Is it possible that we could be buyers at the deadline?

[pacopete4]

We probably could get Sabathia back if we wanted to. King Kong could return for a reasonable price these days.

 

Let's get the band back together.

 

To all those fans that are too nostalgic to move on from Ryan Braun, this makes a ton of sense.

 

Or people don't want to move on because he is still really good. But your condescending remark has been noted, once again.

[pacopete4]

I thought we were all just joking around about CC. No thanks.

 

I know I was. Can't speak for others. He's a guy that should have retired a couple years ago but he's pulling in $25 million per year so why not go out there and make that money.

[RobDeer 45]

No!

 

We have to stay patient and let this develop. We still don't know anything about these guys long term. We have built up a great farm system and we need to that that carefully so that we always have a steady stream coming up. Do I think we should trade for pitchers at some point with position players that we have several of? Yes. But I think we should be trading for guys with high potential, not guys that are already there. At least not for the foreseeable future.

 

Let me just say that I definitely fall on your side of the argument with this. But, what if we are talking about a pitcher that we'd have control over for the next few seasons beyond 2017? Again, maybe a deGrom or Quintana type guy that would/should be a bit piece of your rotation for the next few years as you try to build a championship level team? I too don't like the idea of selling off any of our big prospects that we've worked hard to acquire, but I might at least entertain the idea if we were getting back a quality starting pitcher that we could build the rotation around. Eventually, we are going to have to do this anyway as I just don't see much high-end starting pitching in our system right now. I guess the question would be: is this year the right year to start looking at deal like this? Coming into the year, we all would have said that NO, it is way too soon, but perhaps our timelines get moved up a season if this team continues winning games with the offense over the next month+ here?

 

I really think it's best to make those trades in the offseason as opposed to the deadline. I feel like that's when you pay the most. Now if a great deal came up and we weren't busting the bank, maybe. I think we are in a spot where we need to stay calm, and continue to see what we have before making many moves. This team is also very unproven at this point, so I don't want to be making assumptions on all these guys. Let's not rush in to anything.

[MrTPlush]

No thanks on a Quintana or other similar player. Sell the farm for a guy you control 1.5 years? This team isn't that good and what if it regresses next year? Would be a terrible disaster. When I think of us buying at the deadline it is for minor assets like a bullpen arm that won't cost a lot. You can find bullpen arms at a decent rate as long as it isn't a co trollable guy or elite guy. Maybe a change of scenery for the rotation etc.

 

Selling off the farm is for when your team is loaded, elite, and already set up well and you know it. Like the Cubs trading for Chapman. The only other reason is if your window is closing and you haven't gotten over the hump yet. Definitely a terrible idea if we are maybe starting to open the window.

[adambr2]

No thanks on a Quintana or other similar player. Sell the farm for a guy you control 1.5 years? This team isn't that good and what if it regresses next year? Would be a terrible disaster. When I think of us buying at the deadline it is for minor assets like a bullpen arm that won't cost a lot. You can find bullpen arms at a decent rate as long as it isn't a co trollable guy or elite guy. Maybe a change of scenery for the rotation etc.

 

Selling off the farm is for when your team is loaded, elite, and already set up well and you know it. Like the Cubs trading for Chapman. The only other reason is if your window is closing and you haven't gotten over the hump yet. Definitely a terrible idea if we are maybe starting to open the window.

 

Quintana is under control through 2020. I'm not specifically advocating trading for him, it would depend on the offer, but if you're going to try to rent a pitcher to slot in near the top of your rotation hes exactly the kind of player you'd want. Lots of control and not expensive control. Easy to reverse course and flip back to someone else if the rebuild isn't going along as well as planned. I'm not wanting to unload the farm for anyone this time around but if we do give up multiple prospects for anyone I'd much prefer someone with that much control rather than a CC type rental.

