First Base

[JohnBriggs12]

I think we all would love Braun or Santana to play first. It gets brought up multiple times a day here. Since it hasn't happened yet I doubt it happens ever.

 

Santana's problems on defense aren't physical. Way too many balls fall in front of him due to halfhearted effort. That won't change if he's moved to first. He'd be a statue there. Just leave him where he is.

[MadThinker88]

just bring the DH to the only place it isn't - the National League.

Problem solved...

[jerichoholicninja]

just bring the DH to the only place it isn't - the National League.

Problem solved...

 

Not really. We'd still be left with multiple players who should never put on a glove.

[clancyphile]

The fact that Neil Walker has been playing a lot of first base down the stretch tells me the luster is off Thames and that they could be looking elsewhere once again. Thames has been less productive than Carter was last year. Thames has 28 HR and 54 RBI with the season almost over. Carter had 41 and 94. Clearly Carter was doing more than just hitting HR too. He was hitting them with men on base. He had 27 doubles to 21 for Carter and walked 76 times.

 

It would be nice if you didn't always use counting stats to make an argument, but since you did. Thames has 66 walks in 150 less plate appearances, so those are probably about even.

 

Yes, he has 21 doubles to Carters 27...but he also has 4 triples to Carters 1. All of this is in 150 less plate appearances. To say that Thames is less productive than Carter last year is wrong in my opinion. Carter did bash a lot more home runs and drove in more runners, but is that Thames' fault that he had a black hole hitting in front of him for much of the year(Villar), especially in his hot April? Also, he was batting 2nd much of the year. So, he had Arcia(before he started hitting well),the pitcher, and Villar in front of him most of the time.

 

So please, do not use RBI as a way to judge a players worth.

 

Thames has also been batting 1st or second in the lineup for 98 of the 108 games he has started. With Villar's struggles this season, plus Arcia and the pitcher batting 8-9, I'm not surprised he's got a relatively low RBI-to-HR ratio. Nobody's on base when he connects.

[JohnBriggs12]

The fact that Neil Walker has been playing a lot of first base down the stretch tells me the luster is off Thames and that they could be looking elsewhere once again. Thames has been less productive than Carter was last year. Thames has 28 HR and 54 RBI with the season almost over. Carter had 41 and 94. Clearly Carter was doing more than just hitting HR too. He was hitting them with men on base. He had 27 doubles to 21 for Carter and walked 76 times.

 

It would be nice if you didn't always use counting stats to make an argument, but since you did. Thames has 66 walks in 150 less plate appearances, so those are probably about even.

 

Yes, he has 21 doubles to Carters 27...but he also has 4 triples to Carters 1. All of this is in 150 less plate appearances. To say that Thames is less productive than Carter last year is wrong in my opinion. Carter did bash a lot more home runs and drove in more runners, but is that Thames' fault that he had a black hole hitting in front of him for much of the year(Villar), especially in his hot April? Also, he was batting 2nd much of the year. So, he had Arcia(before he started hitting well),the pitcher, and Villar in front of him most of the time.

 

So please, do not use RBI as a way to judge a players worth.

 

Thames has also been batting 1st or second in the lineup for 98 of the 108 games he has started. With Villar's struggles this season, plus Arcia and the pitcher batting 8-9, I'm not surprised he's got a relatively low RBI-to-HR ratio. Nobody's on base when he connects.

 

He's had 200 plate appearances with men on base, 112 with men in scoring position. He's hit 10 HR with men on, 9 of those with just one man on. He's batting .149 with RISP. Of his 28 HR, he has one 3 run HR, 9 2 run HR and 18 solo shots. Carter had 301 PA with men on, and hit 18 of his HR in those situations including one grand slam and 4 3 run HR. So while it's true Thames' opportunities have been somewhat limited, he's been awful in RBI opportunities that he has had.

