Brewers claim Stephen Vogt on waivers

[JohnBriggs12]

It's true that Vogt is a two-time All-Star, but those were pretty bad A's teams and, as Brewers fans know all too well, someone needs to go. (The second time around he was the sole rep for a 69 win team, and was decent but not exactly MVP caliber.) That's not to say that he doesn't have some value and won't be a useful bench piece...just that one shouldn't get carried away with his credentials.

 

That's true, but it doesn't diminish the fact that in 2015 and 2016, Vogt was a bonafide first string major league catcher who put up decent numbers (combined WAR of 5.7) playing 136 and 137 games respectively. He got off to a slow start in 2017 and as a 32 year old on a team that doesn't draw, they were likely going to non-tender him after this year anyway and decided to save some money this year by waiving him with a younger cheaper lefty hitting catcher in Bruce Maxwell ready to take his spot. When Bandy stopped hitting completely and Susac not hitting at AAA, the Brewers needed a guy to fill in. He's a perfect fit.

[FVBrewerFan]

It's true that Vogt is a two-time All-Star, but those were pretty bad A's teams and, as Brewers fans know all too well, someone needs to go. (The second time around he was the sole rep for a 69 win team, and was decent but not exactly MVP caliber.) That's not to say that he doesn't have some value and won't be a useful bench piece...just that one shouldn't get carried away with his credentials.

 

That's true, but it doesn't diminish the fact that in 2015 and 2016, Vogt was a bonafide first string major league catcher who put up decent numbers (combined WAR of 5.7) playing 136 and 137 games respectively. He got off to a slow start in 2017 and as a 32 year old on a team that doesn't draw, they were likely going to non-tender him after this year anyway and decided to save some money this year by waiving him with a younger cheaper lefty hitting catcher in Bruce Maxwell ready to take his spot. When Bandy stopped hitting completely and Susac not hitting at AAA, the Brewers needed a guy to fill in. He's a perfect fit.

 

Agree with your post, but remains to be seen if he's a perfect fit. But for minimal investment, it's worth finding out.

[Thurston Fluff]

The only positives I've read about Vogt are his two All Star appearances (and neither of those seasons were anything special) and his "clubhouse presence". His defense is atrocious just like his hitting so far thus year. I'll give you he may be an upgrade over Bandy offensively but probably so would any of our AAA catchers. For reference both Vogt and Susac have a career 99 OPS+. I guess Vogt being a LHB makes his more appealing but about $2M more appealing? Not to me.

 

Not to nitpick but the prorated portion of his contract puts him around $1.5 million and we also can subtract Bandy's salary so it's probably more like a $1.25 million gamble.

[liveforoctober]

To throw a little more gasoline on the optimistic fire ... Miller Park ranks very favorably for left handed power hitters, which Vogt would fall into that category. (source: http://www.espn.com/fantasy/baseball/story/_/page/mlbdk2k16_parkfactors/which-parks-most-least-favorable-fantasy-baseball-hitters-pitchers-mlb) (I remember Stearns mentioning this specifically while going after Shaw).

 

Take away all the foul territory from Oakland and add a favorable landing area in right and right center for a lefty ... Vogt's numbers theoretically should recover slightly if no other adjustments are made.

[LouisEly]

Three pages and several days in and no one has mentioned splits?

 

Vogt OPS vs. RHP - career .750, 2016 .748

Vogt OPS vs. LHP - career .587, 2016 .549

 

Pina for his career is almost exactly equal (.745 vs .741) but it's somewhat of a smallish sample.

 

As long as Vogt only plays vs. RHP he'll be a decent add.

 

And I thought Perez was the emergency catcher?

[adambr2]

Worse case scenario this is a "deck chair shuffle" caliber move and you paid little except a slight increase in payroll to do it in a rebuilding year. Best case scenario he splits time and finds some offense again and upgrades the catching depth in the process.

 

Focus right now isn't on rebuilding, it's on winning a very winnable division (have you looked at the lineups the Cubs are throwing out there now?) The young talent acquisition phase of the rebuild is on hold while the division there to be won this year. Besides, their entire roster other than Sogard is controllable beyond this year. They are trying to increase the chances this year without surrendering young core and future core talent. This type of move makes sense.

 

Fangraphs currently has us at 5.8% to win the division. We can debate all day on the accuracy of that but I think most would agree the odds are long. A 1 game division lead in June is meaningless. Heck, a 1 game division lead on Labor Day is pretty meaningless. Not really sure what you mean about the Cubs' lineups, 1-6 they're about as talented as any out there, they're just not playing well right now .

 

I also don't agree that the young talent acquisition phase is on hold. That's a continuous process. They are trying to build a lasting long-term foundation, not cobble together enough talent to go for it when they have a small positive deviation from their expected record for half a season.

 

Now that doesn't mean they aren't trying to win this year, and in that regard I do agree with you -- this makes sense, and moves like this make sense, I just think people will be disappointed if they expect bigger buys. But I would agree they are trying to increase chances with moves like these - the 2016 Brewers would have had no interest in Vogt.

