Sonny Gray- Let's GO FOR IT! Here's a plan...

[nate82]

How soon everyone forgets...Lewis Brinson was traded by the Rangers to Milwaukee for a catcher..and a bullpen arm. Think about that. If Texas really thought he was going to be that spectacular, you think they would have traded him for a freaking Catcher and a bullpen arm?? You think if other organizations had Lewis Brinson they wouldn't trade him in the midst of a pennant race to try to "go for it"?? I can tell you who would've traded him by now...Mark A would have, and not thought twice about it. He didn't become a millionaire by being passive, resistant to taking some chances, and most importantly, striking when the time is right. The longer you wait, the better chance you have diminishing returns..he knows that. Not sure why DS doesn't.

 

Your analogy is horrible. Trading Brinson to the A's for Gray would be like trading in stock for Amazon just to get a recent high rising stock. Gray is injury prone this is a fact and he is coming off a horrible year last year. Gray could turn into Lincecum next year and be absolutely worthless.

 

Brinson has more value than Gray has right now and you don't trade from a surplus value for a neutral value. It doesn't matter what Brinson was traded for last year it matters what his value is now. Right now Brinson's value is higher than what Gray's value is. Gray already has diminishing returns so I don't see why MA would even trade for Gray as it would be just buying just to buy. The value for Gray is no where near what the A's are asking for and I believe Gray will not be traded as both the Yankees and the Brewers have said no to them for their top prospects.

 

Both Cashman and Stearns are saying no to their big time prospects tells me that the A's are asking for too much in return for Gray. The A's are going to have to take one of the Brewers, Yankees, or the Astros offers which is less than Brinson or they will be keeping him. I don't see either the Brewers, Yankees, or Astros giving up a prospect like Brinson for Gray and that is the right move.

[adambr2]

How soon everyone forgets...Lewis Brinson was traded by the Rangers to Milwaukee for a catcher..and a bullpen arm. Think about that. If Texas really thought he was going to be that spectacular, you think they would have traded him for a freaking Catcher and a bullpen arm?? You think if other organizations had Lewis Brinson they wouldn't trade him in the midst of a pennant race to try to "go for it"?? I can tell you who would've traded him by now...Mark A would have, and not thought twice about it. He didn't become a millionaire by being passive, resistant to taking some chances, and most importantly, striking when the time is right. The longer you wait, the better chance you have diminishing returns..he knows that. Not sure why DS doesn't.

 

You know that Mark A. ' not thinking twice' about that is part of the reason we got into this whole rebuilding mode in the first place, right? You do know that he hired Stearns for a reason, right? He is the boss, he could force Stearns' hand if he wanted to. Perhaps, just perhaps the reason he isn't doing that is that he is a smart businessman and billionaire aa you noted, and understands that leaving those decisions to DS is in the best interests of this franchise?

 

I'm sure you are a passionate fan and I understand you want the team to win but you would be an absolute nightmare as a GM. Like, drive the franchise right back into the 90s type nightmare.

[Brewcrewin07]

How soon everyone forgets...Lewis Brinson was traded by the Rangers to Milwaukee for a catcher..and a bullpen arm. Think about that. If Texas really thought he was going to be that spectacular, you think they would have traded him for a freaking Catcher and a bullpen arm?? You think if other organizations had Lewis Brinson they wouldn't trade him in the midst of a pennant race to try to "go for it"?? I can tell you who would've traded him by now...Mark A would have, and not thought twice about it. He didn't become a millionaire by being passive, resistant to taking some chances, and most importantly, striking when the time is right. The longer you wait, the better chance you have diminishing returns..he knows that. Not sure why DS doesn't.

 

You know that Mark A. ' not thinking twice' about that is part of the reason we got into this whole rebuilding mode in the first place, right? You do know that he hired Stearns for a reason, right? He is the boss, he could force Stearns' hand if he wanted to. Perhaps, just perhaps the reason he isn't doing that is that he is a smart businessman and billionaire aa you noted, and understands that leaving those decisions to DS is in the best interests of this franchise?

 

I'm sure you are a passionate fan and I understand you want the team to win but you would be an absolute nightmare as a GM. Like, drive the franchise right back into the 90s type nightmare.

 

Nope, I can guarantee you i'd have this franchise winning consistently as soon as next year and beyond. I wouldn't be pinning my hopes on competing in the next 3-4 years on Lewis Brinson, I know that much. It's going to take a lot more than him, and a lot more then this current crop of minor leaguers that everyone seems so high on. As long as Mark A said to me the same thing he said to Stearns "I will worry about paying the bills". Then I have free reign, and will have it turned around in a heartbeat.