[JosephC]

No question Thames has some value. But last year Scooter Gennett had some value too and the Brewers were unable to trade him. Even though his contract is very reasonable, who would want Thames? He is terrible in the outfield so he is limited to 1B/DH, and while the .348 OBP and 28 home runs looks great on paper I'm not really sure his bat "plays up" at either of those spots. I think the return would be pretty minimal...probably so minimal that it would probably be better for the Brewers to keep him and hope he can repeat the .348 OBP and 28 home runs.

 

About the only teams that I see that would have any interest in Thames are Kansas City and Seattle. And Kansas City's interest would be dependent on Hosmer leaving.

 

If the Brewers just go with a straight first base platoon right out of the gate with Thames and Aguilar it might be the best move:

Thames against righties = .251/.369/.532/.901

Aguilar against lefties = .321/.383/.548/.931

Neither player has been very good lately but the entire sample size from 2017 indicates it could be a productive duo. Looking at the season statistics, 1B for the Brewers has an .885 OPS (9th best in MLB), .347 OBP (15th best in MLB), .538 SLG (8th best in MLB). It's frustrating that these guys have been bad lately, but they've been good enough where the Brewers shouldn't be looking to dump either of them for next to nothing. I'd be willing to give them another shot and work on areas like 2B/CF OBP, finding an insurance starter (not named Matt Garza!) and adding 3 different relievers to the bullpen.

[brewcrewdue80]

I'd hold on to both Thames/Aguilar. It's a cheap, productive 1b option as those numbers above ^ indicate. Being mid-pack for 1b with these guys is really awesome. #1 and 2 at the position are arguable best bats in all of baseball. 2 more are well within top 15 consideration and a new 5th in Bellinger may be jumping in the top 15 conversation.

 

You're not getting these guys, those 5 teams are spoiled for years to come. There are questionable seasons by the likes of Zimmerman, Morrison, Smoak, and even Hosmer that I'd question being followed up on in any of the next 3years. So now you are approaching the top 10 for under 7mil and top 5 not elite 1b.

 

Let's see Thames have an offseason to heal and work on things before just ditching him as a bad 1b. The Travis Shaw part exists if you do move on with someone anew to play 3b.

 

I just find it amazing how people can't be pleased with a result middle of all in baseball. I'm sorry we aren't playing some MLB Show game where you trade for the best players at every position. If we were just 6games worse in the standings approximately what Thames may have been responsible for winning with his April and B2B GWs vs Cincy, are we even discussing this so hard?

 

At this point, I'd guess if we posted Thames numbers before the season for the cost, the majority here would have been happy with them for the 1st year.

[Crash2303]

both the Red Sox and Indians have been rumored to be looking for a first baseman/DH this offseason. Let's trade Thames & Aguilar to them and clear the way for Garrett Cooper take over. oh wait...

 

joking aside. I like Aguilar. I think his hitting and power potential is still not tapped much in the same way i feel about Santana. I think Thames is who he always was- a 4th OF/1B/PH platoon option. If any team is willing to bite on Thames at all- i say do it. Let Aguilar take over full time this year at first base. watch him slug 40 home runs then trade him next offseason and put either Braun or Santana at 1B for 2019.

[bill hAll Star]

both the Red Sox and Indians have been rumored to be looking for a first baseman/DH this offseason. Let's trade Thames & Aguilar to them and clear the way for Garrett Cooper take over. oh wait...

 

joking aside. I like Aguilar. I think his hitting and power potential is still not tapped much in the same way i feel about Santana. I think Thames is who he always was- a 4th OF/1B/PH platoon option. If any team is willing to bite on Thames at all- i say do it. Let Aguilar take over full time this year at first base. watch him slug 40 home runs then trade him next offseason and put either Braun or Santana at 1B for 2019.

 

Aguilar exposed to an entire season of 75% right-handed pitching would not be good on his numbers.

 

I'd expect something like .240/.325/.480 with bad defense. The homers may be there, but I'd be looking for the next option if we really dealt Thames.

[pacopete4]

I would rather us try Braun at 1B next season during left-handed pitching and let Thames mash up the righties. This would allow Braun to get comfortable there and possibly move into that position full time in the future.

