Trade for “Lesser Pitcher” (Jharel Cotton / Jake Odorizzi)

[Mr Southpaw]

Guess I am missing it as I review this thread. Who suggested it would be Cotton for D Santana??

 

I have seen Puk AND Cotton for D Santana being raised as a question (wondering if the Crew needed to add anything else).

I see people suggest Cotton is the return for Broxten or items from the minors.

 

Can't find anyone that suggested the idea of a 1 for 1. Only multiple people saying they would be upset if it was a 1 for 1.

I do not think they would trade Puk at this time (way to much upside) and Cotton for Santana. I think that would be my starting point and when they say no, ask for Cotton and Jesus Luzardo (20 year old lefty with the same type of ceiling as Puk) and Kevin Merrill (22 year old SS who is a CC look-a-like).

[Dantae]

I guess I just don’t see a potential addition of Odorizzi to this rotation as being a difference maker. He’s a fly ball pitcher that would be pitching in Miller Park. We got an Odorizzi when we signed Chacin in my opinion. If Brewers don’t want to give up the prospects for a more impactful pitcher like Archer, Duffy, etc then I’d be more satisfied if they took a flyer on a Cashner or Jamie Garcia. Of coarse this would be in addition to the signing of Arrieta, Lynn, or Cobb.

[JohnBriggs12]

Cotton is the kind of guy you get if you're already going to get one of the top FA. He'd add depth and an upside which could allow more moves down the line. Maybe Broxton, Wilkerson, and Villar for Cotton and Lowrie? Anyone know if Cotton has any options left? Maybe the Brewers see him as a reliever?

[JosephC]

If I'm the A's, there is no way I'm trading Puk and really wouldn't be interesting in selling low on Cotton either. A straight up Cotton/Broxton deal would be fair, but why trade a starter with upside for an outfielder that has the look of a 4th or 5th outfielder because of OBP/strikeout problems? Cotton is very much a "hold" if I'm the A's.

[TJseven7]

If I'm the A's, there is no way I'm trading Puk and really wouldn't be interesting in selling low on Cotton either. A straight up Cotton/Broxton deal would be fair, but why trade a starter with upside for an outfielder that has the look of a 4th or 5th outfielder because of OBP/strikeout problems? Cotton is very much a "hold" if I'm the A's.

 

Cotton is a hold for sure. Exactly why I'd buy him at the right price. If he's there to be added you do it if the price is right. Anyway you can get more posdible quality pitching in the system you do it. I'd also have no issue giving him a crack over the guerra wilkerson suter (who i want as the long man) gallardo crop. While he's likely to be rough at 5 now, give him some time in the mlb before johnson send him down with a template to work towards.

[MVP2110]

So there seems to be a lot of smoke around Odorizzi. I know he has two years left. But I don't know a ton about him other than that. Is he a #3? #4?

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

So there seems to be a lot of smoke around Odorizzi. I know he has two years left. But I don't know a ton about him other than that. Is he a #3? #4?

 

I'd say that right now, he's in that wheelhouse. Very similar production to what you are going to get out of Anderson, Davies and Chacin. Perhaps you'll see his ERA go down 1/4 to 1/2 a run with a move to the NL. Derek Johnson has also proven he can get prime production out of pitchers willing to roll with his coaching. Low to mid-90s fastball. Also has a good cutter. Extreme flyball pitcher, though, which is worrisome in Miller Park.

[monty57]

Cotton (or someone like him) could be a great pick-up for the Brewers at the right price. I think Stearns has a pretty good eye for young talent, so if we can get a good deal on a talented youngster because he had a down year in his rookie season, that could be a big value play that could help the team a lot going forward.

 

I was perfectly content going into this season with Woodruff and Hader in the rotation. Since the Brewers have decided to keep Hader in the pen, I would be perfectly content finding another "top prospect" to insert in the rotation. I like young, talented, inexpensive guys more than I like old, expensive, declining guys. I also think we'll be better off with all of our current pitching prospects plus Cotton than we would be by trading off most of our pitching prospects to get Archer. Archer would be great, he'd just cost too much in prospects to acquire, so I'm fine with something like Cotton if he can be had for a decent price.

[Mudville9]

Not that this is the case, but if DS can get someone like Cotton or similar arm for cheap, this gives us that much more depth to deal prospects for a top arm mid season if need be. If Cotton looks like he could be Anderson/Davies type by mid season, I would be much more willing to put Burnes/Ortiz/Peralta in a deal. Hopefully those three raise their stock enough by mid season that less of them need to be involved in a deal.

 

Personally, after Darvish signed with the Cubs, I'm more apt to go this route than signing Arrieta or trading for Archer right now.

[packer822]

Broxton and diplan for odorizzi......lets do this....bring him back to the crew......ever since I saw him pitch in Appleton I have wanted jake to pitch for the crew......

[MadThinker88]

Broxton and diplan for odorizzi......lets do this....bring him back to the crew......ever since I saw him pitch in Appleton I have wanted jake to pitch for the crew......

 

Sir I respect that you are a fan of Jake & would like him to "return home". I feel at Jake would be a good add to this team.

