2018 Brewers 25 Man Roster [Latest: Starting rotation set, post #445]

[bill hAll Star]

If you could sell off Knebel for a king's ransom to keep the farm stocked for another 5 years, I'd do it. I'd also spend $20-30 million this offseason (in just 2018 salary) for 1-3 year contracts to basically take every top reliever on the market.

 

I like this idea in theory, and I do thing we splurge on relievers, but other teams won't let us take the top 3 relievers. Other teams have more money than us, it won't happen. We should be aggressive on high end relievers in FA. Wade Davis is probably the only guy I don't think we should look at, though he's likely to get $12-15 million per on 3-4 years and we have a closer.

 

Yeah, the "there are other teams" argument is generally one I also use. That said, if the Brewers wanted to, they absolutely could be the highest bidder on 3 of the top relievers on the market. It's not a great market, but they may have to overpay some guys to make things work over the next few years.

 

You could probably walk off with Swarzak, Watson or McGee, and Wade Davis if you wanted to. I'm not saying that's a great idea, but those contracts would probably be 2, 3, and 4 years, respectively. Probably $7, $8, and $12 million or so annually. Maybe it would be a little bit more given that other teams may get desperate to win one of these battles and bid it up futher, but the Brewers have a lot of money to spend short-term and minimal holes to fill.

 

There will probably be some shuffling of the team because the offense was subpar, but other than 2B, which position can you really argue won't have the incumbent in it again or be filled in-house by a prospect (Phillips/Brinson)?

[FVBrewerFan]

I'd like to see Burnes in the bullpen in 2018, similar to how Hader was used.

 

nah, I think when Burnes comes up he will be in the rotation. He can throw all his pitches for strikes. Now Peralta, I could see him coming up in the bullpen sometime in 2018.

[pacopete4]

SP: (Jimmy Nelson begins season on DL)

1. Chase Anderson

2. Zach Davies

3. Aaron Nola (*trade w/Phillies)

4. Josh Hader

5. Brandon Woodruff

 

BP:

Long- Brent Suter

Long- Jeremy Jeffress

Mid- Jacob Barnes

Mid- Taylor Williams

Setup- Pat Neshek

Setup- Anthony Swarzak

Closer- Corey Knebel

 

Starters:

2B- Caesar Hernandez (*trade w/Phillies)

CF- Brett Phillips

LF- Ryan Braun

3B- Travis Shaw

RF- Domingo Santana

1B- Eric Thames

C- Andrew Knapp (*trade w/Phillies)

SS- Orlando Arcia

 

Bench:

Hernan Perez- Super Utility (can't see Counsell letting him go)

Many Pina- C (vs. LHP)

Jesus Aguilar- 1B (All starts vs. LHP)

Keon Broxton- OF (some starts vs. LHP)

 

*Brewers package Jonathan Villar, Lewis Brinson, Luis Ortiz and another pitcher for Andrew Knapp, Caesar Hernandez and Aaron Nola of the Phillies.

[Madhawk23]

SP: (Jimmy Nelson begins season on DL)

1. Chase Anderson

2. Zach Davies

3. Aaron Nola (*trade w/Phillies)

4. Josh Hader

5. Brandon Woodruff

 

BP:

Long- Brent Suter

Long- Jeremy Jeffress

Mid- Jacob Barnes

Mid- Taylor Williams

Setup- Pat Neshek

Setup- Anthony Swarzak

Closer- Corey Knebel

 

Starters:

2B- Caesar Hernandez (*trade w/Phillies)

CF- Brett Phillips

LF- Ryan Braun

3B- Travis Shaw

RF- Domingo Santana

1B- Eric Thames

C- Andrew Knapp (*trade w/Phillies)

SS- Orlando Arcia

 

Bench:

Hernan Perez- Super Utility (can't see Counsell letting him go)

Many Pina- C (vs. LHP)

Jesus Aguilar- 1B (All starts vs. LHP)

Keon Broxton- OF (some starts vs. LHP)

 

*Brewers package Jonathan Villar, Lewis Brinson, Luis Ortiz and another pitcher for Andrew Knapp, Caesar Hernandez and Aaron Nola of the Phillies.

 

I'd love for your Phillies trade to come true, but I don't think there is any way that the Phillies give up on their only good young pitcher when that is specifically what they are going to be looking for this offseason.

