Milwaukee Bucks 2018 - 2019

[patrickgpe]

And they fleeced every tax payer outside of SE Wisconsin while enriching themselves and their buddies by buying up land around the new arena. At least Herb Kohl was a good steward of the team.

 

Couldn’t have said it better. These guys are about making money and to do so they are putting together a team just good enough to make people think they can be contenders.

YES! there is no way you donate 250? Million of your own money if you aren't going to make it back. Its been proven that EVERY public stadium deal is a loss for the city. That being said every city provides a lot of services that are a net loss (I was a lifeguard for Milwaukee county way back in the day and they posted a sign in the pools that admission pays about 20% (# may be off it was 20 years ago) of the net cost to run the pools). The arena and Miller Park are good for the city.(also the arena will cost the tax payers far less in than Miller Park in the long run anyway).

[patrickgpe]

I am late to the Parker to Bulls news. couple of points:

 

1) yes its true, that if the bucks signed Parker to that same deal I would be ecstatic.

2) that being said, with the signings of lopez and Ersan, along with a bunch of bad contracts, there was never going to be 2 million to do that.

3) I still think that Lopez + Ersan +(whatever they do with the 8 mm under the cap that they are) is better next season that Parker. (provided that they don't completely waste that money (I understand that odds are that they guarantee Jennings and call there roster done).

4) If that is true they do have cap room to make a deal in February then.

 

Overall I am sad that they whole Parker thing didn't go the way I thought it would and puts pressure on Horst to Match Giannis with a superstar or two in the very near future.

[DuWayne Steurer]

People are so outraged by this. We cut our losses. Injuries killed him, and he didn’t fit the team. People would be screaming next year when he’s getting 20M to lead the second team. He’s a good kid, hope he has a bounce back year and signs a huge contract. I won’t lose sleep over his one. I love what Christian Wood is doing. I think he’ll be better than our draft pick. Hope we can sign him to a deal. Summer league is meaningless, but man he looks like what we need inside.

 

 

I'm not "outraged". It sucks that they got the #2 pick, he blew out his knee twice, was a decent scorer, terrible defender, didn't do much other than score and grab an occasional rebound, and by his age 23 season, he's walking away and the Bucks get nothing .... no comp, no nothing. No sign and trade.......nothing. I'm not outraged, it just sucks that they (once again) blew a pick on a guy who turned into nothing.

 

I wish the dude all the best. Hope he stays healthy and goes out and averages 23/8 and turns it around. I hope it doesn't lead to Bulls victories.... but good luck to Jabari in his career. He seems like a good guy. Just sucks that the Bucks get absolutely nothing out of a #2 pick.

[patrickgpe]

hindsight being 20/20 just think where the team would be if they drafted Embid #2, I understand that it was never an option based on his injury and if anyone said they would have drafted Embid over Parker, they are a liar.

[superfly]

hindsight being 20/20 just think where the team would be if they drafted Embid #2, I understand that it was never an option based on his injury and if anyone said they would have drafted Embid over Parker, they are a liar.

 

I don't know if the Bucks would have had the same amount of patience or not in bringing him back that Philly did, so it may not end up the same way. Regardless as of right now they didn't waste a 2nd pick, there was no other good options to take for them or anybody else for that matter. Only guy that is worth anything IIRC is Smart, and anyone that thinks he was a top 4-5 pick please send me some of whatever you're on.

[FVBrewerFan]

hindsight being 20/20 just think where the team would be if they drafted Embid #2, I understand that it was never an option based on his injury and if anyone said they would have drafted Embid over Parker, they are a liar.

 

Not that it matters, but I said it at the time. (Not sure if I said it in this forum or not.) Injuries aside, I saw Parker for what he was/is. A guy who can easily put up 20+ a game but not provide any defense. Now, that's still a skill, so I didn't just dismiss that. But I looked at it as the Bucks were a young tea, and hard to pass on an uber-talented big man.

[Austin Tatious]

The Bucks' whole approach is wrong. You save big money for impact players. Knock it off with Henson, Delladova, Snell and company. You can round off the filler spots with smaller deals and by sound drafting.

 

The idea that they did Bartlestein a solid just to gain favors with him is laughingstock material. He's only guiding players to Milwaukee where it makes sense, period, and not out of some loyalty to the Bucks lol. That tweet was so bizarre that it sounds like someone in the Bucks asked for good pub. Kowtowing to an agent is not a good look.

 

As for Parker, he's a mixed bag. Being on the cover of SI as a high schooler may have led to some entitlement issues there. His obvious pouting and demeanor is pretty weak. But, management did a poor job of handling him. Your employees are all different, and trying to reach them at a level where you can relate to them can get them to perform their best, AND be loyal to you. Obviously, none of that happened here. There is blame to go around.

