2018 Lineup (batting order)

[coolhandluke121]

 

I'm assuming sarcasm in this. It seems your point would be something like, guys need to earn their way to the top/middle of the order and it won't be given to them?

 

Yep. Giving unproductive hitters the most at-bats is dumb. That goes both for trying to have speed and contact at the top of the lineup and for moving your best hitters to 5 or 6 because they're "run-producers". Look through this thread and you see Arcia, Sogard, Villar, Brinson, and Phillips all over the top of the order. Thames, Santana, Shaw, and Braun need the most ab's, period. Despite the optimism some people have for the other guys, even if they live up to the upper end of their projected numbers, they probably aren't much above .800 OPS guys next year. Those other 4 could easily rock .900 or better though.

[KeithStone53151]

 

I'm assuming sarcasm in this. It seems your point would be something like, guys need to earn their way to the top/middle of the order and it won't be given to them?

 

Yep. Giving unproductive hitters the most at-bats is dumb. That goes both for trying to have speed and contact at the top of the lineup and for moving your best hitters to 5 or 6 because they're "run-producers". Look through this thread and you see Arcia, Sogard, Villar, Brinson, and Phillips all over the top of the order. Thames, Santana, Shaw, and Braun need the most ab's, period. Despite the optimism some people have for the other guys, even if they live up to the upper end of their projected numbers, they probably aren't much above .800 OPS guys next year. Those other 4 could easily rock .900 or better though.

 

I tend to agree. If you have a good speed guy that can get on base a ton and be productive, then it makes all the sense in the world to bat them leadoff and have power guys in the 2-5 spots. We don't exactly have that. Villar could be that guy(he was in 2016), so could Brinson. But they need to prove it first. Villar proved it from the bottom of the order in 2016 and moved up quickly. I fully expect Sogard or Villar to start the season in the leadoff spot, that doesn't necessarily mean it's the right call. I could easily be convinced to roll with something like Thames, Braun, Santana, Shaw, Pina, Brinson/Phillips, Sogard, Arcia...that wouldn't really be an educated guess at what I think the lineup will be, just wishful thinking.

[TJseven7]

Villar had a .369 OBP two years ago and Sogard was at .393 last year. Villar has a little more power but I'd still hit him first because he can steal bases. Sogard is left-handed so he can hit grounders to 2b and advance Villar to 3b. Arcia was our #1 prospect so I'd hit him #3 since he's obviously going to be a star. You need that speed to be on base for the cleanup hitter. Phillips obviously deserves a chance to hit at the top of the order too, so he's 4th. He had a .363 OBP in his career in the minors. Then you can go with the MVP Braun, Shaw, Pina, and Thames in that order.

 

Who's Domingo?

 

Hey i just got Villar or sogard at 1 and I want them replaced by an upgrade so...

 

Thames santana shaw braun... braun santana shaw aguilar are my splits. I didn't fail you too badly. :-) I'd also kill for yelch and would bat him 1.

[JohnBriggs12]

Why don't we wait and see what the roster looks like heading into the season? One thing is certain. There will be additions and subtractions. I still find it hard to believe that Villar, who was not the backup at 2B at the end of they year but at best the 3rd string, or 4th string guy, is in any way a lock to make this team much less be the leadoff hitter. 2016 was the anomaly season in what has been a lackluster career overall for Villar.

[coolhandluke121]

Villar had a .369 OBP two years ago and Sogard was at .393 last year. Villar has a little more power but I'd still hit him first because he can steal bases. Sogard is left-handed so he can hit grounders to 2b and advance Villar to 3b. Arcia was our #1 prospect so I'd hit him #3 since he's obviously going to be a star. You need that speed to be on base for the cleanup hitter. Phillips obviously deserves a chance to hit at the top of the order too, so he's 4th. He had a .363 OBP in his career in the minors. Then you can go with the MVP Braun, Shaw, Pina, and Thames in that order.

 

Who's Domingo?

 

Hey i just got Villar or sogard at 1 and I want them replaced by an upgrade so...

 

Thames santana shaw braun... braun santana shaw aguilar are my splits. I didn't fail you too badly. :-) I'd also kill for yelch and would bat him 1.

 

It's not you, it's the whole thread. Villar, Sogard, Arcia, Brinson, and Phillips are all over the top of the order in this thread. That may be long-term ideal scenarios but the thread title says 2018 and I don't think it's realistic. Sogard/Villar in a lead-off platoon would be ideal if they can OBP .370 again, but I seriously doubt they can. I'd trade Brinson for Yelich in a heartbeat.

