MLB Trade Rumors Top 50 FAs

[Madhawk23]

Astros definitely need bullpen help and its go time (win now).

 

Why spend money and give a draft pick on a aging closer when they can trade for a cheap, young and controllable closer.

 

Corey Knebel for:

 

Forrest Whitley - finally a legitimate TOR prospect

Yordan Alvarez - upside; lefthanded bat

Corbin Martin - reminds me of Knebel but has a chance as a starter

Elian Rodriguez - lottery ticket

 

Hate to give up Knebel but relievers are volatile and he is a perfect sell high candidate. Continue to build for the future.

 

While I doubt this happens (from either side), I actually brought up the idea of trading Knebel to ATL this offseason in another thread a few weeks ago. So, with Houston potentially looking at getting a closer this offseason to replace Giles, I wouldn't be opposed to something like this. We could then go out and try to pick up a closer like Wade Davis to replace Knebel - since we have payroll flexibility - and still make a run at the playoffs next year.

 

With this said though - there's nothing stopping the Astros from going out and getting a guy like Wade Davis, and keeping their prospects. But, Knebel would save them quite a bit of money and a controllable piece for a few years. As much as I love what Knebel did this past year, the volatility of relievers really scares me - and I'm all for capitalizing on their value when it is at its highest.

[JohnBriggs12]

Astros definitely need bullpen help and its go time (win now).

 

Why spend money and give a draft pick on a aging closer when they can trade for a cheap, young and controllable closer.

 

Corey Knebel for:

 

Forrest Whitley - finally a legitimate TOR prospect

Yordan Alvarez - upside; lefthanded bat

Corbin Martin - reminds me of Knebel but has a chance as a starter

Elian Rodriguez - lottery ticket

 

Hate to give up Knebel but relievers are volatile and he is a perfect sell high candidate. Continue to build for the future.

 

While I doubt this happens (from either side), I actually brought up the idea of trading Knebel to ATL this offseason in another thread a few weeks ago. So, with Houston potentially looking at getting a closer this offseason to replace Giles, I wouldn't be opposed to something like this. We could then go out and try to pick up a closer like Wade Davis to replace Knebel - since we have payroll flexibility - and still make a run at the playoffs next year.

 

With this said though - there's nothing stopping the Astros from going out and getting a guy like Wade Davis, and keeping their prospects. But, Knebel would save them quite a bit of money and a controllable piece for a few years. As much as I love what Knebel did this past year, the volatility of relievers really scares me - and I'm all for capitalizing on their value when it is at its highest.

 

I trust Knebel to be able to repeat his 2017 form a lot more than I trust Wade Davis who was on fumes in the playoffs. Knebel's in his prime and is affordable. You ride him.

[bill hAll Star]

I'm not sure if a team would be motivated to trade 3-4 top prospects for Knebel, who, if he performs, is basically on a 4 year, $40 million contract instead of just keeping the prospects and signing Wade Davis for 4/$60 million.

 

Could still trade Knebel but it would really be lucky if Davis was still sitting there and the Brewers could sign him.

[monty57]

I'm not sure if a team would be motivated to trade 3-4 top prospects for Knebel, who, if he performs, is basically on a 4 year, $40 million contract instead of just keeping the prospects and signing Wade Davis for 4/$60 million.

 

Could still trade Knebel but it would really be lucky if Davis was still sitting there and the Brewers could sign him.

 

Agree. If we are interested in trading Knebel, his value will probably be highest after Davis signs. After him, there's a drop-off in available FA closers, so whoever misses out on signing him may be willing to pay up in trade to get Knebel. As long as Davis is out there, it would make more sense to sign him than to trade away tons of prospects for Knebel.

 

That said, I don't think we'll be looking at trading Knebel unless someone calls with an offer that blows Stearns away.

[Warning Track Power]

The only way I move Knebel is if it is a franchise altering proposal similar to the Richie Sexson deal. Being a small market and being constantly priced out of the SP market, I think the Brewer should invest heavily in a dominant bullpen, which they have a great start with Knebel and Hader.