[KeithStone53151]

Worse case scenario this is a "deck chair shuffle" caliber move and you paid little except a slight increase in payroll to do it in a rebuilding year. Best case scenario he splits time and finds some offense again and upgrades the catching depth in the process.

 

Focus right now isn't on rebuilding, it's on winning a very winnable division (have you looked at the lineups the Cubs are throwing out there now?) The young talent acquisition phase of the rebuild is on hold while the division there to be won this year. Besides, their entire roster other than Sogard is controllable beyond this year. They are trying to increase the chances this year without surrendering young core and future core talent. This type of move makes sense.

 

Fangraphs currently has us at 5.8% to win the division. We can debate all day on the accuracy of that but I think most would agree the odds are long. A 1 game division lead in June is meaningless. Heck, a 1 game division lead on Labor Day is pretty meaningless. Not really sure what you mean about the Cubs' lineups, 1-6 they're about as talented as any out there, they're just not playing well right now .

 

I also don't agree that the young talent acquisition phase is on hold. That's a continuous process. They are trying to build a lasting long-term foundation, not cobble together enough talent to go for it when they have a small positive deviation from their expected record for half a season.

 

Now that doesn't mean they aren't trying to win this year, and in that regard I do agree with you -- this makes sense, and moves like this make sense, I just think people will be disappointed if they expect bigger buys. But I would agree they are trying to increase chances with moves like these - the 2016 Brewers would have had no interest in Vogt.

 

Which 1-6 for the cubs are as talented as any out there? You have Rizzo and Bryant as talented as any 2, that's fair. Beyond that Russell/Baez and their fringe 700 career ops's with decent but not great numbers this year. Contreras came back to earth after playing way over his head his rookie year. Zobrist having a down year, and he's 36 so he might be done being an incredibly productive major leaguer. Happ is hitting well, but his power numbers are substantially higher than his minor league numbers. Hard to say it's for real yet. Point being, let's not kid ourselves on this cubs team. They have 2 studs, a rookie who's on fire, and a very pedestrian rest of the lineup...at least offensively.

[tmwiese55]

Overall Bandy has been really bad for a while now after the hot start. This is a good move to try, what do you have to lose? Makes perfect sense/fit since he's lefty to counter Pina and Miller PArk is lefty friendly. These are the little things they should be doing this year to try and hold onto the division while still maintaining the long term outlook. I think we all don't want to be selling youthful pieces for win now moves, but stuff like this is a no brainer.

[dlk9s]

I like the move, but would like it even more if he was able to pitch.

 

There are only so many Bill Halls in the world.

[DuWayne Steurer]

 

Focus right now isn't on rebuilding, it's on winning a very winnable division (have you looked at the lineups the Cubs are throwing out there now?) The young talent acquisition phase of the rebuild is on hold while the division there to be won this year. Besides, their entire roster other than Sogard is controllable beyond this year. They are trying to increase the chances this year without surrendering young core and future core talent. This type of move makes sense.

 

 

I don't think the "young talent acquisition phase" is ever on hold. I think if there's ever a chance to add young, quality, controllable players, Stearns is the type of GM who's going to do it. I think we're in a position to add quality veteran players to help win right now, but that doesn't automatically put the "add young talent" on hold. By no means do these things have to be mutually exclusive.

[dlk9s]

So does accounting for all three runs in a 3-2 win count as 1 WAR?

[SoCalBrewfan]

I don't think the "young talent acquisition phase" is ever on hold. I think if there's ever a chance to add young, quality, controllable players, Stearns is the type of GM who's going to do it.

 

You might even argue that putting that on hold is the undoing of many rebuilding teams...they get an incorrect read on their talent level and start overpaying for veteran relievers.

 

At any rate, Vogt had himself a game...

[jjfanec]

So does accounting for all three runs in a 3-2 win count as 1 WAR?

 

Imagine if he doesn't get robbed of that 3 run home run in Cincinnati. Vogt is sure seeing the ball well right now.

[rcc]

Vogt said on the postgame show last night that he appreciates the enthusiasm of the Milwaukee fans and that the clubhouse is a good one to get to know. He also likes the atmosphere of the clubhouse. He alluded to other clubhouses without naming names.

 

I guess the Oakland clubhouse isn't such a happy place.

[AdvantageSchneider]

Vogt said on the postgame show last night that he appreciates the enthusiasm of the Milwaukee fans and that the clubhouse is a good one to get to know. He also likes the atmosphere of the clubhouse. He alluded to other clubhouses without naming names.

 

I guess the Oakland clubhouse isn't such a happy place.

 

Well the Oakland clubhouse is overflowing with poop isn't it? So that definetly isn't a happy place.

[pacopete4]

Vogt said on the postgame show last night that he appreciates the enthusiasm of the Milwaukee fans and that the clubhouse is a good one to get to know. He also likes the atmosphere of the clubhouse. He alluded to other clubhouses without naming names.

 

I guess the Oakland clubhouse isn't such a happy place.

 

Well the Oakland clubhouse is overflowing with poop isn't it? So that definetly isn't a happy place.

 

Mod edit: sorry, can't have the s-word even in meme form and even if the meme is funny

[rcc]

I forgot about that. Yeah, that might be part of it. The Oakland Coliseum is a crappy place to play.

