Starters available

[JohnBriggs12]

With Anderson likely down a month at least, there's urgency to find a starter that fill in well enough to keep the Brewers afloat.

 

There's a lot of names being mentioned as available. Some are at a big price in talent like Quintana and Gray. Others have huge contract obligations like Cueto and the Shark in SF. A few bargain names are out there in SD and a few other places.

 

Personally, I'd roll the dice and get Burnes to Milwaukee. Guys make the jump from AA to the big leagues all the time. Heck the Reds pitcher tonight looks pretty impressive.

[bensheeps]

What's realistic asking price for Gray?

With his years of control left, would he be worth trying to get?

[JohnBriggs12]

What's realistic asking price for Gray?

With his years of control left, would he be worth trying to get?

 

Pretty steep price I would think. I imagine they'd ask for Brinson and a pitcher in the Brewers top 10. Don't see the Brewers giving up Brinson. Maybe a Woodruff/Phillps combo as the centerpieces might do it.

[pacopete4]

Just go in house.

[Eye Black]

Unless it is a starter that they are going to be able to pencil in their rotation for 3+ years, I really hope they don't give up much in terms of young talent for a starting pitcher. I would also be content with the Brewers not making any moves for a starting pitcher this year.

 

Regarding in-house options I think stretching out Hader or Woodruff coming off rehab is more likely to fill a starter role this year than Burnes.

 

Below are a handful of starters in the final year of their contract that may cost very little in terms of talent by picking up portions of the remaining salary owed. I realize these guys aren't exactly awe-inspiring options, but the Brewers could potentially plug a gap by eating salary instead of giving up prospect capital.

 

Jeremy Hellickson, Phillies, 2017 salary is $17.2 million

 

Derek Holland, White Sox, 2017 salary is $6.0 million

 

Marco Estrada, Blue Jays, 2017 salary is $14.5 million

 

Francisco Liriano, Blue Jays, 2017 salary is $13.7 million

 

Some other possible half season rentals that would likely require a more significant return due to either low salary and/or strong performances in 2017 include: Lance Lynn, Jason Vargas, Clayton Richard, Alex Cobb

[MilwaukeeBeers]

In house. I really don't believe were headed for a playoff run, so don't waste future assets.

[Lathund]

Go with an in house option to see what we've got. Since it's likely to be at least 1-2 months and not just a game or two, it should be someone we hope can be a future starter for the long term. If it was 1-2 games then I'd go with Espino or Suter. But now I'd be more inclined to try Hader or maybe Jungmann (Has been doing really well in AAA) in that role. That is, of course, all dependent on how soon Woodruff will be back. I'd use Espino or Suter for a spot start if Woodruff is back after that.

[JohnBriggs12]

I'm not opposed to in-house option but given the standings, they need to roll the dice on a high ceiling guy like Hader, Ortiz, Derby or Burnes to replace Anderson who's their number one or two starter. They might well fail, or they might just be Cal Eldred, 2017 version. Guys like Jungmann, Espino, Cravy, Blazek, and Suter might be adequate to fill in as a 5th starter but they can't replace a sub 3 ERA rotation piece. At worst, maybe give one of those guys a couple starts before the All Star break and hopefully Woodruff will be ok after that.

 

My pick would be Hader if they can find another decent relief arm to take his bullpen spot. Sitting by, throwing up your hands and just saying, well it's over and we can't do anything about it doesn't sit well. An under the radar trade target for me would be Jhoulys Chacin. He's 5 for 5 in quality starts in June, is cheap and would be a rental. He's capable of replicating Anderson's production for a month or 6 weeks. He might cost one prospect, but that's a risk they need to take. If July is a disaster, trade him and get a similar type prospect back. If they're still in it they can drop their most ineffective starer, likely Garza in favor of a rotation of Anderson, Nelson, Davies, Guerra and Chacin once Anderson returns.

 

If Davies can step up and Guerra gets his act together, they can keep their head above water, but the next month is critical. The Cubs aren't getting any healthier either but they won't hesitate to find fixes for their rotation.

[ZBTMP]

We shall see if he makes his start tonight in Biloxi, but my guess is Wilkerson gets the call. There is a chance he might actually do quite well.

[A Swing and A Drive]

Is Aaron Wilkerson already on the 40-man roster? If so, that would be a good guess.

[A Swing and A Drive]

I just checked and Wilkerson is not on the 40 man roster. So my guess is they go with Jungmann, as he's been pitching well enough to warrent a call-up.

 

Any slim playoff hopes the Brewers may have been harboring likely are circling the drain with this Anderson injury, IMO.

[JosephC]

The A's wouldn't give Sonny Gray away but his price-tag may be less than one would expect. He had a bad year last year. He's been solid but not great this year but has missed some time. His FIP is a good 3.60 but the ERA is 4.45 and the WHIP is 1.35. What likely worries most teams would be the same thing that worried teams when he was drafted. 5-10, 190. Lots of concern then about how long a hard thrower like him would hold up considering how small he is.