 

Yelich

Braun/Thames (1b soft platoon)

Shaw

Santana

Phillips/Broxton (hard platoon)

Sogard/Villar (soft platoon)

Pina/Vogt

pitcher

Arcia/Sogard

 

Perez gets some starts at 3b and lf against lhp's and hits 7th with everyone else moving up.

 

Drool emoji.

[TJseven7]

Yeah a guy like yelich makes it all go so well. I'd almost be on him damn the cost. Would likely overpay by most standards because you know what you are getting. Think it was eaton who fetched something silly... that was a bit nuts but for yelich im in.

 

Now if by:

1b soft platoon you mean thames in vs only rhp but not all rhp

2b soft platoon you mean sogard vs rhp only villar vs rhp and some lhp

Cf hard platoon you still find a way to get phillips some ab vs lefties cuz I dont want him pigeon holed yet.

 

Then yes drool emoji

 

I do wonder if villar struggles vs lhp early and we havent made a move if we see a 3 way split at 2b... perez vs lhp... villar sogard split rhp... with sogard getting some ss work vs rhp. The splits are pretty polar and it looks like it could produce adequately in those splits.

[coolhandluke121]

Villar is a little better against lhp's for his career, even with what happened last year. Let's face it, if they're playing him at all, they're hoping last year was a fluke, which means his 2017 splits don't trump his career splits and he's a typical switch-hitter who's a little better from the right side. I'm going with the hard platoon for the most part, with Villar getting some extra starts so Sogard can play a little ss against rhp's a few times a month.

 

Broxton might not even be on the roster. You'll notice I had 13 guys there, but I generally prefer 13 pitchers if you have the versatility to make it work. With Yelich able to play cf and Braun/Perez both able to play the corners, they wouldn't need Broxton and yes, Phillips could play against lhp's too.

 

I definitely wouldn't play Thames against all rhp's. He and Braun both need lots of days off. Thames for mental reasons, Braun for physical ones. And each would get a lot of ph pa's, obviously. I think that would be a dream scenario but it would be dependent on Sogard/Villar being decent.

[Humans Need Water]

The Marlins aren't trading Yelich. Braun's not playing anywhere other than LF. Thames doesn't need lots of days off for mental reasons nor will that happen. If the Brewers don't acquire a 2b then Villar is starting and playing full-time unless struggles hard for an extended period of time while the team is in playoff contention. Barring injury in ST Brinson will be starting in CF - he has 433 PA in AAA and is ready.

 

Dee Gordon is 3yrs+ older than Villar, was already an AS and his 2016 was a sliver better than 2017 Villar. The Brewers believe in him and he would have been out there every day last year working through it if not for the team leading the division for 4 months. It's a new season, he turns 27 so still plenty young and is talented.

 

Filling out the top 4 in the lineup based solely on OBP or OPS is short sighted. Thames, Braun, Shaw, Santana were 2-5 when all were in the lineup together last year and that's probably not going to change. Villar or Brinson will be leadoff (if the current roster doesn't change) with the other in the 6 hole followed by Pina, Arcia. When Aguilar is in there he can replace Santana at 5 as he then moves up to 2. Phillips would be good for 6 spot. Sogard for leadoff as a backup but also at the bottom depending who's in the lineup that's day. Trade Broxton and Perez.

[pacopete4]

The Marlins aren't trading Yelich. Braun's not playing anywhere other than LF. Thames doesn't need lots of days off for mental reasons nor will that happen. If the Brewers don't acquire a 2b then Villar is starting and playing full-time unless struggles hard for an extended period of time while the team is in playoff contention. Barring injury in ST Brinson will be starting in CF - he has 433 PA in AAA and is ready.

 

Dee Gordon is 3yrs+ older than Villar, was already an AS and his 2016 was a sliver better than 2017 Villar. The Brewers believe in him and he would have been out there every day last year working through it if not for the team leading the division for 4 months. It's a new season, he turns 27 so still plenty young and is talented.

 

Filling out the top 4 in the lineup based solely on OBP or OPS is short sighted. Thames, Braun, Shaw, Santana were 2-5 when all were in the lineup together last year and that's probably not going to change. Villar or Brinson will be leadoff (if the current roster doesn't change) with the other in the 6 hole followed by Pina, Arcia. When Aguilar is in there he can replace Santana at 5 as he then moves up to 2. Phillips would be good for 6 spot. Sogard for leadoff as a backup but also at the bottom depending who's in the lineup that's day. Trade Broxton and Perez.

 

This post. Agreed.

[coolhandluke121]

The Marlins aren't trading Yelich. Braun's not playing anywhere other than LF. Thames doesn't need lots of days off for mental reasons nor will that happen. If the Brewers don't acquire a 2b then Villar is starting and playing full-time unless struggles hard for an extended period of time while the team is in playoff contention. Barring injury in ST Brinson will be starting in CF - he has 433 PA in AAA and is ready.