 

As for his play, the analytics nerds are overconfident in their definitive assessments of him as a player. The world isn't so simple, and as you gain experience, you realize how overconfidence is such a negative trait. This is a 23 year old kid who has had injuries and hasn't been coached in good team principles on either end of the court. The Bucks' offense last year was a joke as they stood around taking turns going one on one. Team defense was non-existent. The Bucks' did not reach Jabari at a positive level, instead alienating him. His offensive inefficiency at age 23 under poor coaching may not be there if he can get good coaching. He's a talent and I am not going to write him off like the overconfident bunch. Will he stay healthy? That's the question, but the Bulls signed him to minimize risk so that's not really the issue at the moment.

[homer]

 

As for his play, the analytics nerds are overconfident in their definitive assessments of him as a player. The world isn't so simple, and as you gain experience, you realize how overconfidence is such a negative trait. This is a 23 year old kid who has had injuries and hasn't been coached in good team principles on either end of the court. The Bucks' offense last year was a joke as they stood around taking turns going one on one. Team defense was non-existent. The Bucks' did not reach Jabari at a positive level, instead alienating him. His offensive inefficiency at age 23 under poor coaching may not be there if he can get good coaching. He's a talent and I am not going to write him off like the overconfident bunch. Will he stay healthy? That's the question, but the Bulls signed him to minimize risk so that's not really the issue at the moment.

 

 

I don't recall any "nerds" questioning his offense. It's always been his defense which was bad to begin with and that was before to ACL injuries. He can't move laterally very well at all which is going to hurt him against small forwards and he isn't really big enough to bang with power forwards. Good thing Hoiberg's teams don't really play defense either so maybe it will work. Expect a lot of 120+ point losses next year.

[OnaBadger58]

People are so outraged by this. We cut our losses. Injuries killed him, and he didn’t fit the team. People would be screaming next year when he’s getting 20M to lead the second team. He’s a good kid, hope he has a bounce back year and signs a huge contract. I won’t lose sleep over his one. I love what Christian Wood is doing. I think he’ll be better than our draft pick. Hope we can sign him to a deal. Summer league is meaningless, but man he looks like what we need inside.

I have no problem with it as a basketball move. However, as others have said, to get no value out of the #2 overall pick after 4 years is a shame (regardless of the circumstances).

 

It is a shame. Such high hopes of having our 1-2 punch for 10-15 years. I don't think things could have gone worse for Jabari since he's been a Buck. Between the injuries, bad coaching, and the mess of ownership. His defense optional mentality certainly never helped his situation. There was only a small window where the Bucks could have actually received anything of substance back though (after his 1st ACL tear).

 

Time to move on however. It's probably best for both parties. The question is what's the next step?

[Boomer5]

Having one star is pergatory. Not enough to win anything substantial but good enough to not draft high.

[OnaBadger58]

Having one star is pergatory. Not enough to win anything substantial but good enough to not draft high.

 

It absolutely is. Add in the terrible contracts of Snell, Delly, and Henson, this isn't going to be a short term fix either. This team is in a tough predicament and I have absolutely no faith that they find a way out. Seems like 2020 will be the year for potential optimism.

[Austin Tatious]

 

As for his play, the analytics nerds are overconfident in their definitive assessments of him as a player. The world isn't so simple, and as you gain experience, you realize how overconfidence is such a negative trait. This is a 23 year old kid who has had injuries and hasn't been coached in good team principles on either end of the court. The Bucks' offense last year was a joke as they stood around taking turns going one on one. Team defense was non-existent. The Bucks' did not reach Jabari at a positive level, instead alienating him. His offensive inefficiency at age 23 under poor coaching may not be there if he can get good coaching. He's a talent and I am not going to write him off like the overconfident bunch. Will he stay healthy? That's the question, but the Bulls signed him to minimize risk so that's not really the issue at the moment.

 

 

I don't recall any "nerds" questioning his offense. It's always been his defense which was bad to begin with and that was before to ACL injuries. He can't move laterally very well at all which is going to hurt him against small forwards and he isn't really big enough to bang with power forwards. Good thing Hoiberg's teams don't really play defense either so maybe it will work. Expect a lot of 120+ point losses next year.

 

His offensive efficiency has come under heavy criticism. I don’t want to give the overconfident guys more mentions than they deserve, but they are out there en masse. As for defense, if you handle him correctly and install credible team defense, he can be fine there.

[Boomer5]

Having one star is pergatory. Not enough to win anything substantial but good enough to not draft high.

 

It absolutely is. Add in the terrible contracts of Snell, Delly, and Henson, this isn't going to be a short term fix either. This team is in a tough predicament and I have absolutely no faith that they find a way out. Seems like 2020 will be the year for potential optimism.

 

The problem is Giannis who sounds genuine but he can’t possibly stay with this mess.

 

It’s like these owners literally couldn’t read a spreadsheet or know the cap rules when they signed these ridiculous deals.

[homer]

Having one star is pergatory. Not enough to win anything substantial but good enough to not draft high.

