Wade Miley Moves to Rotation, Suter to Pen

[JosephC]

Interesting that Miley's best month over the last three years has been May.

Monthly ERAs, 2015-2017

April = 4.69

May = 4.03

June = 5.86

July = 5.68

August = 4.67

September = 5.89

October = 4.50

 

Some more numbers

Slash line against Miley in 2017 = .287/.380/.462/.841

 

After throwing ball 1, slash line against Miley from 2015-2017 = .286/.400/.473/.873

 

These are very limited sample sizes, ERAs against NL Central opponents from 2015-2017:

Cincinnati = 3.21 ERA, 14 innings pitched

Chicago Cubs = 6.17 ERA, 11 2/3 innings pitched

St. Louis = 7.94, 5 2/3 innings pitched

Pittsburgh = 12.15 ERA, 6 2/3 innings pitched

 

Had 1 appearance in Miller Park from 2015-2017. Gave up 7 earned runs in 1 2/3 innings pitched. 37.80 ERA.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Interesting that Miley's best month over the last three years has been May.

Monthly ERAs, 2015-2017

April = 4.69

May = 4.03

June = 5.86

July = 5.68

August = 4.67

September = 5.89

October = 4.50

 

Some more numbers

Slash line against Miley in 2017 = .287/.380/.462/.841

 

After throwing ball 1, slash line against Miley from 2015-2017 = .286/.400/.473/.873

 

These are very limited sample sizes, ERAs against NL Central opponents from 2015-2017:

Cincinnati = 3.21 ERA, 14 innings pitched

Chicago Cubs = 6.17 ERA, 11 2/3 innings pitched

St. Louis = 7.94, 5 2/3 innings pitched

Pittsburgh = 12.15 ERA, 6 2/3 innings pitched

 

Had 1 appearance in Miller Park from 2015-2017. Gave up 7 earned runs in 1 2/3 innings pitched. 37.80 ERA.

 

Well if that doesn't scream rotation savior?

[MrTPlush]

Brent Suter has not gotten the job done. We have one really good pitcher so we really need an above average 5th starter. He is no where near that.

[TooLiveBrew]

It can't possibly be any worse than trotting Suter out there every 5th day.

 

I cannot possibly understand where this narrative is coming from.

 

5 IP, 3ER

5 IP, 4 ER

5.1 IP, 1 ER

5 IP, 3 ER

5 IP, 5 ER

5 IP, 2 ER

 

Those are Suter's game logs so far. All early hooks, but every pitcher has gotten early hooks, so it must be by design. These are by no means great numbers, but none are blow-up starts either.

 

I mean, is it because he doesn't throw fast? That has to be it, right? Because what he's putting up are 4th-5th starter numbers, which is exactly what he is and what is expected of him. He by no means deserves the ridicule he's getting on this board. I'd much rather have Suter's consistency than Miley's likely 6 IP, 3 ER line followed by a 3 IP, 8 ER line.

I think you can make an argument that 4 & 5 ER in just 5 innings is blow-up start territory. So while there's no 6+ ER outings there, it's still cumulatively a 5.34 ERA.

 

For me the argument isn't whether anyone's making fun of him or overstating how bad Suter is, the question is 'Can we do better than a 5.34 ERA from our #5 spot?' Obviously Stearns & CC believe the answer is Yes, & think Miley has a decent shot at producing better.

 

Just to be transparent, I personally do think Suter lacks the raw stuff to be considered one of the best 5 SPs for a team that wants to seriously contend for the playoffs. If he's your 6th or 7th best SP, fine -- & to your initial point he will probably not go out & just get you killed in any given start.

[And That]

Brent Suter has not gotten the job done. We have one really good pitcher so we really need an above average 5th starter. He is no where near that.

With Brent Suter in the rotation, the Brewers' pitching staff has the 3rd best ERA *in baseball*.

