Darvish

[brewmann04]

as we get closer to spring training think the years and numbers will come down for these starters.

[brewcrewdue80]

as we get closer to spring training think the years and numbers will come down for these starters.

 

Pretty much guessed on this in Dec, and Jan. Now its Feb under 2 weeks for Pitchers to report. Its absurd the 4 top FA SPs arent signed yet. This isnt like Lohse when we signed him costing a 1st round pick with a shaded history in pitching.

[rickh150]

Super Bowl over, time to make more predictions...

Yu to Dodgers

Arrieta back to Cubs

Brewers get Lynn

Cards get Cobb

All are signed by next week.

[MNBrew]

HH19 you said earlier in the week they expect him to sign by Monday. Is that still true?

 

 

The said that last week too. I'm more curious to see if any SP boycott.

He said that last week referring to the following Monday, meaning tomorrow.

[NOMAAM]

Super Bowl over, time to make more predictions...

Yu to Dodgers

Arrieta back to Cubs

Brewers get Lynn

Cards get Cobb

All are signed by next week.

YU going to the Dodgers would really shock me.

[bluescale]

He wants what Strasburg got. The problem is he's 3 years older than Strasburg.

 

Well, we don't know what he wants, or what he's been offered. The rumors are so all over the place, I don't know what to believe. That's not the point I'm making, though. My point is that I don't believe Darvish feels the issue is the team; it's the offer.

[Brewfan77]

My guess is that he ends up with the Phillies or Cubs. I don't think LA is going to go over the luxury tax for him. Add to that he left a bad taste in their mouths with his ws performance. When all is said and done, i really believe he will go to the highest bidder. And i think he will use the brewers interest to get someone to up their offer.

 

Also a guess, Cobb to the crew for 3/50

[Fear The Chorizo]

Part of the delay with fa starter signings this offseason has to do with how the game is evolving, too....bullpens are becoming more prominent, and even the best starters aren't being asked to go as deep into games - so they essentially become less valuable compared to how quality starters were perceived years earlier.

 

When the top of this crop is asking for their offers to be structured based off how the starter market was established in prior years, they are opening negotiations from an unrealistic position. Bullpen arms are getting paid much more because they are being relied upon more, so the shift in on field value from starter to reliever is also being followed by the shift in contract values, too.

[Bench Coach 5]

There were rumblings that Darvish might make a decision today. Not sure if that was based in any fact of just opinions. In any event, I hope things pick up this week. Spring training is right around the corner.

 

If I had to guess, I would say Cobb for Brewers. Though I would love Yu.

[StearnsFTW]

Officially close the door on Texas for Darvish. They're about to sign B. Colombo anchor their rotation.

 

[Sixto]

How many teams are actually left ? Have a conference call and everyone pull their offers. Let the Darvish team sit in their own stench and scream collusion because no one will mortgage their future on a 32 year old right handed pitcher. Tell Darvish it would be a pleasure to open negotiations back up next year. Send him Colin Kapernick's phone number. Sit back and enjoy the awesomeness

[KeithStone53151]

How many teams are actually left ? Have a conference call and everyone pull their offers. Let the Darvish team sit in their own stench and scream collusion because no one will mortgage their future on a 32 year old right handed pitcher. Tell Darvish it would be a pleasure to open negotiations back up next year. Send him Colin Kapernick's phone number. Sit back and enjoy the awesomeness

 

That would be the definition of collusion, which the owners are on the fringe of being accused of...

[Sixto]

How many teams are actually left ? Have a conference call and everyone pull their offers. Let the Darvish team sit in their own stench and scream collusion because no one will mortgage their future on a 32 year old right handed pitcher. Tell Darvish it would be a pleasure to open negotiations back up next year. Send him Colin Kapernick's phone number. Sit back and enjoy the awesomeness

 

That would be the definition of collusion, which the owners are on the fringe of being accused of...

 

I'll never understand that. Accuse someone of collusion because they won't let you perform highway robbery

[82brewcrew82]

How many teams are actually left ? Have a conference call and everyone pull their offers. Let the Darvish team sit in their own stench and scream collusion because no one will mortgage their future on a 32 year old right handed pitcher. Tell Darvish it would be a pleasure to open negotiations back up next year. Send him Colin Kapernick's phone number. Sit back and enjoy the awesomeness

 

That would be the definition of collusion, which the owners are on the fringe of being accused of...

 

I'll never understand that. Accuse someone of collusion because they won't let you perform highway robbery

Amen! This has everything to do with agents not wanting to lose face after misreading the market and making promises they can't keep.

[KeithStone53151]

[quote="Sixto"

 

I'll never understand that. Accuse someone of collusion because they won't let you perform highway robbery

Amen! This has everything to do with agents not wanting to lose face after misreading the market and making promises they can't keep.

 

Teams can pull their offers if they get annoyed and choose to. But to have all GM's get on a conference call and all agree to pull their offers to screw over the player...are you seriously proposing that?

[82brewcrew82]

[quote="Sixto"

 

I'll never understand that. Accuse someone of collusion because they won't let you perform highway robbery

Amen! This has everything to do with agents not wanting to lose face after misreading the market and making promises they can't keep.

 

Teams can pull their offers if they get annoyed and choose to. But to have all GM's get on a conference call and all agree to pull their offers to screw over the player...are you seriously proposing that?

No, I doubt that happens. I was just referring to the part about agents whining because they aren't getting what they want.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

How many teams are actually left ? Have a conference call and everyone pull their offers. Let the Darvish team sit in their own stench and scream collusion because no one will mortgage their future on a 32 year old right handed pitcher. Tell Darvish it would be a pleasure to open negotiations back up next year. Send him Colin Kapernick's phone number. Sit back and enjoy the awesomeness

 

Yes, that would be the definition of collusion.