[liveforoctober]

You could probably say Vogt and Co. had been down in the dumps for awhile...

[Lathund]

We didn't just sign a catcher, we signed a NBA referee

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbRnCn-oU3M&spfreload=10

[jjgott]

Big fan of his Fred Flinstone run-in-place when he makes contact.

[AdvantageSchneider]

I wonder if we would have claimed Vogt is we weren't in first place. If we had the same record but say our division was more like the NL West where we would be in 4th place 3-4 games out of the wild card. We do seem to try to collect free talent whenever possible, but Vogt doesn't exactly fit in with a rebuilding team.

[BuckyBrewer61]

I wonder if we would have claimed Vogt is we weren't in first place. If we had the same record but say our division was more like the NL West where we would be in 4th place 3-4 games out of the wild card. We do seem to try to collect free talent whenever possible, but Vogt doesn't exactly fit in with a rebuilding team.

 

It's a good question, not sure the answer but I think it's still a possibility. He is a classic buy-low guy. Two-time all-star having a down year, arby eligible after this year but team control through 2020. Even if the team is struggling, if he gets back to career norms he suddenly has trade value to acquire young, controllable pieces or even be a part of a contender in 2-3 years.

[Thurston Fluff]

I wonder if we would have claimed Vogt is we weren't in first place. If we had the same record but say our division was more like the NL West where we would be in 4th place 3-4 games out of the wild card. We do seem to try to collect free talent whenever possible, but Vogt doesn't exactly fit in with a rebuilding team.

 

It's a good question, not sure the answer but I think it's still a possibility. He is a classic buy-low guy. Two-time all-star having a down year, arby eligible after this year but team control through 2020. Even if the team is struggling, if he gets back to career norms he suddenly has trade value to acquire young, controllable pieces or even be a part of a contender in 2-3 years.

 

He's under control for as long as Thames is and roughly the same age. So there is precedence saying they would have. The goal is to accumulate as much controllable talent as possible. I don't think that goal is related to the state the team was in but the organizational philosophy moving forward.

[Greenleaf1]

I think Vogt's claim was honestly just a matter of perfect timing.

 

Bandy was struggling so much that he just needed to be sent down. There really wasn't an option to call up from AAA that made sense (maybe Garcia? But that's a risky call up even for a backup). Vogt happened to be available for relatively cheap, and surprisingly passed up to us on the waiver wire. He's pretty much the very definition of low risk, since with our payroll flexibility we could just cut him and call Bandy back up if he didn't work out at all. And now it looks like we've got a steal on our hands (obvious small sample size alert).

 

His pickup just made so much sense, and is the kind of thing that can really help a 1st place team down the stretch. I do think the #1 reason that we have sticking power this year is due to our depth, and our ability to have quality Major Leaguers replace injured players even for an extended period of time. Vogt probably isn't a guy you want in there 3 or 4 games out of 5, but he's a great left handed complement to Pina and a quality veteran lefty bat off the bench, plus he's controllable for a few more years at a fairly reasonable price most likely (balance out his salary with Pina's and the cost of your catching corps is pretty cheap).

[Humans Need Water]

One month does not a season make.

 

When you are a bench bat and only manage 2 hits in an entire month...bye. You can't afford to have such slumps. Successful bench players avoid such slumps. Bandy did not and now he deserves to go.

By "entire month" you mean 10 games (38 AB)? Because that's what it was. And his final 8 games in May heading into June he was hitting 259/375/782.

 

Applying the same simplistic measures you are then Perez should have been cut after his first 15 games on the season when he was hitting 179 -

had 7 hits and 3 came in one game (other 14 games he was hitting 114 with 1 XBH). Aguilar had a 1-29 stretch early as well. And they're "backups" too like Bandy.

 

In an ideal world Bandy should have been starting this year in AAA as he needed more time there to work on some things after last year. But we didn't have that luxury with Susac on the shelf 10 days into ST nor another MLB catcher on the roster. He way overplayed his skill set in April, played to that of a backup (what he is) in May and way underplayed his skill set in his 10 starts in June. If Vogt didn't become available then Bandy would still be on the team. They preferred him to Bandy because he's a veteran and lefty who's had success at the MLB level very recently. The veteran presence behind the plate will help down the stretch. He's also coming from a bottom tier hitting park into one of the better park's overall as well as a top park for lefty power hitters (which is why nobody should be shocked about Shaw's HR numbers as he went from one of the worst lefty power parks to one of the best). Vogt makes sense from those perspectives and nothing else as he's no longer starter caliber. I personally don't care who the backup catcher is as I watched Maldy be garbage for way too many years in that role; they can rotate between several guys for all I care just as long as Pineapple gets plenty of PT.

 

I still think Susac becomes a player for the MLB team potentially by year's end otherwise starting next spring and he's got some heat on this thread for being "atrocious" in AAA.

Past 2 months - 227/313/797, 99 wRC+, 11.6% BB, 31.3% K

Past 1 month - 239/346/823, 109 wRC+, 14.8% BB, 24.7% K

Past 2.5wks - 279/389/970, 142 wRC+, 16.7% BB, 18.5% K