 

I'm just as competitive or more so than Mark A is. You have to be. I'm guessing most here aren't, which is why they will wait for the rebuild. I absulotely LOATHE losing, more than anything..I don't care what It is.

[Brewcrewin07]

Okay so the A's realize now they aren't getting Torres or Frazier..thus, why doesn't DS strike now, without Brinson??

 

[KCBrewerfan34]

How soon everyone forgets...Lewis Brinson was traded by the Rangers to Milwaukee for a catcher..and a bullpen arm. Think about that. If Texas really thought he was going to be that spectacular, you think they would have traded him for a freaking Catcher and a bullpen arm?? You think if other organizations had Lewis Brinson they wouldn't trade him in the midst of a pennant race to try to "go for it"?? I can tell you who would've traded him by now...Mark A would have, and not thought twice about it. He didn't become a millionaire by being passive, resistant to taking some chances, and most importantly, striking when the time is right. The longer you wait, the better chance you have diminishing returns..he knows that. Not sure why DS doesn't.

 

You know that Mark A. ' not thinking twice' about that is part of the reason we got into this whole rebuilding mode in the first place, right? You do know that he hired Stearns for a reason, right? He is the boss, he could force Stearns' hand if he wanted to. Perhaps, just perhaps the reason he isn't doing that is that he is a smart businessman and billionaire aa you noted, and understands that leaving those decisions to DS is in the best interests of this franchise?

 

I'm sure you are a passionate fan and I understand you want the team to win but you would be an absolute nightmare as a GM. Like, drive the franchise right back into the 90s type nightmare.

 

Nope, I can guarantee you i'd have this franchise winning consistently as soon as next year and beyond. I wouldn't be pinning my hopes on competing in the next 3-4 years on Lewis Brinson, I know that much. It's going to take a lot more than him, and a lot more then this current crop of minor leaguers that everyone seems so high on. As long as Mark A said to me the same thing he said to Stearns "I will worry about paying the bills". Then I have free reign, and will have it turned around in a heartbeat.

 

I'm just as competitive or more so than Mark A is. You have to be. I'm guessing most here aren't, which is why they will wait for the rebuild. I absulotely LOATHE losing, more than anything..I don't care what It is.

 

 

 

 

Stearns or you LOL (enough said) Thanks man you gave me a nice chuckle today

[DocLuna7]

How soon everyone forgets...Lewis Brinson was traded by the Rangers to Milwaukee for a catcher..and a bullpen arm. Think about that. If Texas really thought he was going to be that spectacular, you think they would have traded him for a freaking Catcher and a bullpen arm?? You think if other organizations had Lewis Brinson they wouldn't trade him in the midst of a pennant race to try to "go for it"?? I can tell you who would've traded him by now...Mark A would have, and not thought twice about it. He didn't become a millionaire by being passive, resistant to taking some chances, and most importantly, striking when the time is right. The longer you wait, the better chance you have diminishing returns..he knows that. Not sure why DS doesn't.

 

You know that Mark A. ' not thinking twice' about that is part of the reason we got into this whole rebuilding mode in the first place, right? You do know that he hired Stearns for a reason, right? He is the boss, he could force Stearns' hand if he wanted to. Perhaps, just perhaps the reason he isn't doing that is that he is a smart businessman and billionaire aa you noted, and understands that leaving those decisions to DS is in the best interests of this franchise?

 

I'm sure you are a passionate fan and I understand you want the team to win but you would be an absolute nightmare as a GM. Like, drive the franchise right back into the 90s type nightmare.

 

Nope, I can guarantee you i'd have this franchise winning consistently as soon as next year and beyond. I wouldn't be pinning my hopes on competing in the next 3-4 years on Lewis Brinson, I know that much. It's going to take a lot more than him, and a lot more then this current crop of minor leaguers that everyone seems so high on. As long as Mark A said to me the same thing he said to Stearns "I will worry about paying the bills". Then I have free reign, and will have it turned around in a heartbeat.

 

I'm just as competitive or more so than Mark A is. You have to be. I'm guessing most here aren't, which is why they will wait for the rebuild. I absulotely LOATHE losing, more than anything..I don't care what It is.

 

PrinceFielderxx1 is that you?

[Brewcrewin07]

I promise you...Mark A writes me a blank check and I would absolutely guarantee you winning baseball in Milwaukee for the forseeable future. That's a fact!

