Time to Start Worrying About Villar?

[rickh150]

"Here comes the loss" when the bullpen enters the game is pretty justifiable since it's the category we actually lead the league in.

 

Villar, like Gomez, plays the game a different way than a lot of players in the league and anything different, especially to a bunch of Wisconsinians, is usually not a great mix. It is what it is I guess. Hopefully he'll go on a long hot streak so people can fake the love for a bit at least.

 

 

I think it's funny that Brewers fans deride the Cardinals and their fans for all that "play the game the right way" and "the Cardinal Way" stuff, but as soon as we get a few players who play the game with some exuberance and flair and excitement, we want our players to "play the game the right way" and such.

 

I love me a good bat flip, FWIW.

 

 

I can't even imagine a pitcher in MLB who's head wouldn't outright explode if a player did something like that.

 

Anyways....... I'm getting off topic. It'd just be nice if everyone at least pretended to want every Brewer player to be successful, even if only to improve their trade value....

 

I love flair and emotion..... has nothing to do why Villar should play less and Sogard more. Insulting as a Wisconsinite.

Does "playing the right way" include batting .210 lead off with avg defense and a low on base %?

[rickh150]

"Here comes the loss" when the bullpen enters the game is pretty justifiable since it's the category we actually lead the league in.

 

Villar, like Gomez, plays the game a different way than a lot of players in the league and anything different, especially to a bunch of Wisconsinians, is usually not a great mix. It is what it is I guess. Hopefully he'll go on a long hot streak so people can fake the love for a bit at least.

 

 

I think it's funny that Brewers fans deride the Cardinals and their fans for all that "play the game the right way" and "the Cardinal Way" stuff, but as soon as we get a few players who play the game with some exuberance and flair and excitement, we want our players to "play the game the right way" and such.

 

I love me a good bat flip, FWIW.

 

 

I can't even imagine a pitcher in MLB who's head wouldn't outright explode if a player did something like that.

 

Anyways....... I'm getting off topic. It'd just be nice if everyone at least pretended to want every Brewer player to be successful, even if only to improve their trade value....

 

I love flair and emotion..... has nothing to do why Villar should play less and Sogard more. Insulting as a Wisconsinite.

Does "playing the right way" include batting .210 lead off with avg defense and a low on base %?

[pacopete4]

"Here comes the loss" when the bullpen enters the game is pretty justifiable since it's the category we actually lead the league in.

 

Villar, like Gomez, plays the game a different way than a lot of players in the league and anything different, especially to a bunch of Wisconsinians, is usually not a great mix. It is what it is I guess. Hopefully he'll go on a long hot streak so people can fake the love for a bit at least.

 

 

I think it's funny that Brewers fans deride the Cardinals and their fans for all that "play the game the right way" and "the Cardinal Way" stuff, but as soon as we get a few players who play the game with some exuberance and flair and excitement, we want our players to "play the game the right way" and such.

 

I love me a good bat flip, FWIW.

 

 

I can't even imagine a pitcher in MLB who's head wouldn't outright explode if a player did something like that.

 

Anyways....... I'm getting off topic. It'd just be nice if everyone at least pretended to want every Brewer player to be successful, even if only to improve their trade value....

 

I love flair and emotion..... has nothing to do why Villar should play less and Sogard more. Insulting as a Wisconsinite.

Does "playing the right way" include batting .210 lead off with avg defense and a low on base %?

 

Maybe not for you but for a lot, the hate started well before his current batting average.

[FVBrewerFan]

I don't know where all this "hate" is coming from. People hated TPlush? People hated Villar before he started struggling? Maybe your circle is different than mine, but I don't know anyone who hated those guys. Never heard it on talk radio either, never heard it at a game. Why would anyone hate Villar before this season?

 

If there is any player where some of that exists, it's Braun.

[adambr2]

I don't know where all this "hate" is coming from. People hated TPlush? People hated Villar before he started struggling? Maybe your circle is different than mine, but I don't know anyone who hated those guys. Never heard it on talk radio either, never heard it at a game. Why would anyone hate Villar before this season?

 

If there is any player where some of that exists, it's Braun.

 

Braun seems to be a love or hate guy. Not much in between.

[rickh150]

I don't know where all this "hate" is coming from. People hated TPlush? People hated Villar before he started struggling? Maybe your circle is different than mine, but I don't know anyone who hated those guys. Never heard it on talk radio either, never heard it at a game. Why would anyone hate Villar before this season?

 

If there is any player where some of that exists, it's Braun.