 

The Brewers' move towards shorter starts and "bullpenning" in general has sort of curtailed the need/ability to rank the Brewers pitchers as "ace" or "3rd starter" or "5th starter" - they're all just guys who the Brewers are hoping give about 5-6 good-ish innings and then hand the game over to the bullpen. Suter has basically done that.

 

Not saying his spot in the rotation couldn't be improved upon, but his starts haven't undercut the rotation or bullpen either.

[Jopal78]

Frankly, hasn't Chacin been the bigger problem than Suter?

 

3.1 IP 4 ER

5.2 3

4.2 3

4.0 1

6.0 0

5.2 2

4.1 4

 

Chacin has logged one quality start and has only pitched three more innings than Suter despite making one additional start.

Suter, on the other hand, bests Chacin in FIP (3.82 : 5:24) BB/9 (2.1 : 4.5) and K/9 (3.14 : 1.18).

 

This whole Wade Miley move appears to be the front office being scared to let him go, based on his 20+ innings in spring training. If they truly want the gritty veteran lefty who will eat innings they could at least swap him in for Chacin who hasn't delivered much of anything outside his start against Miami.

[wildcat83]

Did I read somewhere that the roster move is expected to happen today? Guessing after tonight's game

 

Let Bandy catch tonight then DFA him after the game if Vogt is almost ready. That frees up the 40 man spot, then you send Woodruff down when Vogt comes up.

 

Edit: Nevermind, just saw in another thread that Vogt just starts his rehab assignment today.

[sveumrules]

Miley now sitting on a 1.53 ERA through his first 29 innings with the Crew.

 

Thought it might be interesting to revisit this thread for some initial reactions. Personal favorites...

 

Wade Miley is far from insurance, he is a bum that truly serves no purpose. None.

 

4 of our starters would literally need TJS in March for Miley to ever see our MLB roster.

 

Amazing that guys like this, year in and year out, absolutely suck but continue to make millions of dollars. Why in the hell would you pitch this bum every five days and not some young buck that might actually have a future? I just never understand this horse poop.

 

Gross. I remember seeing him pitch against the Brewers last year and thinking 'Wow, this guy is awful.'

 

I agree with Joey, there's no way he should be cracking this rotation even as is. I'd much rather see Suter or even Yo as the 5 starter.

 

Heck go ahead and add Wilkerson and Bubba Derby to that list.

 

Ugh, hopefully he's just a deep depth signing. I don't want to see him anywhere close to the ML rotation.

[Oxy]

The revelations of Chacin and Miley are making me know what it feels like to be a Cardinals fan. Stearns and Derek Johnson deserve big raises.

[tigerbrew]

Stearns deserves lots of credit for signing Miley and sticking with him through his injuries. It's amazing how Stearns is able to find good starting pitching at dirt cheap prices in FA like Miley and Chacin, he has better instincts than most other GMs.

[cesser000]

Miley now sitting on a 1.53 ERA through his first 29 innings with the Crew.

 

Thought it might be interesting to revisit this thread for some initial reactions. Personal favorites...

 

Wade Miley is far from insurance, he is a bum that truly serves no purpose. None.

 

4 of our starters would literally need TJS in March for Miley to ever see our MLB roster.

 

Amazing that guys like this, year in and year out, absolutely suck but continue to make millions of dollars. Why in the hell would you pitch this bum every five days and not some young buck that might actually have a future? I just never understand this horse poop.

 

Gross. I remember seeing him pitch against the Brewers last year and thinking 'Wow, this guy is awful.'

 

I agree with Joey, there's no way he should be cracking this rotation even as is. I'd much rather see Suter or even Yo as the 5 starter.

 

Heck go ahead and add Wilkerson and Bubba Derby to that list.

 

Ugh, hopefully he's just a deep depth signing. I don't want to see him anywhere close to the ML rotation.

