Getting Lucroy back here

[Greenleaf1]

Can you change a thread title to blue?

[clancyphile]

If Lucroy comes as a cheap acquisition in a trad,e I have no problem. He is one of the best catchers in the league. Never opposed to an upgrade.

 

As for FA... if the Ranger's don't QA him, again, I have no problem bringing him back. Buys time for Nottingham to develop. If Nottingham does a Garrett Cooper in AAA, then it will be a nice problem to have. If it takes time... we got Lucroy to hold things down.

[jerichoholicninja]

Wouldn't work, as Lucroy wants to play for a contender. Oh wait.

 

This wins the thread.

[MrTPlush]

On second thought I would LOVE to bring him back to play second fiddle to Pina. Take that into FA Luc.

[OnTheBlack]

There is no world that exists in which I want any part of Lucroy in a Brewer uniform.

 

 

This seems really excessive given that the guy signed a 5 year 11 million dollar deal as a 3rd round pick IIRC from La Tech and ended up not only being the best catcher in Brewers history, but was also responsible for bringing back our top current prospect, and 3 other very good prospects.

 

I'd love to see Lucroy back in Milwaukee at some point in the future. Maybe as a veteran in 2-3 years when we're contending. I don't know, a lot of things can happen. Trading for him however and giving up talent right now is not among them.

 

And I didn't catch who said it, but not only is Lucroy NOT gonna be given up for cheap, but Texans fans would destroy the front office if they turned around and gave him back to us for the type of proposal initially suggested.

 

Two things could substantially improve the Brewers chances of truly competing this year. A TOR starting pitcher...for which we'd have to give up WAAY too much and I'm not even sure one is available(though I would be interested in Quintana) and another elite bull pen arm...things that teams are going to be climbing over each other to get..including another surprising success story, the team that resides in teh Bronx. One that can scrap a "rebuilding" project and move forward more hastily given that they can spend a G20's GDP on their payroll in a given year.

 

So to recap, love Luc, wouldn't mind seeing him making a future stop in Milwaukee if circumstances made that feasible for both sides but don't think Texas would trade him back to us without wanting to recoup some of their losses and given our current situation, he's really not much of an upgrade even if he does bounce back the second half of the year.

[OnTheBlack]

Lucroy's dour grumpy me first personality wouldn't fit in the current Brewers clubhouse anyways. Unless of course he has a super awesome personality that the public never sees behind closed doors.

 

 

When exactly did we see this awful, me first, grumpy personality?

 

I think this is ridiculous. He was honest last year. Braun almost certainly wanted the same thing, he's just more polished about it. But Lucroy signed a absurdly team friendly deal, wanted to extend...the Brewers didn't want to. Fine, he didn't make a big deal about it. When the subject came up about the Brewers going into a massive rebuilding project, he simply said what almost any player of his caliber and at his stage would say. He also said all the right things about if he didn't get traded and he always played hard.

 

When exactly was he anything but the consummate professional? And frankly we should thank him for vetoing the trade to the Indians.

 

And finally, lets not act like anyone else thought the Brewers were gonna be withing 10 games of a playoff spot in July in the next few years when Luc made those statements. It looked like it was gonna be a long ugly Astros like rebuild.

 

 

I think he just has a serious disposition and he doesn't play the game with the flair that guys like Gomez and Arcia do. The guy put in some work in Milwaukee. Not sure what he did to garner such animosity.

[logan82]

When exactly was he anything but the consummate professional? And frankly we should thank him for vetoing the trade to the Indians.

 

Why? The prospects that were part of that trade are looking pretty good and we could have traded Jeffress for something on top of the haul from Cleveland.

[JohnBriggs12]

I don't share the venom for Lucroy. Heck ownership was out there proclaiming publicly they weren't trying to win. That wouldn't sit well with me if I were a veteran player either. Two moves made by Stearns (Shaw and Thames acquisitions) changed the entire equation and a few others turned to gold as well and the Cubs proved to be mortal. If Lucroy's out there in FA, he's worth considering but for far less than he'd have anticipated a year ago. You can never have too many good players and Pina just might be a one year wonder. That decision's a long,long way off though.

[clancyphile]

I don't share the venom for Lucroy. Heck ownership was out there proclaiming publicly they weren't trying to win. That wouldn't sit well with me if I were a veteran player either. Two moves made by Stearns (Shaw and Thames acquisitions) changed the entire equation and a few others turned to gold as well and the Cubs proved to be mortal. If Lucroy's out there in FA, he's worth considering but for far less than he'd have anticipated a year ago. You can never have too many good players and Pina just might be a one year wonder. That decision's a long,long way off though.

 

That decision's this off-season. At that point, I'm not opposed to keeping Pina as a #2 catcher, or moving Pina in a "sell high" deal.

 

I think the contention window is coming a lot sooner that some others think. Even with down years from Villar and Peralta, the ill-advised Neftali Feliz experiment, and Braun and Anderson missing a bit of time with an injury, the Brewers are about 3 games up in the NL Central.

 

I have no problem continuing the plan of developing, but it doesn't hurt to be thrifty buyers, either.

[OnTheBlack]

I don't share the venom for Lucroy. Heck ownership was out there proclaiming publicly they weren't trying to win. That wouldn't sit well with me if I were a veteran player either. Two moves made by Stearns (Shaw and Thames acquisitions) changed the entire equation and a few others turned to gold as well and the Cubs proved to be mortal. If Lucroy's out there in FA, he's worth considering but for far less than he'd have anticipated a year ago. You can never have too many good players and Pina just might be a one year wonder. That decision's a long,long way off though.