[mrn1ceguy]

I'm thinking this offseason would be better taken in the "One step back, two steps forward." I just expect a lot of regression from this year (especially considering Nelson's absence) so might as well try to really augment the organizational roster at hopefully not to big of a hit to the mlb roster. Note all my actions assumes we can't trade Braun for anything more than a salary dump. If we can move Braun, I would keep Santana and move him to LF.

 

Trade Away:

• -Chase Anderson for a haul because I think he's bound to regress. Haul should be a top starting prospect who was in AA or AAA in 2017, one or two top-100 (or near) prospect, a couple lottery prospects.
  -Santana for a haul because he could regress some and the drop-off to Phillips when accounting for defense may not be much. This haul would involve a top bat prospect who was in AA in 2017, a top ten organizational prospect and a couple lottery prospects.
  -Thames for a good package because I think he's at peak value. This would be a near top-100 prospect and a mlb useful piece (backup catcher, 8th inning reliever, ...)
  -Broxton for a solid package because I think Brinson will be an upgrade making him expendable. This should be a near top-100 prospect or a mlb useful piece.
  -Jungman, Guerra, Vogt, Hughes for small pieces. These will be change of scenery type trades, ideally for players with options or someone who can fit in the bullpen.

 

Acquire:

• -sign someone who can play 2B to a 1-3 year deal (i.e. Walker, Brandon Phillips, Jed Lawrie, Zack Cozart)
  -sign/acquire two 8th relief pitcher (i.e. Swarzak, Neshak or someone from the trades above)
  -sign/acquire bench bat (i.e. a new Aguilar, maybe even a platoon mate for him)
  -sign AAA rebound starting pitcher to protect for rookie flameout
  -sign AAA rebound SS in case Dubon isn't ready to be first call-up in case of IF injury

 

Predicted Roster:

• 1B - Aguilar / platoon half*
  2B - Z. Cozart
  SS - Arcia
  3B - Shaw
  LF - Braun
  CF - Brinson
  RF - Phillips
  C - Pina
   
  Bench 1 - Perez
  Bench 2 - Villar
  Bench 3 - Bandy
  Bench 4 - Bench Bat/Kyle Wren

 

*Aguilar's platoon half could be the Bench Bat or Shaw (and someone like Villar/Perez could be the other half of 3B).

 

• SP1 - Davies
  SP2 - Woodruff
  SP3 - Hader*
  SP4 - Suter**
  SP5 - Wilkerson**

 

• Closer - Knebel
  8th/7th - Swarzak, Neshak
  MR - Jeffress, Barnes, Taylor Williams
  Lefty - WCW / scrap heap player
  Long Relief - Angel Ventura / scrap heap player / someone not traded away

 

*When Nelson gets back, move Hader to pen to ensure he doesn't get shutdown in August.

**After Super-2, bring up Burnes and/or the newly acquired top starting prospect (assuming they are deserving) and move Suter/Wilkerson to Long Relief or AAA as appropriate

 

 

Top prospects ready for 2018/2019:

• -Burnes, Ortiz, Peralta, top starting prospect, Ponce, Derby, Bickford, Hauser
  -Dubon, top bat prospect, Erceg, Gatewood, Harrison, Diaz, Clark, Ray

 

Doing the above allows for the team to open up spots for prospects (Brinson, Phillips, Hader, Burnes, ...) while letting those who took step forward (Arcia, Shaw, Aguilar, Pina, Knebel, Davies) to continue to shine. Also, by doing the step back (mainly in the rotation), the reinforcements ready for 2018/2019 is huge allowing us to quickly move on from any failed players, trade prospects to fill gaps, or trade high on mlb players to free spots for top prospects.

[Brewer Fever]

Seeing way too many people writing off Brinson. Whether by trade or relegating him to the wrong side of a platoon. Reminds of how not too long ago people were casting Phillips as no more than a 4th OF. Thank goodness those people aren't the Brewers GM. Rookies start slow all the time. It's an adjustment. Phillips looked bad in his first couple of stints too. R-E-L-A-X

[adambr2]

Seeing way too many people writing off Brinson. Whether by trade or relegating him to the wrong side of a platoon. Reminds of how not too long ago people were casting Phillips as no more than a 4th OF. Thank goodness those people aren't the Brewers GM. Rookies start slow all the time. It's an adjustment. Phillips looked bad in his first couple of stints too. R-E-L-A-X

 

Seeing a guy as the potential best trade chip in the organization for a possible high end rotation piece is not nearly the same thing as 'writing off' a player.