These have to be from that same bunch of posters who always seem to have a problem with any move the team makes. I love that Stearns and his staff always seem to find these diamonds in the rough on the cheap, and are able to squeeze the most out of them that they can. They absolutely know what they are doing.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Obviously with the Rangers chipping in $ and Hamels' contract being prorated the Cubs aren't paying the full amount...but it's still fun to compare the cost of rotation options #1-7ish for both teams:

 

Cubs - Lester, Darvish, Chatwood, Quintana, Hendricks, Montgomery, Hamels - approximately $101.1 Million for 2018

 

Brewers - Anderson, Chacin, Guerra, Peralta, Miley, Davies, Suter - approximately $17.7 Million for 2018.

 

2018 Team starting ERA prior to tonight's game - Cubs 4.14, Brewers 3.85

2018 Team starting IP/game - Cubs 5.36, Brewers 5.30

2018 Team starters Ks - Cubs 476, Brewers 500

 

LOL!

[danzig6767]

These have to be from that same bunch of posters who always seem to have a problem with any move the team makes. I love that Stearns and his staff always seem to find these diamonds in the rough on the cheap, and are able to squeeze the most out of them that they can. They absolutely know what they are doing.

Wade was great tonight, but prior to this game, he had walked 13 batters in only 22 innings. Walks were why Baltimore waived him.

 

Hopefully he can limit his walks going forward because more than anything else, that will determine his success or failure. He has stuff to get hitters out, but can't hand out to many free passes and succeed. Eventually those baserunners start crossing the plate.

[jjfanec]

Obviously with the Rangers chipping in $ and Hamels' contract being prorated the Cubs aren't paying the full amount...but it's still fun to compare the cost of rotation options #1-7ish for both teams:

 

Cubs - Lester, Darvish, Chatwood, Quintana, Hendricks, Montgomery, Hamels - approximately $101.1 Million for 2018

 

Brewers - Anderson, Chacin, Guerra, Peralta, Miley, Davies, Suter - approximately $17.7 Million for 2018.

 

2018 Team starting ERA prior to tonight's game - Cubs 4.14, Brewers 3.85

2018 Team starting IP/game - Cubs 5.36, Brewers 5.30

2018 Team starters Ks - Cubs 476, Brewers 500

 

LOL!

 

That is beautiful. Especially when the Cubs have really just had the one injury to Darvish all year. The rest of the starters have been very healthy for the most part. I am not sure who outside of Darvish has even missed a start! The Brewers have had Nelson out for the year. Davies missing most of the season. Suter now out for the year. Miley missed significant time Anderson missed time. Guerra missed time.

[ClosetBrewerFan]

He definitely has been greet this year but probably not sustainable. He's had quite a bit of luck. BABIP is .235. - His career is .312. He also has not given up any HRs and only three 2B for a .235 SLG against. Its hard to believe that he can sustain that. His walk rate has been horrible the last two years. Historically he has been under 3 per 9 innings. So if he can get his walk rate back to career norms that will help offset some of his regression to means.

 

While I am hopeful that Johnson made a tweak to improve something, I think the more he pitches the less we will like the results.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Miley now sitting on a 1.53 ERA through his first 29 innings with the Crew.

 

Thought it might be interesting to revisit this thread for some initial reactions. Personal favorites...

 

Wade Miley is far from insurance, he is a bum that truly serves no purpose. None.

 

4 of our starters would literally need TJS in March for Miley to ever see our MLB roster.

 

Amazing that guys like this, year in and year out, absolutely suck but continue to make millions of dollars. Why in the hell would you pitch this bum every five days and not some young buck that might actually have a future? I just never understand this horse poop.

 

Gross. I remember seeing him pitch against the Brewers last year and thinking 'Wow, this guy is awful.'

 

I agree with Joey, there's no way he should be cracking this rotation even as is. I'd much rather see Suter or even Yo as the 5 starter.

 

Heck go ahead and add Wilkerson and Bubba Derby to that list.

 

Ugh, hopefully he's just a deep depth signing. I don't want to see him anywhere close to the ML rotation.