Unfortunately your offer would be rejected by Tampa. Its the equivalent of offering $15K for the full restored '57 Chevy in the Tampa garage. Its not enough.

 

I don't feel it would cost Burnes, but I could see Tampa targeting Lucas Erceg & a lesser pitching prospect in a deal.

[brewmann04]

At this point not looking to addlesser pitchers the brewers either go big or roll with what they have

[nate82]

Broxton and diplan for odorizzi......lets do this....bring him back to the crew......ever since I saw him pitch in Appleton I have wanted jake to pitch for the crew......

 

Sir I respect that you are a fan of Jake & would like him to "return home". I feel at Jake would be a good add to this team.

Unfortunately your offer would be rejected by Tampa. Its the equivalent of offering $15K for the full restored '57 Chevy in the Tampa garage. Its not enough.

 

I don't feel it would cost Burnes, but I could see Tampa targeting Lucas Erceg & a lesser pitching prospect in a deal.

 

Dubon and Diplan for Odorizzi is probably closer to the real value that Odorizzi is worth though Broxton and Peralta would also come very close in value. Dubon would be something the Rays would probably prefer over Broxton as it would allow them to move Adames over to 2B where I believe he would be better defensively.

[packer822]

I would give dubon and diplan if it got us odorizzi......

[Warning Track Power]

I would do that deal as well. Diplan’s ceiling is probably Odorizzi and Dubon is a super utility guy in the Majors whose role could be covered by Perez. If that’s what TB wants, I’m good with it.

[brewmann04]

I am not sure Jake O is what type of starter we need at this point but not sure what DS has up at this point heading into Spring Training

[Boomer5]

Jake was a 3 war pitcher in 2015 and 2016. We aren't getting him for Dubon and Broxton, etc.

[packer822]

boomer...u do not know that......they want to shed payroll and usually get rid of pitchers a year or 2 before they hit free agency....

[nate82]

Jake was a 3 war pitcher in 2015 and 2016. We aren't getting him for Dubon and Broxton, etc.

 

Was is the keyword here he is no longer that type of a pitcher. While he is a solid #3 or #4 type pitcher he is no longer that 3 WAR pitcher he once was. Going forward Odorizzi is probably more of a 2 WAR pitcher. Getting Dubon and another prospect is very close to what Odorizzi is worth.

[jonescm128]

The Rays just signed Romo so they need to make a corresponding roster move to create space on the 40 man...

[JohnBriggs12]

Jake was a 3 war pitcher in 2015 and 2016. We aren't getting him for Dubon and Broxton, etc.

 

Was is the keyword here he is no longer that type of a pitcher. While he is a solid #3 or #4 type pitcher he is no longer that 3 WAR pitcher he once was. Going forward Odorizzi is probably more of a 2 WAR pitcher. Getting Dubon and another prospect is very close to what Odorizzi is worth.

 

He's just about to turn 28. There's still a decent chance he can reverse the trend of his last couple years, especially with move to the NL.

[Point Beer Is Best]

boomer...u do not know that......they want to shed payroll and usually get rid of pitchers a year or 2 before they hit free agency....

 

This type of thinking is why fans of small market teams hate fans/media from large markets. "They have to get rid of him and they want to shed payroll so they will just take our leftovers." How is it do you suppose that the Rays acquired Odorizzi in the first place? Their whole business model depends on acquiring high value mlb ready prospects with plenty of team control remaining to replace the established players they are dealing away. They're not dealing guys like Archer or Odorizzi without getting multiple players who project to be MLB starters.

 

I think they would probably ask for Santana & Woodruff as a starting point for Odorizzi. Which is way too much. If they were just going to give him away for Diplan & Dubon, that deal would have been done in December.

[brewcrewdue80]

boomer...u do not know that......they want to shed payroll and usually get rid of pitchers a year or 2 before they hit free agency....

 

This type of thinking is why fans of small market teams hate fans/media from large markets. "They have to get rid of him and they want to shed payroll so they will just take our leftovers." How is it do you suppose that the Rays acquired Odorizzi in the first place? Their whole business model depends on acquiring high value mlb ready prospects with plenty of team control remaining to replace the established players they are dealing away. They're not dealing guys like Archer or Odorizzi without getting multiple players who project to be MLB starters.

 

I think they would probably ask for Santana & Woodruff as a starting point for Odorizzi. Which is way too much. If they were just going to give him away for Diplan & Dubon, that deal would have been done in December.

 

What you said is on point. The offer doesn't follow that. I'd have to assume Ortiz, Ponce, and say Nottingham would be more their flavor on an Odorizzi deal. Santana/Woodruff is far and away an overpay, Santana alone is, but I wouldn't trade Woodruff straight up for Odorizzi. Woodruff is a part of the rotation, removing him for 2 years of Odorizzi where heads up they likely perform equal, isn't helping the team's depth. You still need another SP now and you gave away a #4 upside for a #3 upside and 4 years less control.

 

#4 upside on Woodruff is for this year's stats only mind you. I think he has #2 upside in the future.

[MVP2110]

HH on Twitter says we have discussed Broxton for Cotton. I would do that

[jonescm128]

Twitter HH19 is saying there has been talk of Broxton for Cotton.