 

I didn't like Villar's baserunning in 2016; it became much better after CC sat him down in August.

[Ennder]

Villar has gotten a lot of guff for all the mental mistakes on the base paths and in the field and rightfully so. He is a bad baseball player. That doesn't mean he can't be a valuable player though just with raw talent.

[djoctagone]

villar benched for the second straight game since returning from the disabled list.

[MrTPlush]

villar benched for the second straight game since returning from the disabled list.

 

As expected when your replacement is batting .350

[Ennder]

villar benched for the second straight game since returning from the disabled list.

 

As expected when your replacement is batting .350

 

Not to mention the fact he didn't run on that pinch hit last night. Inexcusable.

[jerichoholicninja]

villar benched for the second straight game since returning from the disabled list.

 

I for one am pleasantly surprised that Villar wasn't just stuck back in the starting lineup. Seems like the sort of thing our managers over the last decade or so would have done.

[stoutdude04]

villar benched for the second straight game since returning from the disabled list.

 

As expected when your replacement is batting .350

 

Not to mention the fact he didn't run on that pinch hit last night. Inexcusable.

 

What happened? I didn't get a chance to watch the game.

[MkeSouthSide]

What happened? I didn't get a chance to watch the game.

 

He hit a little squibber out in front of home plate. He thought it was foul and didn't take off for first. Reds turned a 2-6-3 double play, whereas he would have made it to first safely had he run.

[A Swing and A Drive]

Kudos to Counsell for benching Villar the day after that inexcusable at bat on Tuesday. I agree that former Brewers managers may not have done this.

[Est1970]

I felt that Villar's mental mistakes seemed to be on the decline prior to his injury, but two things he did in Tuesday's game bothered me. One was not running on the tapper in front of the plate leading to the easy double play. The other was previous to that at bat. Arica singled with Broxton on second. Broxton scored, barely, standing up. Bill or Brian on the TV coverage mentioned that Villar, the on deck hitter, was out of position and didn't give Broxton any direction as he was coming to home plate. It turned out that he was safe anyway, but that could have cost a run in a close game. I'm a Villar fan, but the mental mistakes are frustrating.

[gregmag]

If Villar can be 80 percent of the player he was last year, he's a good starter, mental mistakes and all. In one of the transaction threads, I think, people are taking it as given that he's just a utility guy now. That seems very premature to me. He was our best position player last year. He's young. He has a broad talent base. I love Sogard more than most people (I'm probably the biggest nerd here), but penciling in Sogard over Villar even for the rest of this year, let alone beyond that, seems to reflect recency bias.

 

I don't know what Villar's deal is with baserunning. I agree that Counsell's benching him after he didn't run out that squibber was wise and refreshing. OTOH, Villar landed on the DL by absolutely, almost literally, busting his butt to make a spectacular defensive play. He's not a low-motor guy across the board. I don't know if he's arrogant, flaky, stupid, immature, or something else, but if he starts hitting I won't lose any more sleep wondering about that than I did when he was hitting last year.

 

Let's also remember that Villar has gotten the royal Bill Hall treatment. You're a shortstop. Okay, we're bringing up Arcia; now you're a third baseman. Wait, we dumped Gennett and got Shaw; now you're a second baseman. All of this in like half a season. I think Hernan Perez may be spoiling our ability to realize how difficult it is for most normal mortals to play regularly at new positions. So that mitigates some of Villar's boneheadedness for me.

 

Anyway, let's see if he can find his offensive form. Tonight's a good start.

[danzig6767]

If Villar can be 80 percent of the player he was last year, he's a good starter, mental mistakes and all. In one of the transaction threads, I think, people are taking it as given that he's just a utility guy now. That seems very premature to me. He was our best position player last year. He's young. He has a broad talent base. I love Sogard more than most people (I'm probably the biggest nerd here), but penciling in Sogard over Villar even for the rest of this year, let alone beyond that, seems to reflect recency bias.

 

I don't know what Villar's deal is with baserunning. I agree that Counsell's benching him after he didn't run out that squibber was wise and refreshing. OTOH, Villar landed on the DL by absolutely, almost literally, busting his butt to make a spectacular defensive play. He's not a low-motor guy across the board. I don't know if he's arrogant, flaky, stupid, immature, or something else, but if he starts hitting I won't lose any more sleep wondering about that than I did when he was hitting last year.

