J.D. Martinez to the Red Sox

[wibadgers23]

Deal is for 5 years with an opt-out.

[SRB]

Wonder if the market for Santana picks up now.

[Sheets4President]

5 years $110 million

 

[KeithStone53151]

I think this was well done by Dombrowski. No sense in bidding against yourself. Dbacks couldn't match that.

 

I think this move hurts Santana's market a bit. I could have seen Boston panicking if they didn't get Martinez. I doubt we want to move Santana to the Dbacks, so Cleveland is the primary landing spot and they know it.

[MillerParkSouth]

FINALLY

[SeaBass]

I'm just glad the big free agents are finally starting to sign.

[adambr2]

. I doubt we want to move Santana to the Dbacks.

 

Why not? If the DBacks come in with a good offer, I'd be all for it.

 

Though I would agree an AL team is the better fit because of the DH.

[KeithStone53151]

. I doubt we want to move Santana to the Dbacks.

 

Why not? If the DBacks come in with a good offer, I'd be all for it.

 

Though I would agree an AL team is the better fit because of the DH.

 

I'm moreso referring to them being competition for the wildcard. Do we really want to help direct competition get better? Might be a situation where we try to extract a premium.

[KeithStone53151]

 

That whole shoot for the moon thing really worked out...

[reillymcshane]

Martinez gets $50M in the first two years - then has an opt out. That leaves 'only' $60M for years 3-5.

 

I figured he'd get 5 years/$125M from someone - so the Red Sox did all right. Seems to be the case with the top FAs. They are coming in a bit under what many predicted. The tight market is hurting them - but not that much. $22M per year is still a massive amount of money.

[TJseven7]

Well done by boston. 50/2 60/3 is a solid set up. Didn't do anything crazy.

[jerichoholicninja]

Overall this year's free agent class was very underwhelming but I can't understand why everyone was so down on JD. You can argue about how much he "deserves" all you want but he's the rare complete hitter. Since he went to Detroit and turned his career around he's slashed a pretty awesome .300/.362/.574. That's a great AVG, OBP, and SLUG. The defense is definitely a knock but he was portrayed as a HR or bust slugger, which he is not. I felt he was the star of this year's free agents and it wasn't even close. Certainly age and defense need to be considered, but next year's FA star Bryce Harper has an OPS+ of 148 since 2014 when JD went to Detroit. JD's is 149.

[brewmann04]

I am not sure if this helps the Santana situation or hurts his value

[LouisEly]

Overall this year's free agent class was very underwhelming but I can't understand why everyone was so down on JD. You can argue about how much he "deserves" all you want but he's the rare complete hitter. Since he went to Detroit and turned his career around he's slashed a pretty awesome .300/.362/.574. That's a great AVG, OBP, and SLUG. The defense is definitely a knock but he was portrayed as a HR or bust slugger, which he is not. I felt he was the star of this year's free agents and it wasn't even close. Certainly age and defense need to be considered, but next year's FA star Bryce Harper has an OPS+ of 148 since 2014 when JD went to Detroit. JD's is 149.

It's more about VORP than OPS/OPS+. The glut of corner OFs/DHs - and good ones - has reduced the delta between him and the average available corner OF/DH.

 

Put those numbers on an athletic CF with good defense... very different story.

[liveforoctober]

 

That whole shoot for the moon thing really worked out...

 

Not as big of a "come down to earth" deal for Martinez to be honest. He gets $25 mil per season these next 2 and if he rakes similarly to last year ... he can drop out of that contract and try to negotiate another 4 or 5 year deal worth the same amount at age 32.

 

Still a good negotiation for Boston though.

[bill hAll Star]

 

That whole shoot for the moon thing really worked out...

 

It didn’t? Seems like he got a good contract even if Boras said that with a straight face.

[danzig6767]

 

That whole shoot for the moon thing really worked out...

 

Not as big of a "come down to earth" deal for Martinez to be honest. He gets $25 mil per season these next 2 and if he rakes similarly to last year ... he can drop out of that contract and try to negotiate another 4 or 5 year deal worth the same amount at age 32.

 

Still a good negotiation for Boston though.

Seems a reasonable deal for both sides to me.

[patrickgpe]

I guess this may reopen the Santana to Arizona talks?

[KeithStone53151]

 

That whole shoot for the moon thing really worked out...

 

It didn’t? Seems like he got a good contract even if Boras said that with a straight face.

 

He reportedly was offered $100 million right away. Martinez countered at $210 million...and was able to squeeze out $10 million more. He probably could have gotten that $10 million in December if he gave the impression he was close to picking Boston.

[tigerbrew]

Teams are getting smarter and tougher in dealing with Boras. Boras unable to get teams to overpay despite his delaying tactic and his other negotiating tactics like playing hardball and getting a bidding war etc. Looks like teams can play hardball against Boras and win too.