[yfinn6]

I promise you...Mark A writes me a blank check and I would absolutely guarantee you winning baseball in Milwaukee for the forseeable future. That's a fact!

 

[adambr2]

I promise you...Mark A writes me a blank check and I would absolutely guarantee you winning baseball in Milwaukee for the forseeable future. That's a fact!

 

I can't even....this is just gold.

 

I see you've been a board member for 10+ years, so you're obviously not 12. It's just...most people gain a sense of self-awareness over time and don't actually think that they're more qualified than the 30 men in the world deemed most qualified to run a Major League Baseball team.

[Brewcrewin07]

I wonder if the Crew wins tonight, if that will increase DS's urgency to make a deal?? They need help! They could use at least one more bullpen arm and a starter..get that and I think they have a shot at this thing, I really do. ESPECIALLY because the Cubs have to play Arz and wash this next week, if the crew is in striking distance(which they will be), after this series, they have a realistic shot of getting that lead back up to 5.5 or more with that stretch the Cubs have coming up.

[brewcrewdue80]

So you think 158IP in 28Starts of 2.68ERA with 173Ks to 40BBs .209BAA is over-rating

 

Also why are you only posting stats from 2016? Why not his 2017 numbers? 14 starts with 4.79 ERA and a 2.91 K/BB ratio vs 4.33 last year? Doesn't make him look as untouchable when you look at more than his best year.

 

Um because of Colorado. That k/bb ratio is still very good. ERA a holdover on more HRs given up...thin air.

 

As to the Mets comp. Yeah our 4 arent going to be Aces like the 3 they had. The point was 4 strong SPs brought up from their minors, got the Mets to the WS. They got a chance and ran with it. Sonny Gray isnt a 6yr team controlled like these 4possess.

[Brewcrewin07]

I promise you...Mark A writes me a blank check and I would absolutely guarantee you winning baseball in Milwaukee for the forseeable future. That's a fact!

 

I can't even....this is just gold. Right up there with the recent 'I had drinks with Craig Counsell's wife so I know what I'm talking about' guy.

 

I see you've been a board member for 10+ years, so you're obviously not 12. It's just...most people gain a sense of self-awareness over time and don't actually think that they're more qualified than the 30 men in the world deemed most qualified to run a Major League Baseball team.

 

All I'm saying is..I'm too competitive to sit on my hands in the middle of a pennant race and wait for 3-4 years down the road to see if MAYBE my rebuilding plan works. That's why I am shocked DS is..You'd think GM's are super competitive too. Look, I'm not saying empty the farm necessarily but they need at least another bullpen arm and a starter. If they can get those two pieces..I really think they have a shot. Those two pieces SHOULD be fairly easy to get without giving up the farm I would think. If you can do it for quantity over quality, why wouldn't you??

[beekay414]

From what i have seen of him so far...I'm just not ga ga over him like a lot of you are. There have been MANY prospects through the years that come up and start raking instantly and don't stop their whole careers..That makes the ma superstar. Brinson hasn't.

 

To me...if he's the next great thing, he should be doing it right now..you'd see it..but frankly, we haven't. Remember Braun and how he raked when he first got called up?? That's what brinson should be doing if he was going to be this All star like everyone here seems to think.

 

Two words, hoss...

 

Mike. Trout.

 

His first 40 games in the bigs he hit .220 and had a .281 OBP over 135 plate appearances. The best player we may have ever seen didn't even come up and start raking right away. C'mon, man.

[Boomer5]

I promise you...Mark A writes me a blank check and I would absolutely guarantee you winning baseball in Milwaukee for the forseeable future. That's a fact!

 

I can't even....this is just gold. Right up there with the recent 'I had drinks with Craig Counsell's wife so I know what I'm talking about' guy.

 

I see you've been a board member for 10+ years, so you're obviously not 12. It's just...most people gain a sense of self-awareness over time and don't actually think that they're more qualified than the 30 men in the world deemed most qualified to run a Major League Baseball team.

 

All I'm saying is..I'm too competitive to sit on my hands in the middle of a pennant race and wait for 3-4 years down the road to see if MAYBE my rebuilding plan works. That's why I am shocked DS is..You'd think GM's are super competitive too. Look, I'm not saying empty the farm necessarily but they need at least another bullpen arm and a starter. If they can get those two pieces..I really think they have a shot. Those two pieces SHOULD be fairly easy to get without giving up the farm I would think. If you can do it for quantity over quality, why wouldn't you??