These have to be from that same bunch of posters who always seem to have a problem with any move the team makes. I love that Stearns and his staff always seem to find these diamonds in the rough on the cheap, and are able to squeeze the most out of them that they can. They absolutely know what they are doing.

 

Some of those are from me, and I am by no means a Stearns hater. But I hated the Miley move at the time, and I'll own it. I also hated the roster construction with too many 1B types early on, and not trading Santana, and for the most part that has worked out. It can be argued that he should have traded Santana, but then you start arguing about hypotheticals.

 

Right now the overachieving pitching has masked over the many offensive performers that have regressed this year. Can that continue? We'll see.

[shanedog19]

I don’t know if it is sustainable, but Miley’s stuff looked electric last night. He carved up a very solid Dodgers lineup and made it look easy. Maybe Stearns knows something we don’t by not adding a SP at the deadline.

[PeaveyFury]

His breaking ball was fantastic. Control will always be the question regarding him, but he's truly looked great for us since coming back.

[coolhandluke121]

These have to be from that same bunch of posters who always seem to have a problem with any move the team makes. I love that Stearns and his staff always seem to find these diamonds in the rough on the cheap, and are able to squeeze the most out of them that they can. They absolutely know what they are doing.

 

Lots of people hated the fact that they retained Sogard, Drake, and Perez and acquired Logan. Were those people expected to remain quiet because some other posters didn't like guys who turned out to be great bargains? I love the front office but they're far from 100% right. People here have a right to try to out-guess them and that's part of the fun. If we had somehow run a simulation to compare our moves to theirs over the last 2 years, of course we'd all be destroyed by their track record, but it's still interesting to have our own ideas and see how they hold up.

 

There are lots of people posting here. They're never going to have a unified voice, nor should they, so don't ascribe one to them. Everyone has a right to an opinion about a player. For every move, there are going to be some people who don't like it, but it's generally not the same people over and over again. As long as people have evidence for what they are saying, you should be fine with people having strong opinions even if they turn out to be wrong.

[bill hAll Star]

It's only a small number of innings, but:

 

Miley went from throwing his fastball 65-70% of the time early in his career, 55% of the time the with the O's/Red Sox to now 31% of the time with the Brewers.

 

He seems to have added a cutter and varies his pitches more. Something to keep an eye on.

[rickh150]

Cutters ate up righties, and I was surprised to see he was throwing low 90's with the fastball. I had assumed he was more a high 80's guy.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Cutters ate up righties, and I was surprised to see he was throwing low 90's with the fastball. I had assumed he was more a high 80's guy.

 

I saw a couple crack the mitt at 95. His stuff has surprised me as well.

[RobDeer 45]

I think Cesser is just having s little fun. He’s making fun of himself too, so I don’t think it’s anything to be upset about. Obviously everyone has their own opinion and that’s what’s fun about this site. It’s also fun to get a little ribbing here and there. If you make a bold statement and you end up wrong, it’s ok to have to eat some crow here and there. All that said, he still has several starts left and really need him to keep pitching well. I’m pessimistic, but watching him last night was great. Hope he can do that again.

[LouisEly]

It's only a small number of innings, but:

 

Miley went from throwing his fastball 65-70% of the time early in his career, 55% of the time the with the O's/Red Sox to now 31% of the time with the Brewers.

 

He seems to have added a cutter and varies his pitches more. Something to keep an eye on.

One more thing - I don't know if he's always been like this, but he is also working with Suter-like quickness. Maybe he learned from Suter that working quickly helps keep hitters off-balance.

 

I get the feeling that Johnson likes the cutter - Miley, Suter, Anderson have all been throwing it fairly effectively. It's been very sharp, as has been his curveball. He's also been throwing high fastball and then dropping the curve down, a bit like a LH Ben Sheets.

 

Maybe it will sustain, maybe it won't, but as long as it's working... roll with it.