 

As great of a story as Aguilar was last season and he seems to be a great guy, I just don't see it ending well if he were a full-time guy. He also is not very good defensively and is stuck at one position. That doesn't seem to be a great combo for us.

[Madhawk23]

I'm curious to hear everyone's opinion: is it smart/realistic to have two guys on a roster that really can only play first base? I know Thames can be thrown out in the OF every now and then, but let's be honest - that's not something we can do on a consistent basis. So, is it really realistic for us to have two 25 man roster spots locked down for guys that are limited to just playing 1B? Aguilar was a great story this year, and I would have loved to have seen him play even more when Thames was going through his mid-year struggles. But, I do wonder if we caught lightening in a bottle with him a bit this year? With that said though - it's nice to have that righty option to go to when we have to go up against one of those really tough lefties.

 

Just curious to hear opinions on this. I know everyone is probably sick of the Braun/Domingo playing 1B talk, but having one of those guys work a bit at that position next spring (so that they could fill in at 1B periodically if needed) might open up the opportunity to trade Aguilar this offseason? Not sure what type of value someone like Aguilar would really have though? Probably not much.

[bill hAll Star]

I'm curious to hear everyone's opinion: is it smart/realistic to have two guys on a roster that really can only play first base? I know Thames can be thrown out in the OF every now and then, but let's be honest - that's not something we can do on a consistent basis. So, is it really realistic for us to have two 25 man roster spots locked down for guys that are limited to just playing 1B? Aguilar was a great story this year, and I would have loved to have seen him play even more when Thames was going through his mid-year struggles. But, I do wonder if we caught lightening in a bottle with him a bit this year? With that said though - it's nice to have that righty option to go to when we have to go up against one of those really tough lefties.

 

Just curious to hear opinions on this. I know everyone is probably sick of the Braun/Domingo playing 1B talk, but having one of those guys work a bit at that position next spring (so that they could fill in at 1B periodically if needed) might open up the opportunity to trade Aguilar this offseason? Not sure what type of value someone like Aguilar would really have though? Probably not much.

 

I'd prefer to have Braun/Domingo there or some other sort of platoon option, but given that Aguilar has pop off the bench, it's not the absolute worst thing in the world. He's the first guy off the bench when you need some pop if he's not playing 1B. I don't like him in a full season against RHP but he can still slug against righties off the bench if he has to.

[adambr2]

It depends on your versatility elsewhere. Sogard can cover anywhere in the IF and Perez can play just about anywhere at all, so as long as you have some versatility on your bench it's not too big of a deal to carry a 1B only.

[JohnBriggs12]

An interesting name on the FA list is Logan Morrison should the Brewers get trade offers for Thames or even Braun because he can play LF too. Morrison had a break out year, and is projected by MLBTR to get 3 years and $36 million, a much more reasonable amount than say Hosmer. He profiles fairly similarly to Thames so any team bidding on Morrison might be amenable to dealing for Thames, should the Brewers go all out and grab Hosmer.

[bill hAll Star]

An interesting name on the FA list is Logan Morrison should the Brewers get trade offers for Thames or even Braun because he can play LF too. Morrison had a break out year, and is projected by MLBTR to get 3 years and $36 million, a much more reasonable amount than say Hosmer. He profiles fairly similarly to Thames so any team bidding on Morrison might be amenable to dealing for Thames, should the Brewers go all out and grab Hosmer.

 

Same paradox mentioned in the other thread about Knebel and signing Davis. The market for a Thames trade may develop after Morrison signs. If not, a team would just prefer to sign Morrison instead of give something up for Thames. After that, maybe you can trade Thames but now you run the risk of having nothing to sign in his stead.

[MadThinker88]

Interesting ripple into the discussion today.

a) Logan Morrison did not get a qualifying offer. He will become more valuable to team that need power/ 1B assistance and do not want to sacrifice any draft picks or pool money.

b) Carlos Santana do get a QO from the Tribe. Assuming he declines it (not a for lock he does), someone signing him would have to sacrifice draft picks/ pool money..

[adambr2]

White Sox said today they will take offers for Jose Abreu this off-season.

