2017-06-04: Dodgers (Maeda) at Brewers (Davies) 1:10 PM CDT [Brewers win, 3-0]

[young guns]

Rule 6.05 (j) A batter is out when, after a third strike or after he hits a fair ball, he or first base is tagged before he touches first base.

 

Rule 7.01 A runner acquires the right to an unoccupied base when he touches it before he is out. He is then entitled to it until he is put out, or forced to vacate it for another runner legally entitled to that base.

 

So, the tie goes to the runner, unless called otherwise on the field, in which case the replay will uphold the tie going to whatever is called on the field.

 

We've been screwed by replay and/or 50/50 calls upheld at least 6 times in the last 2 weeks.

 

Nothing about that definition indicates that a tie is supposed to go to the runner.

Actually I think it does. Bolded part seems to mean that the tag has to happen before he reaches base. If its a tie, then it hasnt happened before he got there, therefore he would be safe. Though i could be wrong since im not a lawyer, and thus dont speak legalese.

[adambr2]

But that's in direct contradiction with the 2nd part of it that says the runner must touch the base before he is out, not at the same time, to acquire the right to it. Ergo, there are no ties.

 

Of course in the real world there are plays that are too close to call with either the maked eye or even slow motion review in which case they'll call it whatever way they think they saw it and stick to it. But as far as MLB is concerned they never tie.

[Oxy]

 

So, the tie goes to the runner, unless called otherwise on the field, in which case the replay will uphold the tie going to whatever is called on the field.

 

We've been screwed by replay and/or 50/50 calls upheld at least 6 times in the last 2 weeks.

 

Nothing about that definition indicates that a tie is supposed to go to the runner.

Actually I think it does. Bolded part seems to mean that the tag has to happen before he reaches base. If its a tie, then it hasnt happened before he got there, therefore he would be safe. Though i could be wrong since im not a lawyer, and thus dont speak legalese.

 

I'm with you-- thus my post. Also, not a lawyer. However, while I have a nominal understanding of semantics and sentence structure, I am old enough to know that the law says that a lawyer understands words better than me. I think. Shrug.

[Baldkin]

But that's in direct contradiction with the 2nd part of it that says the runner must touch the base before he is out, not at the same time, to acquire the right to it. Ergo, there are no ties.

 

Of course in the real world there are plays that are too close to call with either the maked eye or even slow motion review in which case they'll call it whatever way they think they saw it and stick to it. But as far as MLB is concerned they never tie.

 

Before he is out, and he is out only when the ball beats him to the bag, therefor, heretofore, henceforth, et Al. a tie goes to the runner.

[adambr2]

But that's in direct contradiction with the 2nd part of it that says the runner must touch the base before he is out, not at the same time, to acquire the right to it. Ergo, there are no ties.

 

Of course in the real world there are plays that are too close to call with either the maked eye or even slow motion review in which case they'll call it whatever way they think they saw it and stick to it. But as far as MLB is concerned they never tie.

 

Before he is out, and he is out only when the ball beats him to the bag, therefor, heretofore, henceforth, et Al. a tie goes to the runner.

 

From the MLB.com website straight from crew chief Tim McClellan:

 

There are no ties and there is no rule that says the tie goes to the runner. But the rule book does say that the runner must beat the ball to first base, and so if he doesn't beat the ball, then he is out. So you have to make the decision. That's why umpires are paid the money they are, to make the decision on if he did or if he didn't. The only thing you can do is go by whether or not he beat the ball. If he did, then he is safe.

 

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/umpires/feature.jsp?feature=mcclellandqa

[young guns]

Is there another rule that specifically uses that language, runner must beat the ball? Because i still think 6.05 is worded ball must beat the runner and 7.01 basically just says he gets the base if 6.05 doesnt happen.

[adambr2]

Is there another rule that specifically uses that language, runner must beat the ball? Because i still think 6.05 is worded ball must beat the runner and 7.01 basically just says he gets the base if 6.05 doesnt happen.

 

I'm not sure, I'm just saying and pointing out that regardless of what anyone's interpretation to the rule is, and I agree there's a gray area open to interpretation, MLB and the officials do not interpret the rule as 'tie goes to the runner.' So we can't say that we got screwed if a 50/50 call goes against us. Obviously we'd like to see SOME 50/50 calls go our way and not always be against us, but on it's own I didn't see anything right or wrong answer on the Shaw call and nothing to overturn it either way .

[Oxy]

 

From the MLB.com website straight from crew chief Tim McClellan:

 

There are no ties and there is no rule that says the tie goes to the runner. But the rule book does say that the runner must beat the ball to first base, and so if he doesn't beat the ball, then he is out. So you have to make the decision. That's why umpires are paid the money they are, to make the decision on if he did or if he didn't. The only thing you can do is go by whether or not he beat the ball. If he did, then he is safe.

 

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/umpires/feature.jsp?feature=mcclellandqa

 

Didn't we just literally quote the rulebook, which uses the reverse language regarding the ball and the runner and who must beat what?

[adambr2]

 

From the MLB.com website straight from crew chief Tim McClellan:

 

There are no ties and there is no rule that says the tie goes to the runner. But the rule book does say that the runner must beat the ball to first base, and so if he doesn't beat the ball, then he is out. So you have to make the decision. That's why umpires are paid the money they are, to make the decision on if he did or if he didn't. The only thing you can do is go by whether or not he beat the ball. If he did, then he is safe.

 

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/umpires/feature.jsp?feature=mcclellandqa

 

Didn't we just literally quote the rulebook, which uses the reverse language regarding the ball and the runner and who must beat what?

 

And once again, I am just giving you a literal quote from a MLB Umpire Crew Chief (at the time of the interview) of how the rule is interpreted and pointing out that they do NOT interpret it as a tie going to the runner.

[Oxy]

 

From the MLB.com website straight from crew chief Tim McClellan:

 

There are no ties and there is no rule that says the tie goes to the runner. But the rule book does say that the runner must beat the ball to first base, and so if he doesn't beat the ball, then he is out. So you have to make the decision. That's why umpires are paid the money they are, to make the decision on if he did or if he didn't. The only thing you can do is go by whether or not he beat the ball. If he did, then he is safe.

 

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/umpires/feature.jsp?feature=mcclellandqa

 

Didn't we just literally quote the rulebook, which uses the reverse language regarding the ball and the runner and who must beat what?

 

And once again, I am just giving you a literal quote from a MLB Umpire Crew Chief (at the time of the interview) of how the rule is interpreted and pointing out that they do NOT interpret it as a tie going to the runner.

 

 

So why did McClellan qualify his statement about no ties using the word BUT, and then misquote the rulebook to justify the opposite conclusion to what the rulebook said?

[adambr2]

He didn't misquote the rulebook.

 

Rule 7.08 (e)

Any runner is out when he fails to reach the next base before a fielder tags him or the base

[Oxy]

He didn't misquote the rulebook.

 

Rule 7.08 (e)

Any runner is out when he fails to reach the next base before a fielder tags him or the base

 

Good. I was hoping it said that someplace. Now we can leave it as "there is no tie."

[young guns]

Case closed.