 

Dee Gordon is 3yrs+ older than Villar, was already an AS and his 2016 was a sliver better than 2017 Villar. The Brewers believe in him and he would have been out there every day last year working through it if not for the team leading the division for 4 months. It's a new season, he turns 27 so still plenty young and is talented.

 

Filling out the top 4 in the lineup based solely on OBP or OPS is short sighted. Thames, Braun, Shaw, Santana were 2-5 when all were in the lineup together last year and that's probably not going to change. Villar or Brinson will be leadoff (if the current roster doesn't change) with the other in the 6 hole followed by Pina, Arcia. When Aguilar is in there he can replace Santana at 5 as he then moves up to 2. Phillips would be good for 6 spot. Sogard for leadoff as a backup but also at the bottom depending who's in the lineup that's day. Trade Broxton and Perez.

 

Okay David Stearns, thanks for clearing that all up.

[Devinep]

It seems so obvious the lineup would be set with a 2B with OBP to lead off. Trade for Jed Lowrie If Oak is willing m. They could use OF help. pHI doesn’t seem up to lineup with prospects for Hernandez, unfortunately.

[TJseven7]

Panik is interesting too. Home road splits road 290/350 about 15 hr per... prime age... low Ks (which fits the houston philosophy). Young controlled enough to resell in 2 years. Him at 1 with the core 4 is pretty solid.

[DR28]

So what does our lineup look like after tonight and Santana being traded tomorrow...

 

Im guessing...

 

Cain

Yelich

Braun

Shaw

Thames

Pina

Villar

Arcia

 

Yelich and Cain are interchangable.

[wallus]

So what does our lineup look like after tonight and Santana being traded tomorrow...

 

Im guessing...

 

Cain

Yelich

Braun

Shaw

Thames

Pina

Villar

Arcia

 

Yelich and Cain are interchangable.

 

I think that line-up needs one more good bat, either at 2nd or 1st.

[SRB]

So what does our lineup look like after tonight and Santana being traded tomorrow...

 

Im guessing...

 

Cain

Yelich

Braun

Shaw

Thames

Pina

Villar

Arcia

 

Yelich and Cain are interchangable.

 

I think that line-up needs one more good bat, either at 2nd or 1st.

 

Thames had a .390 wOBA vs. RHP last season, and Aguilar had a .372 wOBA vs. LHP. Properly platooned you're looking at top 3-5 production at 1B in all of the majors.

 

My ideal batting order would be:

 

Yelich

Cain

Braun

Thames/Aguilar

Shaw

Pina

Arcia

Villar (move up to sixth if we get somebody like Walker or Kipnis)

[wildcat83]

Where is the top of this batting order? I can't do Thames Villar again guys. I just can't.

 

FIXED

 

The Marlins aren't trading Yelich.

 

LOL - Hate when that happens.

 

This post. Agreed.

 

DOUBLE WHOOPS

 

 

It's crazy to read back through this thread and see how much changed in about an hour yesterday.

 

For the lineup, I still think CC likes alternating R/L which leads me to think as it stands now:

Cain

Yelich

Braun

Shaw

[tmwiese55]

I think they'll try to find a way to not have Shaw and Thames back to back.

 

How about:

Yelich

Cain

Shaw

Braun

Thames/Jesus

Pina

Arcia

2B

 

Variable is 2B, if Villar rebounds you'd want him back at leadoff and then you adjust. Or if Sogard is like he was last year racking up a 370 obp you can put him leadoff. Or if you bring Walker back that's a bat you want up there. All three options are basically lefties so it gets tough not to have b2b lefites so...

 

2B

Yelich

Braun

Shaw

Cain

Thames

Pina

Arcia

[TJseven7]

FIXED!!!!!!!! YAY!!!!!!!

 

I hope our cap number is 125 mil this year. Signing a pitcher, a 2b and a solid pen piece would look so nice. Until they deal Santana (would they then add another bat?) I'm going to stick with the pipedream buzz I've got going.

 

Cain

Yelich

Santana

Shaw

Braun/thames

Walker

Pina

Arcia

P

 

Santana yelich rest 10, cain 15. Cain 10 at rf, yelich 25 at cf, braun 35 at LF

Thames only bats vs rhp. Rest santana cain and braun vs rhp.

Aguilar stays as Braun insurance and PH #1... literally ph every game. 10 starts plus DH if all goes well.

Broxton Sogard gone. Villar Perez play super utility if (2b SS 3b). Phillips in CS.

If santana has the feared regression swap 3 and 5.

 

Boom!

[brewcrewdue80]

I think they'll try to find a way to not have Shaw and Thames back to back.