When it comes to baserunning brainfarts with Villar, i think it's just an instincts or low baseball IQ issue. Some players for whatever reason are naturally smart baserunners, when to use their speed to take extra bases and when not to take the risk. They consistently understand game situations at a given time.

 

Villar is the opposite. The wheels in his brain aren't processing these things as smart baserunners do. So say there is nobody out and Thames/Braun are do up next, the smart baserunner naturally thinks it's not worth the risk to try stretching out a double into a triple if it's likely going to be a close play at third. Villar on the flip side gets lost in the moment and takes the overly aggressive approach. Same for to often trying to steal third. His mind just sees hey, i think i can steal a base here. The smarter baserunner thinks, hey maybe i could steal third here, but with two outs and Braun at the plate down a run, the risk/reward ratio just isn't worth it.

 

I'm in your camp in wanting to see him play because last year showed that Villar has rare leadoff talent. He hit for average, home run/doubles power, and drew lots of walks, but odds are pretty good in mu view that those frustrating brainfarts on the bases and sometimes defensively will always be a part of the package when it comes to Villar. It's in his baseball DNA, similar to Carlos Gomez. Lots of talent, but to often questionable decision making.

[jerichoholicninja]

If Villar can be 80 percent of the player he was last year, he's a good starter, mental mistakes and all. In one of the transaction threads, I think, people are taking it as given that he's just a utility guy now. That seems very premature to me. He was our best position player last year. He's young. He has a broad talent base. I love Sogard more than most people (I'm probably the biggest nerd here), but penciling in Sogard over Villar even for the rest of this year, let alone beyond that, seems to reflect recency bias.

 

I don't know what Villar's deal is with baserunning. I agree that Counsell's benching him after he didn't run out that squibber was wise and refreshing. OTOH, Villar landed on the DL by absolutely, almost literally, busting his butt to make a spectacular defensive play. He's not a low-motor guy across the board. I don't know if he's arrogant, flaky, stupid, immature, or something else, but if he starts hitting I won't lose any more sleep wondering about that than I did when he was hitting last year.

When it comes to baserunning brainfarts with Villar, i think it's just an instincts or low baseball IQ issue. Some players for whatever reason are naturally smart baserunners, when to use their speed to take extra bases and when not to take the risk. They consistently understand game situations at a given time.

 

Villar is the opposite. The wheels in his brain aren't processing these things as smart baserunners do. So say there is nobody out and Thames/Braun are do up next, the smart baserunner naturally thinks it's not worth the risk to try stretching out a double into a triple if it's likely going to be a close play at third. Villar on the flip side gets lost in the moment and takes the overly aggressive approach. Same for to often trying to steal third. His mind just sees hey, i think i can steal a base here. The smarter baserunner thinks, hey maybe i could steal third here, but with two outs and Braun at the plate down a run, the risk/reward ratio just isn't worth it.

 

I'm in your camp in wanting to see him play because last year showed that Villar has rare leadoff talent. He hit for average, home run/doubles power, and drew lots of walks, but odds are pretty good in mu view that those frustrating brainfarts on the bases and sometimes defensively will always be a part of the package when it comes to Villar. It's in his baseball DNA, similar to Carlos Gomez. Lots of talent, but to often questionable decision making.

 

Instincts are what happens in the split second, whether to turn a double into a triple for example. Stealing third takes forethought. The fact that he keeps doing it even after benchings because of it means he's either a total idiot who can't remember simple things or he doesn't care.

[clancyphile]

If Villar can be 80 percent of the player he was last year, he's a good starter, mental mistakes and all. In one of the transaction threads, I think, people are taking it as given that he's just a utility guy now. That seems very premature to me. He was our best position player last year. He's young. He has a broad talent base. I love Sogard more than most people (I'm probably the biggest nerd here), but penciling in Sogard over Villar even for the rest of this year, let alone beyond that, seems to reflect recency bias.

 

I don't know what Villar's deal is with baserunning. I agree that Counsell's benching him after he didn't run out that squibber was wise and refreshing. OTOH, Villar landed on the DL by absolutely, almost literally, busting his butt to make a spectacular defensive play. He's not a low-motor guy across the board. I don't know if he's arrogant, flaky, stupid, immature, or something else, but if he starts hitting I won't lose any more sleep wondering about that than I did when he was hitting last year.

When it comes to baserunning brainfarts with Villar, i think it's just an instincts or low baseball IQ issue. Some players for whatever reason are naturally smart baserunners, when to use their speed to take extra bases and when not to take the risk. They consistently understand game situations at a given time.

