Manny Machado (Part 1)

[coolhandluke121]

 

Lorenzo Cain was such an anti-Stearns move too. David Stearns has been a GM for very little time and has essentially never managed a contender before this year. Sometimes I feel people act like we have 20 years of data to look back on and know what he will or won’t do.

 

I doubt we blow up a chunk of the farm for a premium rental...but I can’t say I know Stearns wouldn’t do it ever.

 

I don't think Cain was an anti-Stearns move at all. People were wrong to assume he was all about going cheap and young all the time. What he's about is long-term value and winning transactions, ideally in sync with the team's current situation. Once everyone understands that, they'll do a lot better predicting what he might or might not do. It's not just about "going for it" or "building for the future" like many people suggest.

[MrTPlush]

 

Lorenzo Cain was such an anti-Stearns move too. David Stearns has been a GM for very little time and has essentially never managed a contender before this year. Sometimes I feel people act like we have 20 years of data to look back on and know what he will or won’t do.

 

I doubt we blow up a chunk of the farm for a premium rental...but I can’t say I know Stearns wouldn’t do it ever.

 

I don't think Cain was an anti-Stearns move at all. People were wrong to assume he was all about going cheap and young all the time. What he's about is long-term value and winning transactions, ideally in sync with the team's current situation. Once everyone understands that, they'll do a lot better predicting what he might or might not do. It's not just about "going for it" or "building for the future" like many people suggest.

 

He also probably isn’t dumb enough to not see a prime chance to win a World Series too. Still two long months before the deadline (a lot can change), but this is certainly shaping up to be a great opportunity to win the NL.

[adambr2]

Arcia being demoted, if he doesn't get it together, makes Machado a very obvious fit.

 

The Orioles would definitely like young pitching, and we can definitely beat the Cubs there.

 

Its definitely going to take more than a JD Martinez type offer. How much more, I don't know. I know people are hesitant to give up much for a rental, but this is not like going out and getting Neil Walker last year. Machado is an A+ level superstar and significantly increases your chances of making it to the World Series especially in a tight NL.

 

Another factor is, how much will the hit of what you give up hurt you in the future? Well, even after losing Machado, they could still move forward with Arcia at SS, who would hopefully be a year wiser. They would basically return the entire team that is 35-20 right now and therefore in theory be right back in the mix again next year, hopefully. So there's nothing wrong with that.

[Fear The Chorizo]

If Machado or any other quality rental player (Lowrie, frontline Starter, etc) can be acquired using Brewer prospects that may have a difficult time finding their way onto the 40 man roster due to being blocked or just not being close enough to the majors before being subject to the rule 5 draft, then I think it makes great sense to use them as trade fodder to make a deal like that happen. Guys like Modeiros, Gatewood, Grisham, Kirby, and many others have plenty of talent based on where they were drafted, but the clock is running on them to become MLB players with the Brewers due to the combo of minor league time already logged plus organizational depth in front of them at the MLB level.

 

For promising prospects already on the 40 man (Peralta, Woodruff), or for ones that the Brewers are just biding their time to add (Hiura, Burnes), they shouldn't be included in deadline deals. In addition, the Brewers currently have a pile of #3-#5 caliber starters that have a few years of MLB control remaining, all of which could be attractive for teams looking to potentially retool instead of completely rebuild (Davies, Guerra, Wilkerson, Suter). If Nelson returns to form and/or a frontline starter is targeted, some of those guys won't have a role and could be best served to the Brewers as trade bait. That said, it's always tough for a playoff contender to send away pitching with MLB experience via trade at the deadline...unless it's part of a deal that returns a much more talented arm to improve the MLB club.

[KCBrewerfan34]

Would Woodruff Peralta and Ray get Machado?

[coolhandluke121]

 

He also probably isn’t dumb enough to not see a prime chance to win a World Series too. Still two long months before the deadline (a lot can change), but this is certainly shaping up to be a great opportunity to win the NL.

 

Yep. 86 wins justifies Cain and Yelich at the price they paid, and there could be other guys out there who are worth the price. I don't think Stearns will pay any premiums, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if he pounces on a good opportunity. And as long as he doesn't get into some dumb bidding war, I'm fine with that.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Would Woodruff Peralta and Ray get Machado?

 

Yes, and I think that's also a massive overpay by grouping two young starters together at the top of the package. I think one of Woodruff/Peralta plus a mid-level position player prospect that isn't as touted as Ray would be palatable. If Baltimore wants a quantity type deal than look for the Brewers to try adding lotto tickets from lower levels.

[wallus]

Would Woodruff Peralta and Ray get Machado?

 

It sure would but why would we do that for a rental?

[long ball]

IT will be interesting to see what Machado ends up pulling in a trade. I understand that Machado plays SS and Martinez plays OF, but JD Martinez is also an elite hitter.

 

The package the tigers god for Martinez was just ok. No super highly rated prospects.

 

I'm not sure the Brewers could acquire Machado without including at least one Burnes, Peralta, or Huira but I don't think it would require more than one of them in the package.

[KCBrewerfan34]

Winning. Peralta's value along with Ray's may never be higher. I sold a Peralta rookie card for a 500% profit based on 1 start. Now may be the time to make a big deal using a package like this. we haven't been to the WS in 36 years. That's pathetic. This might be a chance. NL is wide open.

[brewmann04]

I be curious like most to see what it costs to get Manny but what worries me is what we have to pay and can't afford to pay him in FA.I don"t want to throw what it might take to get him.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Winning. Peralta's value along with Ray's may never be higher. I sold a Peralta rookie card for a 500% profit based on 1 start. Now may be the time to make a big deal using a package like this. we haven't been to the WS in 36 years. That's pathetic. This might be a chance. NL is wide open.