 

How about:

Yelich

Cain

Shaw

Braun

Thames/Jesus

Pina

Arcia

2B

 

Variable is 2B, if Villar rebounds you'd want him back at leadoff and then you adjust. Or if Sogard is like he was last year racking up a 370 obp you can put him leadoff. Or if you bring Walker back that's a bat you want up there. All three options are basically lefties so it gets tough not to have b2b lefites so...

 

2B

Yelich

Braun

Shaw

Cain

Thames

Pina

Arcia

 

Wrote this in another thread but I'd assume Cain leads off with Yelich 2 Braun 3 Shaw 4 as you'd rather have a LHB at the plate with a runner at 1st over a RHB with a runner on 1st. Cain also steals more bases than Yelich making Hit and runs for a good lefty hitter to find that massive hole.

 

After Shaw, I'm not sure until the full roster is determined. If you kept Santan he bats 3 Braun to 5 logically.

[pacopete4]

Cain- CF

Yelich- LF

Braun- 1B

Shaw- 3B

Santana- RF

Walker- 2B

Pina/Vogt- C

Arcia- SS

 

or

 

Cain- CF

Yelich- LF

Braun- 1B

Shaw- 3B

Santana- RF

Pina/Vogt- C

Villar/Sogard- 2B

Arcia- SS

[tmwiese55]

Shaw and Thames both have drastic vs LHP splits. Have to think they know this and will split them. That's what hurt of going the route that ends with Shaw at 4 in a non Santana lineup. Get Braun in between them because he murders lefties, same logic they used last year with Thames batting 2nd.

[jdw42434]

A lot depends on who if anyone is traded. With 2 positions available between Braun, Thames, Broxton, & Santana, it is likely at least 1 will be traded. Braun may be too difficult to trade. The other 3 all have value relative to their contract. If we are really going for it, I can't see playing Broxton everyday. If none of Braun, Santana & Thames are traded, I could see the 3 platoon the 2 positions, getting them each about 400-450 ABs (if no one gets hurt). Then if there is an injury to any of those or Cain or Yelich, we have a good fill in.

 

I would go:

 

1 - Cain CF

2 - Arcia SS

3 - Yelich LF

4 - Shaw 3B

5 & 6 - two of Braun RF/1B, Santana RF/1B, Thames 1B/RF

7 - Pina/Vogt C (60/40 split)

8 - Villar (if he returns closer to 2016 form you could move him to 1, Cain to 2, and Arcia to 8)

 

Perez will get ABs at about every position, and could get 1-2 starts per week.

Phillips and Broxton are good OF depth, we could put one of them in RF in late innings for defense, make the bullpen that much better.

Sogard & Aguilar are nice INF depth.

Although that makes 15 guys. Aguilar would probably be the odd man out in that situation.

[coolhandluke121]

The idea of keeping Aguilar with all the talent they have now is laughable and I'm not the least bit concerned that they're considering such a waste of the roster spot under the circumstances. How people continue to assume that someone who can barely even play 1b and had an OPS of .800 OPS in over 4000 minor league pa's is going to duplicate last season's fluke success is one of the great mysteries here. If they have any sense at all, Braun and Thames will be the 1b's even if Santana gets traded, in which case Phillips will get most of the starts in rf with Braun filling in to get his ~120 starts.

[TJseven7]

The idea of keeping Aguilar with all the talent they have now is laughable and I'm not the least bit concerned that they're considering such a waste of the roster spot under the circumstances. How people continue to assume that someone who can barely even play 1b and had an OPS of .800 OPS in over 4000 minor league pa's is going to duplicate last season's fluke success is one of the great mysteries here. If they have any sense at all, Braun and Thames will be the 1b's even if Santana gets traded, in which case Phillips will get most of the starts in rf with Braun filling in to get his ~120 starts.

 

With santana we have 5 of 8 positions locked in with very limited rest. Yelich cain santana arcia shaw with health play 152 games. With braun thames at 1b you'd have all of of rest and 1b covered.

 

Yelich cain santana braun shaw arcia thames. We needs subs at ss 3b. Need platoon at 2b and C. Pina vogt.

 

That's 9. Villar 2b emergency ss 3b. Sogard 2b ss. Perez 2b 3b emergency LF C 1b etc. So we are at 12.

 

What makes us better. Broxton who will play as a defensive sub pr only. While we have phillips in aaa waiting for an injury to be called up. Or 8th rp... with ramirez williams houser waiting in aaa to cycle. Or a big bench bat who is braun insurance at 1b and seems to have a knack for the difficult job of being a ph. I want him hitting once a game. I dont see broxtons need to stay.

[wallus]

Has Braun done any work at first? It isn't that long before spring training.