[KeithStone53151]

The only way I move Knebel is if it is a franchise altering proposal similar to the Richie Sexson deal. Being a small market and being constantly priced out of the SP market, I think the Brewer should invest heavily in a dominant bullpen, which they have a great start with Knebel and Hader.

 

Except that Hader is a starting pitcher......

[adambr2]

I'm not sure if a team would be motivated to trade 3-4 top prospects for Knebel, who, if he performs, is basically on a 4 year, $40 million contract instead of just keeping the prospects and signing Wade Davis for 4/$60 million.

 

Could still trade Knebel but it would really be lucky if Davis was still sitting there and the Brewers could sign him.

 

I'm going to expand on this a bit while also taking it in a different direction of sorts.

 

Suppose WE signed Davis to that deal, kept Swarzek at 2/14 and signed Neshek at 2/12. While also keeping Knebel and keeping Hader in the pen?

 

Would this be the best pen in baseball? Overkill? Would someone like Brandon Morrow for 3/24 be a safer choice than Davis?

 

What would this strategy do for us in terms of net results in 2018, thinking of all the games that the pen coat us in 2017?

 

I'm not necessarily advocating for this approach, just kind of spitballing.

[adambr2]

The only way I move Knebel is if it is a franchise altering proposal similar to the Richie Sexson deal. Being a small market and being constantly priced out of the SP market, I think the Brewer should invest heavily in a dominant bullpen, which they have a great start with Knebel and Hader.

 

Except that Hader is a starting pitcher......

 

His success at this level is strictly as a reliever.

 

I think his future is certainly open for debate and far from a black and white issue. I know the consensus is that Hader should at least get a crack at the rotation and with his upside I can certainly understand why.

 

What I can't understand is why people think Hader is inevitably a starter no matter what and that it's crazy to even consider him for the pen. Hader brought exceptional value to our 2017 pen and there are many , many scouts that believed before last year and probably even moreso now that Hader has a much better chance of success in a bullpen role.

[pacopete4]

What I can't understand is why people think Hader is inevitably a starter no matter what and that it's crazy to even consider him for the pen.

 

 

I think to start 2018 having Hader as a pen arm would be extremely crazy and not a great use of the best arm in our organizations. 2018 is a great year to begin to figure out if he can start or not. Heck 2018 & 19 should be given to him to figure it out. If after two years of starting he's just okay, then put him back in the pen and let him do what he does. What I can't understand is how people don't want to give an electric arm like that the opportunity to start. We finally have a guy that could be, maybe he won't, but could be a legit ace. Let's not waste this opportunity because we might be able to win another 85 games next season.

[bill hAll Star]

What are the reports on Hader's changeup? If he can't reliably throw that before the season, then we know the answer to his success as a starter before the season even starts.

[adambr2]

What I can't understand is why people think Hader is inevitably a starter no matter what and that it's crazy to even consider him for the pen.

 

 

I think to start 2018 having Hader as a pen arm would be extremely crazy and not a great use of the best arm in our organizations. 2018 is a great year to begin to figure out if he can start or not. Heck 2018 & 19 should be given to him to figure it out. If after two years of starting he's just okay, then put him back in the pen and let him do what he does. What I can't understand is how people don't want to give an electric arm like that the opportunity to start. We finally have a guy that could be, maybe he won't, but could be a legit ace. Let's not waste this opportunity because we might be able to win another 85 games next season.

 

Because the stakes are very high if it doesn't work. Your bullpen will suffer and so if it isn't a slam dunk success in the rotation this is something cumulatively that could put 2018 in the toilet. You know he's an elite reliever, you don't know what he will offer as a starter. This isnt 2016 anymore, we're competing just as much as experimenting. It isn't just about having an electric arm. Many scouts just don't think Hader has the pitch mix to make it in the rotation. I'm sure the Brewers have a better idea of this than we do one way or another and I'll trust their call either way, really. But if he can't command his change and slider, he's not going to make it in the rotation regardless of how effective his fastball is.