[tmwiese55]

Isn't Quintana signed until 2020 at a mere 10ish per year? 3.5 years and only through age 31. Overall i generally agree not to mortgage any legit future pieces for this year, Quintana might be the only exception due to his control/age and relatively cheap salary. Maybe i missed something in the contract and they're player options or something.

[MrTPlush]

Through 2020 on options. Terrible idea regardless. Would take a ridiculous amount of prospects. Would rather sign one in FA.

[FVBrewerFan]

Problem is if he starts pitching better, teams who are really going for it will offer more than the Brewers can. (Or make that should.) Brewers shouldn't be offering prospects of any significance at this point in the rebuild. Just too early to do that. I mean, look at the 2018 rotation. There is not one single pitcher we can write in today and say yes, he will definitely be in the rotation.

 

So, to me, a Quintana type deal is something you do once the rotation is pretty close to being set, and you need that one more arm.

[pacopete4]

Would people be willing to give up the Alcides Escobar, outfielder Lorenzo Cain, and pitchers Jake Odorizzi and Jeremy Jeffress of the Brewers system for Quintana? Because that's probably about the return that the White Sox would be looking to get. Easy to see the names now and say whoa, but at the time, these guys were just prospects.

[tmwiese55]

According to spotrac the last two years are club options too. So you even have protection if he blows out his arm. Yea, still probably not worth it considering how much you'd have to give up for him. Still, probably the only one that would make sense as you'd have to be giving a similar package for someone else with less control. Probably best not to tinker with a big move, maybe a low profile middle relief pickup or something like that is really all we should do for "go for it" type trades.

 

That's us thinking clearly right now of course, all of a sudden get to mid-July and somehow they're in 1st or just out and maybe we change our minds.

[adambr2]

So say hypothetically, Corey Ray, Brett Phillips, Isan Diaz and Marcos Diplan for Quintana to get a deal done. Would it be worth that? That's probably the kind of level of return it would take.

 

That's a lot, but for OFers you still have Clark at the lower levels and Brinson and Cordell at AAA, and Dubon likely gets a long look as the 2B of the future.

 

Again it's a lot but if you think we're close, Quintana makes an enormous difference and really we still have everything pretty well covered in the farm.

[pacopete4]

Brewers Get:

-Jose Quintana

-David Robertson

 

White Sox Get:

Jorge Lopez

Brett Phillips

Marcos Diplan

Corey Ray

Marcos Dubon

[adambr2]

Brewers Get:

-Jose Quintana

-David Robertson

 

White Sox Get:

Jorge Lopez

Brett Phillips

Marcos Diplan

Corey Ray

Marcos Dubon

 

Hmm. Based on what they were asking over the winter I just don't think this is going to be enough for Chicago for Quintana alone much less for him and Robertson.

There's a lot of good depth but only one top 100 guy in Ray and he's there more based on draft position than production. But it's hard to say, depends on who they value the most. There seems to be at least as much quality here as what we gave up for Greinke, but I don't see then packaging both pitchers for this either way. I'd rather do this than mine if it means keeping Diaz, even though I really like Dubon too.

[A Swing and A Drive]

So say hypothetically, Corey Ray, Brett Phillips, Isan Diaz and Marcos Diplan for Quintana to get a deal done. Would it be worth that? That's probably the kind of level of return it would take.

 

That's a lot, but for OFers you still have Clark at the lower levels and Brinson and Cordell at AAA, and Dubon likely gets a long look as the 2B of the future.

 

Again it's a lot but if you think we're close, Quintana makes an enormous difference and really we still have everything pretty well covered in the farm.

 

I agree that's about the level it would take to land Jose Quintana. I'm pretty sure another contending club could and would beat that package with prospects that are closer to the majors even.

 

My guess is that's closer to what the A's may get/take for Sonny Gray. Gray is only controllable through 2019 and has more question marks than Quintana at this point however.

[pacopete4]

Brewers Get:

-Jose Quintana

-David Robertson

 

White Sox Get:

Jorge Lopez

Brett Phillips

Marcos Diplan

Corey Ray

Marcos Dubon

 

Hmm. Based on what they were asking over the winter I just don't think this is going to be enough for Chicago for Quintana alone much less for him and Robertson.