[pacopete4]

Seeing way too many people writing off Brinson. Whether by trade or relegating him to the wrong side of a platoon. Reminds of how not too long ago people were casting Phillips as no more than a 4th OF. Thank goodness those people aren't the Brewers GM. Rookies start slow all the time. It's an adjustment. Phillips looked bad in his first couple of stints too. R-E-L-A-X

 

Seeing a guy as the potential best trade chip in the organization for a possible high end rotation piece is not nearly the same thing as 'writing off' a player.

 

Right on Adam. My reason to trade him has everything to do with his past history of being injured. He's never played a full season in his minor league career. He's been hurt for a good chunk of seasons the past four years in a row. To me, that is enough of a red flag that if you get a team that is drooling over him, you take their best prospects and move on with Phillips and Broxton. I like Brinson as a player and I get the high ranking. He should be a good player but the injuries really scare me for his future. Has nothing to do with writing him off.

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

Seeing way too many people writing off Brinson. Whether by trade or relegating him to the wrong side of a platoon. Reminds of how not too long ago people were casting Phillips as no more than a 4th OF. Thank goodness those people aren't the Brewers GM. Rookies start slow all the time. It's an adjustment. Phillips looked bad in his first couple of stints too. R-E-L-A-X

 

Seeing a guy as the potential best trade chip in the organization for a possible high end rotation piece is not nearly the same thing as 'writing off' a player.

 

Right on Adam. My reason to trade him has everything to do with his past history of being injured. He's never played a full season in his minor league career. He's been hurt for a good chunk of seasons the past four years in a row. To me, that is enough of a red flag that if you get a team that is drooling over him, you take their best prospects and move on with Phillips and Broxton. I like Brinson as a player and I get the high ranking. He should be a good player but the injuries really scare me for his future. Has nothing to do with writing him off.

 

Prospect-for-prospect trades happen rarely, if ever. If Brinson is traded, I would think it will be as part of a package for an established #2 starter. If you are going to make a play for a pitcher like Nola, Jacob de Grom or Chris Archer, or to a lesser extent Jake Odorizzi, the conversation likely starts with Brinson. Obviously it would be a big package for Nola or de Grom, while the values of Brinson and Odorizzi may make a 1-1 swap attractive.

[brewcrewdue80]

I'm only through page one on comments and don't have the time to read through them all.

 

This is my Hader opinion. He will be a Starter for 2018 and with good reason. You need to see how he performs, give him the experience and go from there. He'll obviously have innings restrictions and you figure that at as the season goes on. It may be something like 18-20 starts and at that point you put him back in the pen where you know he'll be exceptional. Ideally, you get him the experience, and trade for bullpen upgrade as Nelson returns to starts about the same time.

 

Villar will have trade value same as Broxton. comments that they won't have any value is obnoxious. I'd certainly part with at least one of the two.

 

1b is reasonable to try trading one of Thames or Aguilar away. both are clearly better than Jason Rogers, and that was fortunate enough to acquire Broxton.

 

Maybe you move on from Perez, and keep Villar as your Infield utility. With Phillips/Brinson it's time to move on from the OF utility uses that he, Thames seen.

[coolhandluke121]

All it takes is one gm who likes the guy to get something for Villar or Broxton. That said, there's no guarantee someone will. You can cite Jason Rogers, but how often does that happen and how many other teams do you think made a decent offer for him? Keon and JV were both pretty bad this year. I'd definitely give Villar a chance to get back in the .750+ range before trading him for what little he's likely to fetch. Does Broxton has any options left? Because I'd keep him in AAA for depth before trading him after a down year like this as well. Brinson and Braun both seem to be major injury risks, so the return better be good enough to justify compromising your depth after an 86-win year or you're better off keeping him. If they hadn't had to play guys like Villar and Perez in cf, or play guys like Kirk or Franklin at all, they would have probably been in the WC game.