 

Boston seems to do ok getting high draft picks.

[rickh150]

How does not guaranteeing the 2nd year (team option) help Parker?

No one knows!

 

The only thing that I can think of is that....

-the 20 million for one year is more than anything floated for two.

-the Bulls didn't want to go two guaranteed years because of injury concerns

-The New Bucks Coach didn't want him AT ALL and the QO was just buying them time to hope for someone to swoop in with a nice trade offer.

-my guess is that if no RFA offer or respectable trade offer came in for Parker, the Bucks might have just released him; otherwise, they make Chicago pony up serious money for two years, not one. Working with the enemy to make this one year thing happen (with a TEAM option) tells me the Bucks didn't want a PR nightmare if they just would have cut a #2 pick scorer with potential. The Bulls were their only out with Bucks saying that they now couldn't afford him because of such a high offer.

[nodakfan17]

Having one star is pergatory. Not enough to win anything substantial but good enough to not draft high.

 

Boston seems to do ok getting high draft picks.

They have a real GM, so it can be done.

 

But the Brooklyn trade that brought a monster haul and the trade of Doc Rivers for a FRP were both kind of flukey. It’s hard to count on those types of moves being available to sustain your franchise. Kudos to Ainge, though.

[Baldkin]

Having one star is pergatory. Not enough to win anything substantial but good enough to not draft high.

 

Boston seems to do ok getting high draft picks.

 

Yep. They had a forward thinking GM who traded away their talent before it left in free agency for nothing and who makes moves that are forward thinking instead of reactionary.

 

They didn't trade away extra first round draft picks for non needle moving players (like Grievous Vasquez and Michael Carter-Williams) or dump 2nd round picks for guys who barely saw any minutes (like Tyler Zeller).

[GAME05]

You also can't have a team of three stars and everyone else is a minimum-wage nobody. You still need mid-level talent, some at mid-level prices. Hammond was just bad at identifying mid-level players. I'm a fan of Snell, but when you're a middling team, defensive stopper is probably a player you should just hope to get in the draft. Dellavadova should have never happened, and Henson should have been traded when we weren't making the playoffs and he still had some value. Keep the guys who you need to take you to the Finals and everyone else is expendable. And especially with Henson, why keep a guy when you could have otherwise gotten a pick for him?

 

Was just looking at what a supermax contract looks like. If Giannis left he'd be turning down a guaranteed $56M fifth year of the contract. Sure hope he stays, because Milwaukee will turn him into royalty.

[GAME05]

Toronto trades three years of an All-Star player for one year of a slightly better player who very obviously isn't going to be with them after the season. Are teams not valuing the idea of being able to re-sign players? If you were a GM who had to think long term, why not wait a year for Leonard?

[superfly]

Toronto trades three years of an All-Star player for one year of a slightly better player who very obviously isn't going to be with them after the season. Are teams not valuing the idea of being able to re-sign players? If you were a GM who had to think long term, why not wait a year for Leonard?

 

Toronto had luxury tax implications.

[Baldkin]

Toronto trades three years of an All-Star player for one year of a slightly better player who very obviously isn't going to be with them after the season. Are teams not valuing the idea of being able to re-sign players? If you were a GM who had to think long term, why not wait a year for Leonard?

 

1) Kawhi, if healthy, is probably the 3rd best player in the league, a guy who was single handedly beating Golden State before Zaza horribly broke him. DeRozan is somewhere around 20th. That's a huge difference.

 

2) Kawhi was never going to sign with Toronto, their best hope was to get him there for a season and hope he falls in love with the atmosphere, city, and being a superstar in Canada.

 

3) They got out from under DeRozan's contract. Was he truly good enough to be worth what he was being paid?

[Boomer5]

Having one star is pergatory. Not enough to win anything substantial but good enough to not draft high.

 

Boston seems to do ok getting high draft picks.

 

They didn’t draft high on their own picks. They traded for picks which is something we don’t do. We love to trade first round picks which is a strategy I will never understand.

[reillymcshane]

Bucks should go after Kyle Korver. Get Cleveland to take back Delly, plus a highly protected 1st rounder.

 

With the additions of Lopez, Korver, and İlyasova - that could be a fun team.

[Boomer5]

No more trading first round picks for old players.

[GAME05]

The Bucks have already traded their 1st rounder next year to Phoenix. And if they have any desire to get rid of Dellavadova or Henson, they're going to have to include a pick to do that, too.

 

You can't always trade away your picks because there gets to be a point that the only players you have are ones already on the roster or free agents. You wouldn't have those any of those good contributors like a Thon Maker or Brogdon who give you value in a higher performance than what their salary warrants. And if you're getting no value for your play, you'll forever be a #6 in the playoffs and be no higher. Giannis and Middleton are both going to get PAID. If no first-round talent to fill in the gaps, you can only get so far on free-agent money. You'd be left having to give the likes of Jason Terry and Xavier Munford significant minutes.