2017-08-09: Twins (Colon) at Brewers (Woodruff) 7:10 PM CDT [Brewers lose, 4-0]

[TJseven7]

That was a ball.

 

Yup not close... gave colon one for giggles

[TJseven7]

That was a ball.

 

Yup not close... gave colon one for giggles

[pacopete4]

For the life of me I can't understand why fans always want to blame the manager......it the big scheme of things the difference between the best manager and the worst is a few games a season.

 

It's the players!

 

Yes. This mess is completely on the players. They've flat out embarrassed themselves since the break.

[FVBrewerFan]

Isn't it about time for the old pick the line-up out of a hat routine?

[rickh150]

Isn't it about time for the old pick the line-up out of a hat routine?

 

Or they could dress up in yella

[markedman5]

Cards winning again.......

[topper09er]

too little too late nerd

[adambr2]

Knebel and Sworzak haven't pitched since the weekend and CC has Torres warming up when the game is on the line. SMH.

 

Honestly at 4-0 it doesn't even matter anymore. Might as well let Perez pitch, we're not scoring 5 runs.

 

He had him warming up when the game was 2-0 with 2 outs though. I don't get it.

 

Probably doesn't matter at 2-0, but yeah, I agree with you. Counsell isn't a very good pen manager and seems to follow the crazy rule that the 6th/7th is just too early to use your best guys regardless of the situation.

[OnaBadger58]

Probably doesn't matter at 2-0, but yeah, I agree with you. Counsell isn't a very good pen manager and seems to follow the crazy rule that the 6th/7th is just too early to use your best guys regardless of the situation.

Not sure any manager would be a good pen manager for this team. There are 2-3 solid options and thats about it.

[stoutdude04]

Cards winning again.......

 

I've come to grips with the fact that we may never finish above them in the standings...ever again.

 

[TJseven7]

For the life of me I can't understand why fans always want to blame the manager......it the big scheme of things the difference between the best manager and the worst is a few games a season.

 

It's the players!

 

Yes. This mess is completely on the players. They've flat out embarrassed themselves since the break.

 

He's been a solid part of the problem in multiple games since the break. Terrible decisions with the staff... not just ones that didnt work... putting in the worst in high leverage... but hell they are big leaguers... if they aren't good thats on them right.

 

Managers do pit their teams in position to fail. CC has a few since ASB where he's guilty of that.

[rondoman]

Lmao now he uses Knebel.

[stoutdude04]

For the life of me I can't understand why fans always want to blame the manager......it the big scheme of things the difference between the best manager and the worst is a few games a season.

 

It's the players!

 

Yes. This mess is completely on the players. They've flat out embarrassed themselves since the break.

 

He's been a solid part of the problem in multiple games since the break. Terrible decisions with the staff... not just ones that didnt work... putting in the worst in high leverage... but hell they are big leaguers... if they aren't good thats on them right.

 

Managers do pit their teams in position to fail. CC has a few since ASB where he's guilty of that.

 

I have nothing to back this up, but I'm under the belief that managers have very little to do with the final record. Maybe plus or minus 1 win.

[OnaBadger58]

Managers do pit their teams in position to fail. CC has a few since ASB where he's guilty of that.

 

I have nothing to back this up, but I'm under the belief that managers have very little to do with the final record. Maybe plus or minus 1 win.

Are you telling me that Dave Roberts isn't the best manager in baseball history?

[topper09er]

Probably doesn't matter at 2-0, but yeah, I agree with you. Counsell isn't a very good pen manager and seems to follow the crazy rule that the 6th/7th is just too early to use your best guys regardless of the situation.

Not sure any manager would be a good pen manager for this team. There are 2-3 solid options and thats about it.

 

Its not about the results. When Knebel blows games no one is saying anything about CC. Its about using players who suck in important situations when you have better players available. For example, using Torres against the Dodgers in the 9th with the lead. There is literally NO situation (at least before the 17th inning) in which Torres should pitch with the lead, because he sucks.