[pacopete4]

White Sox said today they will take offers for Jose Abreu this off-season.

 

Thames and Aguilar straight up. Man, I should be GM.

[Warning Track Power]

White Sox said today they will take offers for Jose Abreu this off-season.

While I would love to acquire Abreu, with Braun not going anywhere and being willing to move to 1B, you have to explore this option prior to using assets to acquire a 1B.

 

Best case scenario...Braun is average at 1B, and the OF opens up for Santana, Phillips and Brinson to play everyday. Thames becomes an elite bench bat, backup 1B with Braun getting time in the OF when Santana/Phillips/Brinson need a day off.

[KeithStone53151]

Our 1st base position hit 268/360/544 good for a 904 OPS. Why exactly are we trying to upgrade that spot? Jose Abreu will be 31 and put up a 906 OPS. Hosmer posted 318/385/498, good for 883 OPS in a career year. His career line is 284/342/439, good for a 781 OPS at the position on the lowest end of the defensive spectrum. I can't see a scenario where we make a move for Hosmer or Thames. It isn't even remotely realistic, and definitely wouldn't be in the best interest of this team.

[KeithStone53151]

An interesting name on the FA list is Logan Morrison should the Brewers get trade offers for Thames or even Braun because he can play LF too. Morrison had a break out year, and is projected by MLBTR to get 3 years and $36 million, a much more reasonable amount than say Hosmer. He profiles fairly similarly to Thames so any team bidding on Morrison might be amenable to dealing for Thames, should the Brewers go all out and grab Hosmer.

 

You should replace "breakout year" with "career year at age 30 that he'll likely never repeat again" and decide if Morrison still interests you. 1 good year shouldn't negate 6 bad ones.

[bill hAll Star]

White Sox said today they will take offers for Jose Abreu this off-season.

While I would love to acquire Abreu, with Braun not going anywhere and being willing to move to 1B, you have to explore this option prior to using assets to acquire a 1B.

 

Best case scenario...Braun is average at 1B, and the OF opens up for Santana, Phillips and Brinson to play everyday. Thames becomes an elite bench bat, backup 1B with Braun getting time in the OF when Santana/Phillips/Brinson need a day off.

 

In theory if everyone stays healthy and Braun plays 1B, you'd have:

 

1B Braun 50, Thames 110 (Braun vs. LHP, Thames vs. RHP)

RF Santana 100, Phillips 60

CF Brinson 130, Phillips 30

LF Braun 70, Santana 50, Phillips 40

 

I left 2 games up in the air at each position. Thames probably takes some of those in the OF or Perez/Villar/utilty.

 

That would mean Phillips faces 20-30 lefty starts but is out there for his defense.

 

Brinson gets shielded from some tough righties.

[Eye Black]

Sign Carlos Santana to play 1B?

 

It would allow for additional roster flexibility without having to use two roster spots to platoon at 1B.

 

Dave Cameron made a good case for Carlos Santana being this year’s top value as a FA: The 2018 Free-Agent Bargins

 

I would be for it. It would be a little tricky to navigate getting decent trade value for Thames either while good 1B options are still on the market or after you have made this move that in essence shows yours cards before you’ve been able to trade him.

[LouisEly]

Our 1st base position hit 268/360/544 good for a 904 OPS. Why exactly are we trying to upgrade that spot? Jose Abreu will be 31 and put up a 906 OPS. Hosmer posted 318/385/498, good for 883 OPS in a career year. His career line is 284/342/439, good for a 781 OPS at the position on the lowest end of the defensive spectrum. I can't see a scenario where we make a move for Hosmer or Abreu. It isn't even remotely realistic, and definitely wouldn't be in the best interest of this team.

This. For years we had zero offensive threats off the bench (2011 - the feared bench of Kotsay, Counsell, Hairston, Felipe Lopez, and Josh Wilson who I don't even remember, or remember that 2014 1B platoon of Overbay and Reynolds, both of whom had a <.700 OPS, plus Elian Herrera, Logan Schafer, and Jeff Bianchi?) Now we have a legitimate threat off the bench, and we want to get rid of him?