 

I'm normally all for selling and going young, but only if the return is there. And the return could be better if you wait until next year anyway, so I personally hope they stay. It's not like you have to worry about impending free agency or be worried about them regressing after a career year. That would have been a good argument for trading them last year, but that ship has sailed.

 

I'd listen to offers on Thames, but he did end the year with nearly a .900 OPS and they don't have better options right now. I'd just try to reduce his starts. Braun could be a plus defender in ~40 starts at 1b and is capable of hitting rhb's, and Aguilar would continue to get a lot of starts against lhb's. After the season they had, I think everyone deserves to run it back, unless of course you get a really good offer for someone.

[brwrsfan]

Probably get killed for this one, but does anyone think the Brewers will consider moving Santana as opposed to Brinson? I know he's young and his offense last season was great but I think he'd bring back more, given that he's done it at the MLB level, and still has 3-4 years of control.

 

Santana's OF defense also leaves a TON to be desired IMO, so perhaps an AL team might make more sense. An OF of Braun/Brinson/Phillips would certainly improve the defense - or in some cases maybe even Brinson/Broxton/Phillips. Just throwing it out there. If we're going to get an ace type, we're going to have to give up someone big.

[coolhandluke121]

Probably get killed for this one, but does anyone think the Brewers will consider moving Santana as opposed to Brinson? I know he's young and his offense last season was great but I think he'd bring back more, given that he's done it at the MLB level, and still has 3-4 years of control.

 

Santana's OF defense also leaves a TON to be desired IMO, so perhaps an AL team might make more sense. An OF of Braun/Brinson/Phillips would certainly improve the defense - or in some cases maybe even Brinson/Broxton/Phillips. Just throwing it out there. If we're going to get an ace type, we're going to have to give up someone big.

 

Honestly that would probably give them a better chance to maximize their wins over the next, say, 10 years, but it's hard to justify right now and he could keep improving. He reminds me a bit of Corey Hart though, in the sense that I'm not convinced he's going to have seasons like this on a regular basis, and his defense is even worse. Prime Hart had decent range.

[coolhandluke121]

1b: Thames/Braun/Aguilar

2b: Villar/Sogard/Perez

SS: Arcia/Sogard/Villar

3B: Shaw/Perez

LF: Braun/Phillips/Perez

CF: Brinson/Phillips

RF: Santana/Phillips/Perez

C: Pina/Vogt

 

That's likely to be a respectable lineup and could be a really good defense if used correctly. The versatility could allow for a lot of double switches. I would also support moving Braun to 1b, releasing/trading Aguilar, and keeping Broxton for defense, pinch-running, and depth.

[bill hAll Star]

Great to have CHL over here now. Regards, Kerb.

[coolhandluke121]

Great to have CHL over here now. Regards, Kerb.

 

Just noticed there's a Cool Hand Lucroy here. Oops. I'll have to be CHL121.

 

I finally had to migrate over here when the game thread was dead during the Brewers' last loss, when they still had a chance to earn the WC.

[Brewer Fever]

Seeing way too many people writing off Brinson. Whether by trade or relegating him to the wrong side of a platoon. Reminds of how not too long ago people were casting Phillips as no more than a 4th OF. Thank goodness those people aren't the Brewers GM. Rookies start slow all the time. It's an adjustment. Phillips looked bad in his first couple of stints too. R-E-L-A-X

 

Seeing a guy as the potential best trade chip in the organization for a possible high end rotation piece is not nearly the same thing as 'writing off' a player.

 

Yeah, and I'm saying that if people had a grasp on how good the organization thinks Brinson is going to be they wouldn't be suggesting he be used as a trade chip. That bore out with Phillips. He struggled at first then settled in and all the trade scenarios with him in them have since vanished. Now everyone has him as a keeper.

 

Many teams came calling on Brinson and the Brewers refused to discuss him. Had he come up and set the world on fire, he wouldn't be mentioned as a disposable piece here.

[Lathund]

Probably get killed for this one, but does anyone think the Brewers will consider moving Santana as opposed to Brinson? I know he's young and his offense last season was great but I think he'd bring back more, given that he's done it at the MLB level, and still has 3-4 years of control.

 

Santana's OF defense also leaves a TON to be desired IMO, so perhaps an AL team might make more sense. An OF of Braun/Brinson/Phillips would certainly improve the defense - or in some cases maybe even Brinson/Broxton/Phillips. Just throwing it out there. If we're going to get an ace type, we're going to have to give up someone big.