 

And how does having one of the league's most marketable stars sitting on the sidelines because of a "wink, nod" agreement benefit the game?

 

I get the argument that the players are making a lot of money, but should the players make peanuts while owners rake in millions upon millions in revenue every year, while justifying raising the costs of tickets, concessions and merchandise by blaming rising player salaries?

[JCREW]

How many teams are actually left ? Have a conference call and everyone pull their offers. Let the Darvish team sit in their own stench and scream collusion because no one will mortgage their future on a 32 year old right handed pitcher. Tell Darvish it would be a pleasure to open negotiations back up next year. Send him Colin Kapernick's phone number. Sit back and enjoy the awesomeness

 

Yes, that would be the definition of collusion.

 

And how does having one of the league's most marketable stars sitting on the sidelines because of a "wink, nod" agreement benefit the game?

 

I get the argument that the players are making a lot of money, but should the players make peanuts while owners rake in millions upon millions in revenue every year, while justifying raising the costs of tickets, concessions and merchandise by blaming rising player salaries?

 

There's a thread on this in the Major Leagues section of the forum, so I'll just say this one thing...

The players signed/extended the CBA right as market valuations of older free agents began to change. So while it hurts, they signed up for/are stuck with a few more years of this.

 

The best thing for players to do would be fight for the fans. Tell their owners that if they are going to keep down salaries, then they should also keep down prices for the fans. That would plausibly give the players public opinion leverage when the next CBA comes up.

 

If I'm Darvish, I'm probably waiting until the fifth day of spring training or until one of the other big three signs. He has no good reason to give an owner a bargain unless some other force makes it look like he's going to lose money.

 

As much as I want the market to start moving, it's really not Yu's fault that the market is stuck. He just happens to be the clear cream of the crop in a year with few suitors.

[Sixto]

How many teams are actually left ? Have a conference call and everyone pull their offers. Let the Darvish team sit in their own stench and scream collusion because no one will mortgage their future on a 32 year old right handed pitcher. Tell Darvish it would be a pleasure to open negotiations back up next year. Send him Colin Kapernick's phone number. Sit back and enjoy the awesomeness

 

Yes, that would be the definition of collusion.

 

And how does having one of the league's most marketable stars sitting on the sidelines because of a "wink, nod" agreement benefit the game?

 

I get the argument that the players are making a lot of money, but should the players make peanuts while owners rake in millions upon millions in revenue every year, while justifying raising the costs of tickets, concessions and merchandise by blaming rising player salaries?

 

I wasn't going in that direction. IF rumors are true, and you ask teams for their final offers and you get them, make a decision or run the risk of everyone souring on the games you're playing. Agents want to scream collusion, I see a climate shift. Agents are mad that teams no longer want to pay 100 million dollars for 34 year old players. If I'm a judge I don't call that collusion, I call it common sense. Just because teams were stupid yesterday, doesn't mean they are obligated to stay stupid today. There are only so many big market teams and they have monster payrolls already. Small market teams can't play at the high stakes table. Sooner or later, something has to give. As far as Darvish being a marketable asset, that's crap. Baseball survived long before him and will survive long after him. I don't have financials in front of me for players and owners, but I'm guessing Darvish isn't eating government cheese anytime soon. And I also understand that the insurance for his Ferrari isn't cheap, nor is the gas for his boat. And those property taxes on his castle must be a killer. My heart goes out to him.

I could ramble on but I need to call my lawyer. McDonalds will not get away with serving hot coffee at the drive thru

[TURBO]

Had Darvish taken care of business in the Post Season last year, his situation might be a lot better.

 

Just saying.

[PeaveyFury]

I actually think that's a very interesting and possibly accurate take, turbo.

[madbad2000]

Had Darvish taken care of business in the Post Season last year, his situation might be a lot better.

 

Just saying.

 

I tend to agree with you. The Dodgers fans that I know do not want anything to do with Darvish because of those last few games. My coworker made the pilgrimage for Game 7 and he gets red in the face talking about Darvish.

[SRB]

Perhaps if the rumors are true that Dodgers ownership intervened to force the Dodgers front office to act irrationally. Sort of strange for the narrative to be that the free agent market is slow because teams are finally learning how to intelligently evaluate players, and at the same time they are discounting Darvish because of two bad IP.

 

And before anyone argues that Darvish's performance some lack of clutch mentality: 2008 CC Sabathia is the most dominant and clutch pitcher I have ever seen and probably ever well see, and he had a bad postseason game against the Phillies. I don't know what's wrong with Dodgers fans that they are angry at Darvish.

[madbad2000]

Perhaps if the rumors are true that Dodgers ownership intervened to force the Dodgers front office to act irrationally. Sort of strange for the narrative to be that the free agent market is slow because teams are finally learning how to intelligently evaluate players, and at the same time they are discounting Darvish because of two bad IP.

 

And before anyone argues that Darvish's performance some lack of clutch mentality: 2008 CC Sabathia is the most dominant and clutch pitcher I have ever seen and probably ever well see, and he had a bad postseason game against the Phillies. I don't know what's wrong with Dodgers fans that they are angry at Darvish.

 

Because they are sore losers.

[kfizz]

There is a significant section of Rangers fans that have the “not clutch” criticism of Darvish. I’ve always found him frustratingly inconsistent. He sometimes seems to screw around with too many different pitches and my perception is that he struggles to work deep into games. But the Rangers are my other team since I live in DFW so my judgment is likely compromised.