There's a lot of good depth but only one top 100 guy in Ray and he's there more based on draft position than production. But it's hard to say, depends on who they value the most. There seems to be at least as much quality here as what we gave up for Greinke, but I don't see then packaging both pitchers for this either way. I'd rather do this than mine if it means keeping Diaz, even though I really like Dubon too.

 

Yeah, you're probably right that it would take more. I just don't know how much more I would be willing. I guess if it meant we were getting both of those guys, you may up it a touch but I wouldn't go crazy. I guess that's what everyone is discussing that make a huge trade could really offset the rebuilding phase. In my trade above, while those guys could become MLB players and good ones, I like other guys more than them so I fed them to the wolves.

[FVBrewerFan]

This is the danger of having a decent team, emotion takes over and you want to go for WS title. It's just not time. And it's a shame, because this line-up is good enough to compete. I look at this season as great news, because there will be plenty of guys to sell.

 

Knebel and Garza for sure. Feliz if he comes on at all, along with hopefully another bullpen arm that is steady (Owen?) Then you have any of the bats that can be moved. Great thing about it is Stearns can just sit back and not do a thing unless he gets the right offer for any of these guys.

[pacopete4]

This is the danger of having a decent team, emotion takes over and you want to go for WS title. It's just not time. And it's a shame, because this line-up is good enough to compete. I look at this season as great news, because there will be plenty of guys to sell.

 

Knebel and Garza for sure. Feliz if he comes on at all, along with hopefully another bullpen arm that is steady (Owen?) Then you have any of the bats that can be moved. Great thing about it is Stearns can just sit back and not do a thing unless he gets the right offer for any of these guys.

 

I see it the same but also a bit different. If he sits back and does nothing, a big log jam occurs between this year and next. (Granted you can make offseason deals but they never seem to be as good as in season ones) If he goes off and sells the farm, he's saying the guys on this team (the lineup) is good enough right now to win it but we are just missing a few pitching pieces. Either way, something has to happen if this team continues to win. Either you have to sell off a huge number of the pieces and build towards that next wave of talent and hope they are as good as advertised, OR you sell off a few of those pieces for the win right now chance. Baseball is a funny game. The Cubs are a couple injuries away from wondering what the hell just happened to their season. Ya just never know.

[adambr2]

This is the danger of having a decent team, emotion takes over and you want to go for WS title. It's just not time. And it's a shame, because this line-up is good enough to compete. I look at this season as great news, because there will be plenty of guys to sell.

 

Knebel and Garza for sure. Feliz if he comes on at all, along with hopefully another bullpen arm that is steady (Owen?) Then you have any of the bats that can be moved. Great thing about it is Stearns can just sit back and not do a thing unless he gets the right offer for any of these guys.

 

But that's a major difference between a guy Quintana and a traditional buy. It's not specifically a 'win now' move. It's a move that you can make if you're not totally sure and you still have him for quite awhile and can move him again if things really don't work out with the rebuild. It's outside the box considering where we came into this year but I see the merit.

 

I don't know why people are so eager to deal Knebel, he's very controlled yet and by far our best pen arm. You better get blown away if you're going to deal him.

[tmwiese55]

Besides Braun and Garza I really don't think there's anything left to sell. All other guys are young and/or under years and years of control. Theoretically even if this year comes back to reality a bit like it should and we're out of it as expected, you're probably still looking at a goal of .500 or better next year (which keeps you in the playoff discussion a long time) and then hopefully winning the following year. All these guys could still be on that team for almost no cost so why dump them if you think they're good. At some point you have to win. Only if you think it's a fluke, which is probably the responsible way to look at relievers so a guy like Knebel would make sense to flip while he's hot.

[MrTPlush]

Quintana would start with either Brinson/Hader and take another Top 100 prospect easily, and more promising guys like Dubon etc. it would take way more than the ideas people are throwing around here.