[JosephC]

Overall this year's free agent class was very underwhelming but I can't understand why everyone was so down on JD. You can argue about how much he "deserves" all you want but he's the rare complete hitter. Since he went to Detroit and turned his career around he's slashed a pretty awesome .300/.362/.574. That's a great AVG, OBP, and SLUG. The defense is definitely a knock but he was portrayed as a HR or bust slugger, which he is not. I felt he was the star of this year's free agents and it wasn't even close. Certainly age and defense need to be considered, but next year's FA star Bryce Harper has an OPS+ of 148 since 2014 when JD went to Detroit. JD's is 149.

 

I don't think anybody has problems with Martinez's bat. But the defensive aspect is more than just a knock. Martinez has been a -22, -5 DRS and -21.5, -14.8 UZR/150 for his defense over the last two seasons. He's also missed a ton of games except for 2015 when he appeared in 158. Over the last two years he's appeared in 120 and 119 games. He already has the look of a DH and I'd suspect that scared many teams off of him. I don't think any AL team would have a problem paying a premium price for a quality DH for a season or two. But I don't think many teams would be interested in throwing a 150 dollar committment to a guy who has "future DH" written all over him.

[jerichoholicninja]

Overall this year's free agent class was very underwhelming but I can't understand why everyone was so down on JD. You can argue about how much he "deserves" all you want but he's the rare complete hitter. Since he went to Detroit and turned his career around he's slashed a pretty awesome .300/.362/.574. That's a great AVG, OBP, and SLUG. The defense is definitely a knock but he was portrayed as a HR or bust slugger, which he is not. I felt he was the star of this year's free agents and it wasn't even close. Certainly age and defense need to be considered, but next year's FA star Bryce Harper has an OPS+ of 148 since 2014 when JD went to Detroit. JD's is 149.

It's more about VORP than OPS/OPS+. The glut of corner OFs/DHs - and good ones - has reduced the delta between him and the average available corner OF/DH.

 

Put those numbers on an athletic CF with good defense... very different story.

 

CF and corner OF are two very different positions so those aren't really comparable. Of course a 900+ OPS, gold glove CF is going to make bank but there's only 1 Mike Trout and he's signed for a few more years. There was no free agent hitter on the market even close to JD in terms of hitting ability. Cain, Hosmer, and Moustakas were the next best free agent hitters and the best OPS+ they ever put up between them was 132. Most were in the 100-110 area. JD is well above average. Hypothetically speaking, not considering team finances and who else is on the team, I would take JD on the contract he just signed over Cain on the contract he signed every time. There just aren't many hitters in baseball that will give you that combination of above average BA, with great OBP, and great SLUG.

[liveforoctober]

 

That whole shoot for the moon thing really worked out...

 

It didn’t? Seems like he got a good contract even if Boras said that with a straight face.

 

He reportedly was offered $100 million right away. Martinez countered at $210 million...and was able to squeeze out $10 million more. He probably could have gotten that $10 million in December if he gave the impression he was close to picking Boston.

 

But if he was offered 5/100 (20 million per) and he countered with 7/210 (30 million per) ... and they settled on 5/110 with an opt out after year 2 and a front loaded contract paying him 2/50 (25 million per) in the first two seasons ... it seems like his counter offer got him 25% more per season than originally offered with the ability to opt out and get a new contract after those 2 years. I think his counter did exactly what he wanted.

[pacopete4]

Even with the Martinez signing the Red Sox lineup still isn't great. It will be interesting to see if they get the pitching they did a year ago.

[adambr2]

Overall this year's free agent class was very underwhelming but I can't understand why everyone was so down on JD. You can argue about how much he "deserves" all you want but he's the rare complete hitter. Since he went to Detroit and turned his career around he's slashed a pretty awesome .300/.362/.574. That's a great AVG, OBP, and SLUG. The defense is definitely a knock but he was portrayed as a HR or bust slugger, which he is not. I felt he was the star of this year's free agents and it wasn't even close. Certainly age and defense need to be considered, but next year's FA star Bryce Harper has an OPS+ of 148 since 2014 when JD went to Detroit. JD's is 149.

It's more about VORP than OPS/OPS+. The glut of corner OFs/DHs - and good ones - has reduced the delta between him and the average available corner OF/DH.

 

Put those numbers on an athletic CF with good defense... very different story.

 

CF and corner OF are two very different positions so those aren't really comparable. Of course a 900+ OPS, gold glove CF is going to make bank but there's only 1 Mike Trout and he's signed for a few more years. There was no free agent hitter on the market even close to JD in terms of hitting ability. Cain, Hosmer, and Moustakas were the next best free agent hitters and the best OPS+ they ever put up between them was 132. Most were in the 100-110 area. JD is well above average. Hypothetically speaking, not considering team finances and who else is on the team, I would take JD on the contract he just signed over Cain on the contract he signed every time. There just aren't many hitters in baseball that will give you that combination of above average BA, with great OBP, and great SLUG.

 

 

So it really comes down to how you weigh the defensive metrics and how many pegs you knock a guy down for defense bad enough to essentially turn him into a one way player, albeit a very good one way player.

 

I think you could reasonably argue that Cain will be worth more wins than JD over the next 5 years.

 

It could explain a lot of the troubles finding a decent offense for Santana. Right now this team profiles as having about the best bench in franchise history and a lineup begging for the DH.