[markedman5]

Mccalvy tweet

 

As @AaronGleeman notes, Bartolo Colon is the oldest RHP to throw 7+ scoreless in 23 years: baseball-reference.com/tiny/KiEoY

[BrewCrewBlueDevil]

The Brewers have done nothing to improve their team and now the wheels are falling off. Miller Park is going to be a graveyard in August and September. Not saying they should have overhauled but another quality pen arm and a replacement 2B or CF would have at least kept it interesting. I am hoping I am wrong but several players look inctedibly lost at the plate and that comes down to scouting reports.

[pacopete4]

Just made me sick to my stomach to click on MLB standings and see us in third behind the Cards now. How disgusting it has been since the all star break.

[TJseven7]

25 games since ASB

9-16

Post ASB 2.88 bb/9 avg runs 3.16

Pre ASB 3.34 bb/9 avg runs 5

Post ASB 10.6k/9

Pre ASB 9.6k/9

 

Record POST ASB with 3bb or more 7-5 avg bb 3.5 avg runs 3.66

Record POST ASB with less than 3bb 2-11 avg bb 1.7 avg runs 2.69

 

Discuss...

[adambr2]

Just made me sick to my stomach to click on MLB standings and see us in third behind the Cards now. How disgusting it has been since the all star break.

 

Cubs have been begging someone else to take the Twins, too. We just can't do it.

 

Pretty piss poor team since the break. I think finishing under .500 is more likely than winning the division at this point.

[ZBTMP]

The Brewers have done nothing to improve their team and now the wheels are falling off. Miller Park is going to be a graveyard in August and September. Not saying they should have overhauled but another quality pen arm and a replacement 2B or CF would have at least kept it interesting. I am hoping I am wrong but several players look inctedibly lost at the plate and that comes down to scouting reports.

 

The Brewers wRC+ in the second half is 68. And you are upset we didn’t move prospect capital for temporary upgrades? Stearns could have went out and gotten Mike Trout and it would not have made much difference.

[BrewCrewBlueDevil]

When you have an opportunity to make the play offs you jump at it. Adding Brandon Phillips or Rajai Davis to lead off would not have costed substantial, prospect capital. Another reliever such as Neshek, when he was available, could have been had (Doolittle, Madson, Hand, now that his value dropped). The management did nothing and it appears to me that the team is under the impression that they weren't supposed to compete, anyway. Now, attendance is going to plumet which also affects off season spending. The are still going to have to acquire relief pitching this off season. They could have did it now.

[ZBTMP]

Every team, every year has a chance to make the playoffs. The question is, is the temporary gain worth the future loss of talent. Brandon Phillips had a no trade clause and the best forecasting data we have access to has him for an 84wRC+ rest of season. That’s almost identical to what it thinks about VIllar rest of the season. Rajai Davis has a .295 OBP and a 79wRC+ with mediocre defense, I’ll forgive Stearns for not jumping all over that one.

There is also the big issue of opportunity cost with temporary solutions. The Brewers will need a 2B and a CF in 2018. Villar may or may not be the answer, but how are the Brewers going to find out if he is sitting on the bench. If he continues to suck, you can move on in the offseason. Brinson should be the 2018 CF IMO, but Broxton might still have be able to get hot and carry some trade value in the offseason… not from the bench. If the temporary fixes aren’t good bets to be upgrades and carry far less longterm value, its bad for the organization to pursue them.

As for the bullpen, they added a reliever. Sure they could have added 2, but do you think it would have saved anything at this point. Again, they believe Barnes can be a long term asset. They believe there is a non-0% chance Jeffress can be fixed. If any of those things happen, they have a lot more value than a temporary fix. The focus should be on finding the next Swarzak and not have to waste precious payroll on volatile bullpen arms.

[NievesNoNO]

For me this one qualifies as the most disappointing loss of the season. A shutout loss to Bartolo Colon at home. Missing opportunity to get back into 1st. Still going to be an interesting stretch run will everyone except for the Reds in the mix.