 

Spot.On.

 

If the Brewers have a legit shot of making it to a World Series this season, you make the moves to solidify that shot. If you have good leadership in place, you have faith that they will be able to restock the farm system and keep a quality team on the field in future years. I'd gladly trade away a bunch of our top prospects for a World Series shot. Very gladly.

[3and2Fastball]

I think if you can get an agreement with Machado on a long term contract as a condition of the trade, you pull the trigger and give up Arcia plus pitching...

 

Cain

Yelich

Machado

 

At the top of the order plus Shaw, Aguillar/Thames, Braun/Santana hitting 6th etc is just a ridiculously powerful lineup.

 

Machado is only 25 years old, he is the type of player you absolutely break the bank for longterm. The Brewers being willing to play him at SS might be an advantage. A lot of teams would move him back to 3B and he wants to play Short.

[JohnBriggs12]

I think if you can get an agreement with Machado on a long term contract as a condition of the trade, you pull the trigger and give up Arcia plus pitching...

 

Cain

Yelich

Machado

 

At the top of the order plus Shaw, Aguillar/Thames, Braun/Santana hitting 6th etc is just a ridiculously powerful lineup.

 

Machado is only 25 years old, he is the type of player you absolutely break the bank for longterm. The Brewers being willing to play him at SS might be an advantage. A lot of teams would move him back to 3B and he wants to play Short.

 

Forget about the condition of getting agreement on a long term contract. That's not happening. Not for the Brewers or Cubs or Dodgers. Why would he surrender his bargaining power when he's just months away from benefiting from a bidding war. That fact makes his trade value less. Baltimore will look for the best that they can get as long as it's more than they would get from a compensation pick. Brewers have inventory to deal from that's well above the quantity that the Cubs do unless the Cubs are willing to part with a Schwarber or Happ which doesn't seem likely. Russell maybe, but Arcia and one quality young arm could trump that.

[trwi7]

It would be absolutely insane to trade top prospects for Machado.

[TooLiveBrew]

I think if you can get an agreement with Machado on a long term contract as a condition of the trade, you pull the trigger and give up Arcia plus pitching...

I agree with everything you said about Machado, but there is no way the Brewers can afford him long-term, and I think also zero chance he doesn't go to the FA market to drive up his price tag.

[mlloyd10]

It would be absolutely insane to trade top prospects for Machado.

 

It really wouldn't......IF YOU THINK HE IS THE MISSING PIECE.

 

But we still need more than just him.

[trwi7]

It would be absolutely insane to trade top prospects for Machado.

 

It really wouldn't......IF YOU THINK HE IS THE MISSING PIECE.

 

But we still need more than just him.

 

There is no such thing as a "missing piece." We could trade for Kershaw, Machado and Harper and there's still a good chance we wouldn't win the World Series.

[mlloyd10]

It would be absolutely insane to trade top prospects for Machado.

 

It really wouldn't......IF YOU THINK HE IS THE MISSING PIECE.

 

But we still need more than just him.

 

There is no such thing as a "missing piece." We could trade for Kershaw, Machado and Harper and there's still a good chance we wouldn't win the World Series.

 

Then why even try then

[3and2Fastball]

You give Machado his full asking price right now (I'm guessing 7 years $210 Million) and he'll sign. Why risk injury in the 2nd Half which could effect his bargaining power when he can get the full contract right now?

[pacopete4]

I think you'd have to be at the 10-year mark to make him even think about it.

[TooLiveBrew]

I think you'd have to be at the 10-year mark to make him even think about it.

It's crazy to think that this was so long ago now, but A-Rod's 10 yr/$250M contract was signed in 2000! Machado doesn't have the pedigree A-Rod did at that point, but a 10-yr contract you have to assume will be over $300M. That is insane money.

 

If you grade A-Rod's deal on a curve, I wonder what its dollar amount would equate to in 2018. $400M? There just weren't contracts like his before he signed that one.

[tmwiese55]

But we still need more than just him.

 

There is no such thing as a "missing piece." We could trade for Kershaw, Machado and Harper and there's still a good chance we wouldn't win the World Series.

 

Then why even try then

 

 

 

He's just saying it's the nature and fluctuation of baseball. As in, even the clearly superior team still only win like 60% of the games. It's not like NBA where if you have an overwhelming team you're almost unbeatable. So it's tough to call any one player a missing piece because it's just not possible in baseball.

[tmwiese55]

Don't get me wrong here, not trying to say Machado isn't a great player and that I'd love to have him. Plus being only 25 and all there's room for more.

 

But prior to this year he's never been a ridiculous hitter, maybe this is the new norm for him, who knows. But look at his numbers prior and he's not absurd. Of course, still very good and power has shown up the last few years. But his career obp is .333. Last year he was 259/310.

[mlloyd10]

But we still need more than just him.

 

There is no such thing as a "missing piece." We could trade for Kershaw, Machado and Harper and there's still a good chance we wouldn't win the World Series.

 

Then why even try then

 

 

 

He's just saying it's the nature and fluctuation of baseball. As in, even the clearly superior team still only win like 60% of the games. It's not like NBA where if you have an overwhelming team you're almost unbeatable. So it's tough to call any one player a missing piece because it's just not possible in baseball.

 

I get what he is saying...he is just always negative

 

Machado doesn't guarantee get you a WS title, but he does guarantee you a Playoff spot