot just like we did last year.

[yoyomayoma]

A trade with Oakland for Lowrie and Lucroy wouldn’t cost much and could solve two big problems.

[JohnBriggs12]

Happ is the ideal target. He's far better than average at age 35 and he has postseason experience. Considering he's been pitching in the AL East, he's not going to be intimidated on the big stage either. Key will be if Toronto is far enough back in the wild card to sell.

[adambr2]

A trade with Oakland for Lowrie and Lucroy wouldn’t cost much and could solve two big problems.

 

Yeah, I think something like this is a lot more likely. Not necessarily this specifically but something like it.

 

I'd also like to remind that Stearns doesn't necessarily fall in line with whatever conventional wisdom is about our rotation, and I'm guessing he doesn't fall in line with conventional wisdom about needing high end starters to win in the playoffs.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

2B is a huge hole, and we'll upgrade that spot just like we did last year.

 

Or we can just keep riding Villar, who hasn't been bad both offensively and defensively.

[adambr2]

2B is a huge hole, and we'll upgrade that spot just like we did last year.

 

Or we can just keep riding Villar, who hasn't been bad both offensively and defensively.

 

He also hasn't been very good. He's been better than last year for sure, but he's on pace to be about a 1 WAR player. Huge hole is probably a bit of an exaggeration but it's very upgradeable.

[yoyomayoma]

A trade with Oakland for Lowrie and Lucroy wouldn’t cost much and could solve two big problems.

[pacopete4]

I just hope we hold on trying to upgrade 2B until late July. Villar may or may not be the guy but it should be very clear by then what he is, given that Counsell actually keeps playing him. He’s actually made some really nice plays at 2B as of late and I can’t recall a base running blunder lately either. I’m sure now that I mention both, they’ll happen but it’s been good to see.

[MrTPlush]

Why is Nelson a for sure starter in the postseason? That a massive assumption. He has yet to play this season and we have no idea when he will coming off an injury to his throwing shoulder.

 

Maybe he should throw a few pitches first. He could easily have a setback and never be seen this year. He could be a shell of last year and be some 4.50 ERA pitcher...would that honestly shock anyone? Is that for sure in the postseason rotation? I hope not.

[TURBO]

A trade with Oakland for Lowrie and Lucroy wouldn’t cost much and could solve two big problems.

 

What problem does Lucroy solve? Our back-up catcher? Check huis numbers out, he is not the Lucroy that wore a Brewers uniform... Pina runs circles around him defensively and handing the staff. I have zero interest in Lucroy.

[adambr2]

Why is Nelson a for sure starter in the postseason? That a massive assumption. He has yet to play this season and we have no idea when he will coming off an injury to his throwing shoulder.

 

Maybe he should throw a few pitches first. He could easily have a setback and never be seen this year. He could be a shell of last year and be some 4.50 ERA pitcher...would that honestly shock anyone? Is that for sure in the postseason rotation? I hope not.

 

Or anyone else, including our other pitchers and trade targets, could blow out an arm and not pitch in the postseason. Could happen to anyone.

 

Yes, Nelson is at a higher risk but all the medical information we have at this point is that the type of shoulder injury he sustained should not affect his long-term prognosis.