 

 

Exactly. And he wasn't obnoxious about it. He said that at this stage of his career he wants to play for a World Series..and as one of the top 5 catchers in the game and a guy who was probably the most underpaid player in the league for a few years, I think he gave Milwaukee everything he had. And after saying that, he still said all the right cliche stuff, if it doesn't happen, he's happy to continue playing for the team that gave him a chance, etc..etc...

 

I agree, a lot would have to happen for Lucroy to end up a Brewer again, but it certainly wouldn't upset me if it happened. I'd prefer our younger guys panned out and played well so we didn't need to sign a catcher, but things don't always work out. See Kendall, Jason. He'd be a better option than him(I know, not a ringing endorsement.

[Greenleaf1]

Honestly, the contention window has clearly already started. We are here, in July, 3.5 games up, competing for the division and catching up to the 2nd wild card. Our offense is definitely going to be our strength and it is controllable and cheap for several years yet. Our pitching isn't really playoff calibre in the rotation or the bullpen, but if Nelson/Anderson are for real (and they look like they are, even when Nelson has had flashes of greatness before he's never looked this good or this consistent), but we have quite a bit of upper minors depth there to help out this year and next year, plus a low payroll that will allow us to go out and bolster our bullpen as soon as next year, plus some minor league depth to trade for some help too.

 

My point being: I don't see why Lucroy helps our competitive window at all. Pina is getting it done offensively AND defensively, he's cheap and controllable, and despite being on the older side for a new player, he's coming off a VERY strong year last year and has been really consistent this year. We've got plenty of cheap candidates right now for a #2 catcher with Vogt/Bandy/Susac/Garcia, plus Nottingham and Feliciano look like intriguing options for the future (and not even getting to Ghelfi/Houle as other interesting guys in the system). Catcher has become an area of depth for us, maybe not enough to want to trade any away, but I see us being able to fill the catcher's role internally for years to come, and I'm totally comfortable with Pina as the #1 for the foreseeable future.

 

I just don't see the value in spending premium money on Lucroy, a guy who seems like he's on the way down but due to his previous success will still command a pretty decent price in free agency (and the Rangers certainly aren't going to let him go for nothing this month either).

[OnTheBlack]

When exactly was he anything but the consummate professional? And frankly we should thank him for vetoing the trade to the Indians.

 

Why? The prospects that were part of that trade are looking pretty good and we could have traded Jeffress for something on top of the haul from Cleveland.

 

 

Why? Because I think we got better players from Texas than we those we would have gotten from Cleveland. They are looking good, or one player from that proposed trade is looking good? Allen another CF'er isn't doing particularly well. Armstrong was a throw in who wasn't in the Indians top 30 and wouldn't have been in ours and doesn't really count as a prospect. He's a dime a dozen reliever. Chang is hitting under 200 with an OBP under .300.

 

Brinson is higher rated prospect than Mejia and Ortiz is a far better prospect than anyone else in that deal and I think Cordell is the 4th best prospect traded.

 

And the Jeffress argument falls flat. This deal was pulled off right before the deadline, so if we hadn't traded him to Texas, we likely wouldn't have traded him until the next off-season and despite the Thornburg robbery, relievers aren't highly sought after at the winter meetings. Seth Everett was talking about this yesterday quoting Phillies executives when he asked "is there every any discussion about relievers at the winter meetings?" The response was a laugh and the executive said "none." Highlighting the scramble for relievers leading up to the trade deadline vs the laid back approach to trading for relievers in the off-season. So the Jeffress we're seeing now most likely would have been the guy we'd have been trying to trade. Not sure how that sweetens the deal.

 

 

All said, it's kinda a moot point because we tried to trade him to one of the 8 teams on his no trade list from the ridiculously team friendly contract he signed and that team told him that Gomes was slated to be their starting catcher the following year. So that was really a no brainer to turn that trade down at the time. A guy who hadn't gotten paid yet is going to a team that was determined to stick with an inferior catcher the following season without adding any financial benefits.

 

So yeah, I think we made out better with Texas since we weren't going to be able to trade Jeffress to another team before the deadline and the trade Lucroy turned down made absolutely no sense for him. And we ended up with a potential 30/30 CF'er, a 2/3 pitcher and a guy in Cordell who at worst looks like a nice utility player with power and good athletic ability.

 

 

But more to the point of the thread, I still haven't heard how he was a selfish player(which is kinda silly in and of itself since baseball is a individual game...a series of individual matchup's that culminate in a team score essentially). But I'm unclear what he did that left him so disliked by so many? Those people sure seemed to love him when he was putting up 3.5 to 6.2 WAR seasons for the Brewers for the average salary of the 25th guy on the bench.

[Greenleaf1]

Lucroy not so subtly seemed to indicate after he was traded that he didn't like the Brewers very much and that he was happy to leave, so that probably left people with a bad taste in their mouths.

 

He also talked openly about wanting to be traded before Braun set him straight that he was still a Brewer and needed to focus on that. To Lucroy's credit, between then and when he was traded he seemed like he had a pretty positive attitude, although his words once he got to Texas make it seem like he was just keeping it inside better.

 

I also remember Lucroy having a broken hand at one point, and at the time someone told me it was what's sometimes called a boxer's fracture because, whatever his excuse was (I think it was that he dropped a suitcase on his hand), you only break your hand that way by punching something. So after that I always kinda looked at him funny wondering if he had an anger issue. I believe I'd just heard rumors here and there over the years too that he was kind of a gruff, prickly guy in general.

 

So yeah, for the most part I really liked Lucroy when he was in Milwaukee, but I don't exactly look back on him too fondly as a person, despite some of that being based on hearsay. I'm also not on here bashing him personally but just trying to provide some context for maybe why others don't like him.