 

Villar is the opposite. The wheels in his brain aren't processing these things as smart baserunners do. So say there is nobody out and Thames/Braun are do up next, the smart baserunner naturally thinks it's not worth the risk to try stretching out a double into a triple if it's likely going to be a close play at third. Villar on the flip side gets lost in the moment and takes the overly aggressive approach. Same for to often trying to steal third. His mind just sees hey, i think i can steal a base here. The smarter baserunner thinks, hey maybe i could steal third here, but with two outs and Braun at the plate down a run, the risk/reward ratio just isn't worth it.

 

I'm in your camp in wanting to see him play because last year showed that Villar has rare leadoff talent. He hit for average, home run/doubles power, and drew lots of walks, but odds are pretty good in mu view that those frustrating brainfarts on the bases and sometimes defensively will always be a part of the package when it comes to Villar. It's in his baseball DNA, similar to Carlos Gomez. Lots of talent, but to often questionable decision making.

 

I like that aggressiveness in Villar. The big problem, IMO, is getting him enough ABs to get back on track after missing that time while hurt. Now, Sogard's been hot, but looking at his pre-2017 stats, I think a regression to norms is probable.

[danzig6767]

When it comes to baserunning brainfarts with Villar, i think it's just an instincts or low baseball IQ issue. Some players for whatever reason are naturally smart baserunners, when to use their speed to take extra bases and when not to take the risk. They consistently understand game situations at a given time.

 

Villar is the opposite. The wheels in his brain aren't processing these things as smart baserunners do. So say there is nobody out and Thames/Braun are do up next, the smart baserunner naturally thinks it's not worth the risk to try stretching out a double into a triple if it's likely going to be a close play at third. Villar on the flip side gets lost in the moment and takes the overly aggressive approach. Same for to often trying to steal third. His mind just sees hey, i think i can steal a base here. The smarter baserunner thinks, hey maybe i could steal third here, but with two outs and Braun at the plate down a run, the risk/reward ratio just isn't worth it.

 

I'm in your camp in wanting to see him play because last year showed that Villar has rare leadoff talent. He hit for average, home run/doubles power, and drew lots of walks, but odds are pretty good in mu view that those frustrating brainfarts on the bases and sometimes defensively will always be a part of the package when it comes to Villar. It's in his baseball DNA, similar to Carlos Gomez. Lots of talent, but to often questionable decision making.

 

Instincts are what happens in the split second, whether to turn a double into a triple for example. Stealing third takes forethought. The fact that he keeps doing it even after benchings because of it means he's either a total idiot who can't remember simple things or he doesn't care.

I do blame Counsell a bit when it comes to Villar trying to steal third to often. Craig has seen Villar be reckless enough when it comes to this and in some situations should have put a stop sign on Villar when the risk/reward for stealing third simply isn't high enough in the reward category.

 

Remove any impulse which Villar might have to take off and try stealing third when the risk outweighs the reward by to much. Part of being a good manager is knowing his players strengths and weaknesses, including guys who struggle grasping game situations.

[Greenleaf1]

Holy crap, was at the game yesterday and Villar was such a bummer at the top of the order. 3 K's swinging to start his day, then a fielder's choice in the 7th inning that turns into a CS right before Thames jacked his 2nd homer of the day. If he's trying to steal in front of a red hot Thames, he better be damn sure he can make it. All I could think to say as Thames's ball was leaving the yard was "I hate you, Jonathan Villar".

 

I know Sogard's injury is at least a silver lining in that it can give Villar some regular playing time for a week or so, but I'd still rather see Perez at 2B today and let Arcia bad leadoff with Sogard out.

[adambr2]

He's going to be a cautionary tale for all young guys who have an outlier of a really good season and then think they're better than they are.

 

He'll still get tendered for a million or 2 next year and get one more shot but 2018 is going to be a make or break season for him, because if he repeats this year he won't he back in 2019.

[nate82]

Holy crap, was at the game yesterday and Villar was such a bummer at the top of the order. 3 K's swinging to start his day, then a fielder's choice in the 7th inning that turns into a CS right before Thames jacked his 2nd homer of the day. If he's trying to steal in front of a red hot Thames, he better be damn sure he can make it. All I could think to say as Thames's ball was leaving the yard was "I hate you, Jonathan Villar".

 

 

That steal came from the dugout. Thames was taking all the way as he had the take sign for the steal.

[pacopete4]

Villar hating at its best today.

[jerichoholicninja]

He was clearly safe. Counsell just didn't challenge for some reason.