 

The A's are also in a tough spot with him because they are probably not in the position to give him a long-term contract. How can they give a smallish, hard-throwing pitcher a long-term deal who was below replacement level last year (fangraphs actually credited him as being a 0.7 WAR player in 2016, questionable at best with an ERA of 5.69 and a WHIP of 1.50)? If they think he'll bounce back to a 2015 performance then he's a "hold" all the way and they try to move him for more next year. But if they think he'll stick in "good but not great" territory over the next year and a half then they could be motivated to move him now. They are 1 of only 2 teams in the AL which doesn't appear to have a chance for the playoffs so now might be the time.

 

Also, the starting pitching market could be flooded in a few weeks:

http://nypost.com/2017/05/13/why-mlb-trades-may-fly-early-with-a-loaded-pitching-market/

If so the closer it gets to the trade deadline and more teams become sellers...more pitchers hit the market and the return for Gray goes down considering all the available options.

 

I wouldn't be all that shocked if Gray was involved in a deal something like this:

 

Brewers get:

RHP-Sonny Gray

 

A's get:

RHP-Luis Ortiz

OF-Ryan Cordell

RHP-Aaron Wilkerson

 

I wouldn't do that deal because Ortiz is one of the players that would be on my no-trade list but that's kind of what I would expect with a Gray trade.

[ZBTMP]

I just checked and Wilkerson is not on the 40 man roster. So my guess is they go with Jungmann, as he's been pitching well enough to warrent a call-up.

 

Any slim playoff hopes the Brewers may have been harboring likely are circling the drain with this Anderson injury, IMO.

 

Wilkerson is Rule 5 eligible this offseason so the Brewers may want to determine if he can get MLB hitters out before that point. As an ardent defender of Michael Reed, even I must concede his 40 man spot and future in this organization is tenuous at best. Yadiel Rivera still hits like a pitcher and is in witness protection. The Brewers have options to find a roster spot.

[Greenleaf1]

Yesterday it was said that Woodruff should be available right around the ASB. This means that we basically need someone to cover for 2 weeks until Woodruff is ready to take that spot in the rotation.

 

My vote would be for either Wilkerson or Blazek, as both have done very well this year. As much as I'd love to go with Burnes, I think that would be jumping the gun a bit and I'd hate to see us screw up the good thing we got going with Burnes right now. A year from now in the same spot and I'd probably say Burnes for sure, but for now I'd like to see some of these more peripheral guys finally get their shot, and it's been too long for Wilkerson especially.

 

Monday would be Blazek's next day to pitch which works in his favor, we'll see if Wilkerson pitches today or not. If he doesn't, then there's your answer.

 

In the short term, I expect they'll bring up another bullpen arm until they need the starter on Monday, probably Jungmann or Lopez (I'm hoping Lopez).

 

Jungmann is probably the only guy currently on the 40-man who could be called up to start for Anderson, and he's done well too, but I just don't have much faith in Jungmann anymore and would like to see them try something else. I've always been a Blazek fan and I feel like he's gotten a bad rap because of injuries, but I think he has the stuff to really produce at the major league level if he can stay healthy. Never would've thought that he'd do it as a starter, but we'll see I guess.

[uwbadgers]

My vote would be Jungmann.

 

Going into the season I felt like main goal for this team was to figure out what they had moving forward. Who were the players and who were the pretenders? In a previous thread, it was discussed the number of promising players that will be Rule 5 eligible after this season and the need to find room on the 40 man roster for them.

 

Although I'm not overly confident in Jungmann in the rotation, I do feel strongly that it's now or never for him. If he can't get it done this season in the majors, then he should no longer have a spot on the 40 man roster moving forward. Putting him in the rotation now will answer that question.

[JosephC]

I like trying Hader. Considering how poor the bullpen has been, it might be better to keep him there if he was pitching every other day. But it doesn't seem like the Brewers want to having him throwing on consecutive days, and lately he's only gotten an appearance once every four days. If he continues on that type of schedule, I'd rather just have him in the rotation throwing every fifth day. They were limiting him to about 90 pitches per outing in AAA, so probably could only depend on 5'ish innings per start but I think he's definitely shown enough in his bullpen appearances where he should get a MLB look as a starter.

[SoCalBrewfan]

I could be wrong but I don't get the sense that the Brewers feel the same sense of urgency as some posters do. I would predict that they don't go outside the org...if they do it will be a scrap heap guy or another team's salary dump. This current stretch against non-contenders, with Braun and Villar back, could well be viewed as a litmus test for whether it's worthwhile to invest some future resources in the current season. If so, the early results haven't impressed. By the same token, the response to the Anderson injury might tell us how the front office is thinking. Stearns clearly loves tinkering with his roster, and he's done IMO a great job selling assets for present and future value, but we haven't seen how he responds as a buyer rather than a seller.