 

I do truly see your side of it. If you really think his odds are good to turn into a Chris Sale, obviously that's huge. But if our scouts believe that has a small chance of happening, it isn't worth burning 2 years of your best pen arm and a rotation spot on something with a low chance of happening when you're contending now. Like I said, I'm sure our scouts have a better beat on that than we do so I'll trust their judgment with whatever they go with in 2018.

 

Honestly, I'm surprised to see you taking such a strong stance on this when, correct me if I'm wrong but you've been beating the drum of just how crucial a strong bullpen is and how damaging it was to us in 2017 to lose so many games with the pen. More innings would obviously be great, but high leverage innings are also very valuable.

 

Losing what Hader did for us in the bullpen will definitely have some ripple effects.

[monty57]

Putting him in the rotation in September would have hurt the 'pen. In the offseason you can add him to the rotation and sign a couple of good relievers to set up for Knebel, so the pen should be fine. We have money and there are a number of decent setup guys we should be able to get on two-year deals without breaking the bank.

 

Hader should be our #5 so he can be skipped every now and then to keep his innings down, but now is probably the best time to see what he has as a starter. If he fails as a starter we know we can put him back in the pen, but if he succeeds the sky's the limit.

[pacopete4]

 

Losing what Hader did for us in the bullpen will definitely have some ripple effects.

 

This is where we differ. Yeah, I want to win next season and want us too badly but I just don't feel that sacrificing our best arm talent in our system because we might be alright next season. Stearns needs to go out and find guys to replace Hader in that pen. I'm on the side, and maybe I'm in the minority, but I believe this guy is just too dang special of a player to not ride him out as a starter. He might have Randy Johnson type early years but I just believe he'll be special if we let him be. I can't think of another Brewer, ever, that has had the arm talent that this guy has.

[KeithStone53151]

 

Losing what Hader did for us in the bullpen will definitely have some ripple effects.

 

This is where we differ. Yeah, I want to win next season and want us too badly but I just don't feel that sacrificing our best arm talent in our system because we might be alright next season. Stearns needs to go out and find guys to replace Hader in that pen. I'm on the side, and maybe I'm in the minority, but I believe this guy is just too dang special of a player to not ride him out as a starter. He might have Randy Johnson type early years but I just believe he'll be special if we let him be. I can't think of another Brewer, ever, that has had the arm talent that this guy has.

 

We are much more likely to be able to add a high end bullpen arm in the offseason than a high end starting pitcher. Starting pitching in general is extremely valuable, especially with the type of ceiling Hader has. We can't afford to go out and pay sticker price for Darvish/Arrieta, and it's conceivable that Hader pitches better next year as a starter than either of them. It's also possible he doesn't cut it as a starter, but the upside is worth the risk. We can start him in the rotation, and if it doesn't seem to be working in June/July we can make an adjustment. The bullpen option isn't going away just because he's starting in the rotation.. We will surely be able to move him to the bullpen later in the season if needed. I could see that happening anyways when Nelson comes back or Burnes is ready(to limit innings), unless of course he's destroying MLB hitters as a starting pitcher.

[JohnBriggs12]

Chris Sale's first 79 major league appearances were out of the pen, and like Hader, he was highly effective in that role. He seamlessly transitioned to a starter in 2012, and posted strong numbers: 3.05 ERA in 29 starts with 192 K's in 192 IP. The rest is history. Hader's delivery and stuff have been compared more to Sale than anyone else. He's a great weapon in the pen, but I'd rather have 180 innings than 70 from him. As has been stated, generally acquiring relievers is a little more cost effective than top of the rotation starters. Besides, I think his arm will hold up longer as a starter than being used frequently out of the pen in high leverage situations where he really has to bring it.