 

I don't see why you'd get killed for that, as I suspect that's actually what they prefer to do, was there to be a choice between them. Bat-only corner outfielders don't seem to command a lot recently, but within that specific market I'm sure Santana would be among the most desired players available. Especially to an AL club. Looking at the type of outfielders the Brewers have drafted or otherwise acquired for the farm system in recent years there's a focus on speed/power type of players who play good defense. Most of them are CF types, and the ones who aren't are plus defenders in LF/RF and could probably do a decent job in CF too. Santana isn't really that type.

 

So taking speed, defense, versatility (Or lack thereof) into account, I definitely think it's something they'd consider. I don't think it's something they'll actively be pursuing and try to make happen, but I'm sure they'd listen to offers. I think it basically comes down to how you view Santana going forward. Some players develop early and essentially remain the same player for most of their career. Some continually, or erratically, develop through their 20s or even later. And everything inbetween. Where does Santana fit? Do the Brewers (Who will know a lot about what kind of person he is, how he responds to instruction, baseball IQ etc etc) believe he will get better, or is this peak Santana? You can obviously never be certain either way, but if you believe this is the peak there's a good argument that you trade him to someone who is willing to pay for what he might still become and not just what he is. If you think he'll get better, keep him and either have a star for the next 4 years or someone who could command even more at a later date.

[coolhandluke121]

That's a great summary of the Santana situation. Every situation is unique and you can't just have set rules like "keep everyone under 27" or "we need his patience in the lineup" or, on the flip slide, "trade everyone after they have their best year because they'll probably regress" or "he's not versatile enough". My general take on Santana is that he can do a little better than this, but his average season will be a little worse. His defense is deplorable. They should listen to offers, but only accept a really good one.

 

I'd also ask him to try 1b in winter ball. His agent should persuade him to try it as well if he has his best interests in mind. It may very well not work out, but it's worth a shot. His big frame could play well there. Every extra inch of height adds close to 2 inches of reach. If it doesn't work out, just go with the flow and plan on keeping him until persuaded otherwise. If he isn't even willing to try it, I'd be more inclined to shop him actively.

[3and2Fastball]

I really like the idea of trading for Jacob deGrom. The Mets will be rebuilding. Let's get that done

[pacopete4]

Wonder how Santana would rate in LF versus RF.

[coolhandluke121]

I really like the idea of trading for Jacob deGrom. The Mets will be rebuilding. Let's get that done

 

I live in NYC and he's always been my favorite Mets pitcher. Something about his effortless delivery, his personality, and his all-around skills made me think he'd have a better career than Syndergaard or Harvey, both of whom were a little too aggressive and cocky in a way that probably contributed to their injuries. I'm not normally in favor of win-now trades, but I'd give up a lot for him.

[Brewer Fever]

Probably get killed for this one, but does anyone think the Brewers will consider moving Santana as opposed to Brinson? I know he's young and his offense last season was great but I think he'd bring back more, given that he's done it at the MLB level, and still has 3-4 years of control.

 

Santana's OF defense also leaves a TON to be desired IMO, so perhaps an AL team might make more sense. An OF of Braun/Brinson/Phillips would certainly improve the defense - or in some cases maybe even Brinson/Broxton/Phillips. Just throwing it out there. If we're going to get an ace type, we're going to have to give up someone big.

 

I have no problem with this. I'm as high on Brinson as anyone here and think the combo of the defensive upgrade he provides and the potential return for Santana are worth the loss of Domingo's bat.

 

I'm not desperate to move Santana but I'd sure be excited to see what I could potentially get for him.

 

Since the Brewers can't just buy talent I think they have to stack small upgrades anywhere they can be found. And defense is a cheap upgrade.

[KeithStone53151]

Wonder how Santana would rate in LF versus RF.

 

Having Brinson in CF, Phillips in RF, and Santana in LF...very few guys would ever get an easy extra base on us with those arms in the outfield. That's the dream

[adambr2]

Doubt Santana would show any better defense in left than right. Probably worse, his defensive instincts already seem pretty weak and he'd have to learn new nuances and angles. Plus his only real defensive asset is his arm which would be less useful in LF vs. RF.