 

They're also running out of obvious 40-man roster moves. I assume they won't put Houser on the 60-day DL as it will impact his service time and salary. Michael Reed seems like the most likely to be an odd man out at this point, followed by Yadiel Rivera. Everyone else on the 40 seems like they're either playing a role in the majors or viewed as a future asset, but Reed and Rivera both seem to have slipped down (or off?) the prospect depth chart...I can't see either one on the 40 next spring. Moving Rivera makes them somewhat brittle as they would then have zero non-40 infielders in reserve, but with strong major league depth plus DeJesus and Dubon in AAA, that might not matter much.

 

All that to say, my guess is that they play for the short term and look to Woodruff as the eventual replacement, as Greenleaf said. For the short term Espino starts and Jungmann or Cravy is called up to fill that bullpen role. Less likely but also possible: Reed DFA and Blazek or Wilkerson called up to start. Not likely: trade prospects for a name starter.

 

If Guerra continues to stink, though, things will get really interesting.

[Greenleaf1]

For what it's worth, I believe the 40-man roster is at 39 after Franklin's DFA, so they wouldn't need to DFA anyone in order to add Blazek or Wilkerson to the 40-man.

 

This open spot would make it very convenient to give one of these guys a shot.

[recte44]

Jungmann please.

 

He's not the "good Jungmann", he's not the "bad Jungmann".

 

Somewhere in between there's a workhorse 4.50 ERA type guy. If there's one thing our rotation needs more of right now, it's length. Stop killing the bullpen and let's get a guy who can give us 6+ innings on a consistent basis.

[SoCalBrewfan]

Oh, yeah...have already forgotten that Franklin ever existed. Never mind...

 

Yeah, that makes one of those moves seem very likely.

[Boomer5]

It will be in house or a guy we pick up from DFA/release like a Millone type.

[monty57]

With Hader going multiple innings in relief last night, he probably won't be used for several days anyhow, so might as well just let him get the start and bring up someone who can help in the bullpen right away.

[Austin Tatious]

I'd keep it in house. I'd keep a laser focus on the big picture. We have some prospects like Woodruff, and even Burnes eventually, who may become stalwarts. Maybe Burnes ends up being Greg Maddux or Jake Arrieta. His performance and numbers speak for themselves. He's roaring through the minors as a pitcher the way Ryan Braun once did as a hitter.

 

Chase, Nelson, Woodruff, Burnes, and Davies. No need to get a middling starter from somewhere else. The difference from when we were signing all the Suppans and Loopers and Lohses et al, is that we have some in-house guys. If Ortiz can work into later innings, he may be a factor. I'd try to get him to lose 40 lb though.

 

Others in our system may be solid relievers, when you look at a number of guys. If Hader doesn't turn the corner on command, he can be a bullpen guy, but there are also guys like Wang, Ponce, Taylor Williams, Bickford, maybe even Medeiros. Who knows what Kirby can be if he gets healthy. He was highly regarded, pre-injury. Devin Williams may be a decent reliever once he's healthy too.

 

You'd still like some top echelon pitching prospects but at least we have some bodies who may come up over the next 1-2 years. I don't want to disturb any of that over some second rate set up reliever who will cost an arm and a leg.

[MrTPlush]

Austin you were so optimistic in that post yet our arguably highest ceiling pitcher is hopefully a backend innings eater? Now that Josh Hader is putting together another control troubled year inching towards the bullpen I'm not sure there is a guy who is a better pitching prospect than Luis Ortiz. Corbin Burnes isn't really known for having great stuff, but he has shown incredible control and limiting homeruns so far in his pro career. He could be one of those not so flashy low 3 ERA guys. He may be the only guy near Ortiz level.

 

Anyway neither of these guys are 2017 options as a starter to stay on topic. Burnes would definitely hit an innings limit before proving enough for a call up.

[wildcat2237]

Austin you were so optimistic in that post yet our arguably highest ceiling pitcher is hopefully a backend innings eater? Now that Josh Hader is putting together another control troubled year inching towards the bullpen I'm not sure there is a guy who is a better pitching prospect than Luis Ortiz. Corbin Burnes isn't really known for having great stuff, but he has shown incredible control and limiting homeruns so far in his pro career. He could be one of those not so flashy low 3 ERA guys. He may be the only guy near Ortiz level.

 

Anyway neither of these guys are 2017 options as a starter to stay on topic. Burnes would definitely hit an innings limit before proving enough for a call up.

 

Anybody have any reports on Cody Ponce? I though I remembered hearing he had some nasty stuff and a high ceiling? His numbers at A+ have been pretty pedestrian but he may be pitching to contact.