[FVBrewerFan]

You always seem to use Josh Hader and Chris Sale in the same sentence. Yes, they're similar is some ways. Sale is his first year threw 63% fastballs. Hader? 82%. Early on and throughout his career has thrown slider and change WAY more often than Hader has. People say all the time Hader needs to throw more than two pitches consistently. Actually, he really only relies on FB.

 

That said, I'm not disagreeing that Hader should get a chance to start. I'm all for it. But before we call him Chris Sale Jr., he's going to need to command his slider and change. As a reliever he stuck with his FB. I get it, why not, when you're K'ing everyone with it. As a starter he'll need the 3 pitches. And honestly, the change more than the slider. But he knows that, and the Brewers know that.

[mlloyd10]

Sabathia will be a brewer - 2/$25

[bill hAll Star]

Sabathia will be a brewer - 2/$25

 

I think the way Sabathia finished the season, there will be at least 5 teams lining up to offer that contract to him. And I think CC would choose a lot of other places over the Brewers for that price.

[Roderick]

 

*Also, I know the relationship didn't end on the best terms, but can Lucroy come back to the Crew?

 

Why? I know Pina had a better first half hitting the ball last year, but I think he can put up close to the .750 ops again. Lucroy had a good obp, but no slugging last year I think Pina is equal if not better defensively. Plus obviously cheaper than Lucroy.

[homer]

I'd like to see Alex Cobb if the years are right.

[billymac]

I'd like to see Alex Cobb if the years are right.

+1 lots of incentives in a 4 year deal

[reillymcshane]

 

*Also, I know the relationship didn't end on the best terms, but can Lucroy come back to the Crew?

 

Why? I know Pina had a better first half hitting the ball last year, but I think he can put up close to the .750 ops again. Lucroy had a good obp, but no slugging last year I think Pina is equal if not better defensively. Plus obviously cheaper than Lucroy.

Removing all the past history of Luc and Milwaukee, Lucroy just doesn't fit with the Brewers. He's a guy that wants to catch 120-130+ games - so he's going to go to a place that he will play. One of the reasons he rejected the trade to Cleveland was the fact they weren't necessarily going to use him full time behind the plate.

 

For Milwaukee, Pina is an immensely cheap - and productive - player. I think he wore down a bit as the season progressed - especially when he began taking on a larger role catching. I think he's best splitting duties behind the plate.

 

Honestly, a Pina/Martin Maldonado platoon would have been pretty great - but such is life.

 

In the end, someone will promise Luc a full time gig - and with some decent coin (MLB Trade Rumors puts him at getting $12M a year for two years, which I think might be underestimating him a bit - but not a ton.) His time in Colorado seemed to go well - and the Rockies seemed to like him a lot - so I'm betting that's where he ends up.

[nate82]

If the Brewers are going to sign a FA pitcher I wouldn't mind Cashner or Cobb. I think the Brewers could get Cashner on a 1 year deal with a player option that kicks in if he starts X number of games or is not on the DL for more than 30 days during the season. If the Brewers could get Cobb at 3-years at about $12m a year annually I wouldn't mind that.

 

I would prefer the Brewers just go the bullpen route. Sign Reed, McGee, and Swarzak which would give you a back end of the bullpen of Knebel, Reed, McGee, and Swarzak. This would then allow the Brewers to put Hader in the rotation.

 

The bullpen would look really nice with Knebel, Reed, McGee, Swarzak, Jeffress, Williams, and Barnes. That is a pretty solid bullpen with Jeffress, Williams, and Barnes being the weakest links and they are not even all that bad.

 

Even if the Brewers are only able to get McGee and Swarzak that is still a very good bullpen. Chris Tillman is another option for the bullpen or even the rotation.

[LouisEly]

Cobb is a 30-year-old Matt Garza with a major injury history. Is that what we want?

[Bnowell4evr]

Cobb and Cashner scare the heck out of me. Neither guy could strike me out at this point in their career.