[adambr2]

Quintana would start with either Brinson/Hader and take another Top 100 prospect easily, and more promising guys like Dubon etc. it would take way more than the ideas people are throwing around here.

 

I threw out Ray/Diaz/Phillips/Diplan which I don't agree is that far off at all. That's a top 30, a top 60, and borderline top 100s which include a guy who was a top 50 and is off to a great start in AAA.

 

Maybe you'd have to substitute Brinson for Ray but if you do, Brinson/Diaz/Phillips/Diplan seems more than fair to me. Maybe substitute Clark for Phillips if you're dealing Brinson instead of Ray.

[FVBrewerFan]

This is the danger of having a decent team, emotion takes over and you want to go for WS title. It's just not time. And it's a shame, because this line-up is good enough to compete. I look at this season as great news, because there will be plenty of guys to sell.

 

Knebel and Garza for sure. Feliz if he comes on at all, along with hopefully another bullpen arm that is steady (Owen?) Then you have any of the bats that can be moved. Great thing about it is Stearns can just sit back and not do a thing unless he gets the right offer for any of these guys.

 

But that's a major difference between a guy Quintana and a traditional buy. It's not specifically a 'win now' move. It's a move that you can make if you're not totally sure and you still have him for quite awhile and can move him again if things really don't work out with the rebuild. It's outside the box considering where we came into this year but I see the merit.

 

I don't know why people are so eager to deal Knebel, he's very controlled yet and by far our best pen arm. You better get blown away if you're going to deal him.

 

Have you seen what we got for Jeffress, Smith, and Thornburg? If they get an offer like that for Knebel you take it! I mean if he can finally stay healthy until July and is that good, heck yea you jump at a great offer for him.

[RobDeer 45]

I really think we should still be sellers (if there is anything). We don't have the total club together yet. Keep collecting assets!

[FVBrewerFan]

Besides Braun and Garza I really don't think there's anything left to sell. All other guys are young and/or under years and years of control.

 

Which is exactly why there's plenty of guys to sell. Santana, Villar, Broxton, Thames, Shaw, Pina. If these guys keep hitting they have tremendous value. Window is not here yet, what we have right now is fool's gold. This rotation is horrible, and the bullpen not much better. it's nowhere near as simple as just plugging in Woodruff and Hader.

 

People ask all the time how long will the rebuild take? Impossible to know, but that time will be when they have a legit rotation. But hey, that's how I feel today. Strange things happen in sports, and come the end of July let's see what's shaking. I'm open -minded about making any move at all, but as of today...SELL SELL SELL.

[pacopete4]

This is the danger of having a decent team, emotion takes over and you want to go for WS title. It's just not time. And it's a shame, because this line-up is good enough to compete. I look at this season as great news, because there will be plenty of guys to sell.

 

Knebel and Garza for sure. Feliz if he comes on at all, along with hopefully another bullpen arm that is steady (Owen?) Then you have any of the bats that can be moved. Great thing about it is Stearns can just sit back and not do a thing unless he gets the right offer for any of these guys.

 

But that's a major difference between a guy Quintana and a traditional buy. It's not specifically a 'win now' move. It's a move that you can make if you're not totally sure and you still have him for quite awhile and can move him again if things really don't work out with the rebuild. It's outside the box considering where we came into this year but I see the merit.

 

I don't know why people are so eager to deal Knebel, he's very controlled yet and by far our best pen arm. You better get blown away if you're going to deal him.

 

Have you seen what we got for Jeffress, Smith, and Thornburg? If they get an offer like that for Knebel you take it! I mean if he can finally stay healthy until July and is that good, heck yea you jump at a great offer for him.

 

All three of those pitchers are up for free agency in 2020 while Knebel isn't until 2022. Two years is a huge difference and would need to be compensated even more for those two years. Eventually you have to have guys at the back end who can get outs. We are finding that out this season with what could be an even better record.