 

The jury is still very much out on DS but if the Brewers personnel think Brinson is the next great Brewers player and the same scouts say Gray is a good but not great pitcher then you don't trade him.

 

Agressivenes is irrelevant in this case. You don't give up more than you are getting in return.

 

The Brewers are not a Gray away from matching the Cubs in talent so trading for him using elite prospects makes little sense. If they can get him for Ray and Nottingham great. If they need to add Phillips Im not sure and if they have to add Brinson that's a no unless they sweeten their offer.

[A Swing and A Drive]

Not sure the A's are dying to get Jacob Nottingham back via trade at this juncture. lol

[billymac]

I promise you...Mark A writes me a blank check and I would absolutely guarantee you winning baseball in Milwaukee for the forseeable future. That's a fact!

 

I think you deserve the opportunity, what is your 3 day and 2018 plan?

[paul253]

Brinson has more value than Gray has right now and you don't trade from a surplus value for a neutral value

 

Brinson does not have more value than Gray right now. He might in the future but right now Gray is the more valuale player.

 

because of Colorado. That k/bb ratio is still very good. ERA a holdover on more HRs given up...thin air

 

LOL. You're dismissing his entire season because he's playing in Colorado Springs? Fine then I'm dismissing some of last year because he played in BC which is a pitcher friendly park. And I'm also dismissing Lewis Brinsons numbers too then because surely the only reason he is hitting well is becuase of the thin air.

 

Even if you accept the Colorado Springs argument his ERA for away games is 3.69. Yeah that's pretty decent but hardly dominating. In fact in his last ten games his ERA is over 6. Again I'm not arguing that he isn't a good pitcher. I'm simply saying calling him "untouchable" is ridiculous.

[MrTPlush]

I have hit that "not even worth wasting my time replying" point and I hope some of you guys also get there cause I am a little tired of seeing this guy not only post his opinion, but also reply over and over again.

[bigred]

I promise you...Mark A writes me a blank check and I would absolutely guarantee you winning baseball in Milwaukee for the forseeable future. That's a fact!

 

I can't even....this is just gold. Right up there with the recent 'I had drinks with Craig Counsell's wife so I know what I'm talking about' guy.

 

I see you've been a board member for 10+ years, so you're obviously not 12. It's just...most people gain a sense of self-awareness over time and don't actually think that they're more qualified than the 30 men in the world deemed most qualified to run a Major League Baseball team.

 

All I'm saying is..I'm too competitive to sit on my hands in the middle of a pennant race and wait for 3-4 years down the road to see if MAYBE my rebuilding plan works. That's why I am shocked DS is..You'd think GM's are super competitive too. Look, I'm not saying empty the farm necessarily but they need at least another bullpen arm and a starter. If they can get those two pieces..I really think they have a shot. Those two pieces SHOULD be fairly easy to get without giving up the farm I would think. If you can do it for quantity over quality, why wouldn't you??

 

 

Soooo.... you'd let your emotions reign supreme over rational, thought out decisions? Ummmm....as GM, you would run the Crew into being the laughing stock of MLB. Exactly why you are NOT a GM.

[A Swing and A Drive]

You could start by being the GM in a fantasy baseball league perhaps?

 

I heard David Stearns had on his resume that he won half a dozen fantasy baseball championships in his 20s.

 

Done and done.

[adambr2]

So back on topic, it sounds like Gray is being held out of his next start, so if something's happening, it's happening very soon. A few different ways this could turn out.

 

1) Brewers cave and give up Brinson to deliver Gray

2) Another team caves and gives up a top end package to land Gray

3) A's cave and lower their ask and Gray ends up with us or someone else

4) Everyone holds firm and Gray stays put.

 

I'd be happy with any scenario except #1.

[Brewcrewin07]

Price dropping on Gray..Offer Phillips/others and get it done! You don't think Johnson would love to have him??

 

[adambr2]

My best guess --

 

The A's prefer the Yankees offer to our offer that doesn't include Brinson. They make one last attempt to leverage the Yankees offer to get Brinson from us, we refuse, and Gray heads to New York.

[paul253]

Give them Phillips and give them Woodruff or Ortiz plus another guy or two

[A Swing and A Drive]

The A's could also be trying to get Yonder Alonso added into their Yankees deal to increase the return.

 

If that's not getting Frazier, than A's should look elsewhere (Brewers) and circle back and try to get Florial for Alonso alone.