Tyler Thornburg traded to Boston for 3B Travis Shaw, SS Mauricio Dubon, RHP Josh Pennington, SS Yeison Coca

[shanedog19]

I think this is a very nice haul for the Brewers. I think its pretty safe to say we aren't done yet this off season either.

[djoctagone]

Yah, usually if it's an "or cash" PTBNL, it's a pretty marginal player.

 

Might be a similar deal as Manny Pina last year, where the guy is Rule 5 eligible and can't be traded until after the draft.

last year, pina was acquired the same day as the rule 5 draft--but after the rule 5 draft had concluded. thus, we could know as early as thursday late morning.

but it may take as long as six months before we know if the return is cash or another player.

[clancyphile]

I think the 'underwhelming' feeling that people may be having is that there is no potential elite player coming back for Tyler.

 

My biggest issue is who is the real Travis Shaw. As Briggs pointed out, he was never that good in the minors, and he was pretty awful in the second half of 2016. He doesn't walk that much, strikes out quite a bit. If he can hit .260-.270 with 15-20 HR with solid defense, that's pretty good. But if he's ends up hitting .240 with a .300 OBP, it's pretty weak.

 

Haven't really seen Shaw play, so I don't know that much about him. Strictly going to stats and some scouting reports, which are nothing special.

 

Shaw is cheap, though... and passable at third for a couple of years. Keep in mind, with Erceg in the minors, a couple of decent years from Shaw may be all the Brewers need.

[clancyphile]

How does Dubon compare to Diaz?

 

Arcia is our future at SS, Diaz was our future at 2B, where does this leave Dubon? Can he play 3B?

 

Arcia could always be dealt. Remember how Alcides Escobar was supposed to be the future at SS... he was for a year, then got dealt in the Greinke trade.

 

Dubon makes that sort of move possible.

[sveumrules]

Is Dubon starting at SS in AAA to start the year or placed back in AA? He will be 23 in July of the 2017 season.

 

He put up a 151 wRC+ in 269 AA plate appearances last year so I would think an assignment to AAA to start the year would be fine. Who would be the AAA SS otherwise, Rivera again?

[3and2Fastball]

This is a heckuva great trade for the Brewers. Thornburg is good but the price for good relief pitching is sky high, possibly higher than it will ever be again. Excited about Dubon in particular

[JDBrewCrew]

Dubon enters at #9 on MLB top 30. FV moved up from 45 to 50.

[clancyphile]

The question is whether Shaw/Perez is an upgrade over Perez/Gennett. I'm certainly not convinced, Yeah, he's got longer control than Scooter and more power and this allows Villar to move to 2B, but that control will mean nothing if Erceg progresses or he doesn't prove he's at worst a reliable LH platoon bat at 3B.

 

It certainly doesn't help Gennett's value as teams know he doesn't have a regular job with Brewers.

 

We do know that the Brewer bullpen has taken a tremendous hit, and it doesn't look like they are getting back anything close to offsetting that at least in the short term.

 

I think the bullpen can sort itself out.

 

Jhan Marinez, Rob Scahill, Jacob Barnes, and Brent Suter all could be options. Yeah, I said Suter. In 12 outings as a reliever in the majors, look at this number: 0. That's the number of runs allowed. Small sample size, but I always felt his floor was late-inning reliever/closer.

 

Knebel might be an option, and there's always the folks who don't win a spot in the rotation.

[NievesNoNO]

Like some of you I also, my initial reaction was, "meh, not exciting" but the more I think about it and read other's comments on the two prospects the more I like it.

 

Shaw is controllable which is nice, and can be league average against rhp. Maybe there's a bit of room for some upside but even if he is what he is, he's a MLB caliber 3B even if on the low end. Maybe he carves out a Trevor Plouff type career.

 

Dubon looks like a real nice prospect and Pennington is a decent gamble with a potential plus fastball.

 

I really like the fact Shaw gives them some more flexibility and hopefully leaves Perez as super-sub type. It still feel like there is a definite plan in place, which to me is the most important piece to this. Just by this deal and the Thames signing it does really feel like they are targeting guys and roles on this year's roster.

 

I'm looking forward to see what other deals fall into place this off-season.

[MrTPlush]

Is Dubon starting at SS in AAA to start the year or placed back in AA? He will be 23 in July of the 2017 season.

 

He put up a 151 wRC+ in 269 AA plate appearances last year so I would think an assignment to AAA to start the year would be fine. Who would be the AAA SS otherwise, Rivera again?

 

Not to mention Diaz is going to be at AA next year so it would make sense to put Dubon at AAA. While Diaz doesn't seem to have a future at SS for the Brewers it is smart to keep him playing both SS and 2B as long as possible. If Dubon becomes a legit 2B for us Diaz might be the expendable one who is traded later on. At which point being able to play SS means a lot to his trade value.

[Mass Haas]

AUDIO via MiLB.com: Taped during the AFL season, new Brewers middle infield prospect Mauricio Dubon (go to the 29:25 minute mark).

[FVBrewerFan]

Is Dubon starting at SS in AAA to start the year or placed back in AA? He will be 23 in July of the 2017 season.

 

He put up a 151 wRC+ in 269 AA plate appearances last year so I would think an assignment to AAA to start the year would be fine. Who would be the AAA SS otherwise, Rivera again?

 

Not to mention Diaz is going to be at AA next year so it would make sense to put Dubon at AAA. While Diaz doesn't seem to have a future at SS for the Brewers it is smart to keep him playing both SS and 2B as long as possible. If Dubon becomes a legit 2B for us Diaz might be the expendable one who is traded later on. At which point being able to play SS means a lot to his trade value.

 

I think Diaz will be at A+ ?

[3and2Fastball]

Shaw's #5 Similarity player on Baseball Reference is Thames

[clancyphile]

Is Dubon starting at SS in AAA to start the year or placed back in AA? He will be 23 in July of the 2017 season.

 

He put up a 151 wRC+ in 269 AA plate appearances last year so I would think an assignment to AAA to start the year would be fine. Who would be the AAA SS otherwise, Rivera again?

 

Not to mention Diaz is going to be at AA next year so it would make sense to put Dubon at AAA. While Diaz doesn't seem to have a future at SS for the Brewers it is smart to keep him playing both SS and 2B as long as possible. If Dubon becomes a legit 2B for us Diaz might be the expendable one who is traded later on. At which point being able to play SS means a lot to his trade value.

 

"Always in motion the future is."

 

We really don't know. What this does is provide a lot of flexibility - and with that flexibility, options.

 

If the Brewers really put it together and are a player or two away at he end of 2017, then Dubon and/or Diaz could be dealt for The Last Piece. If they are stalling out, Villar, Perez, and Arcia could be dealt, and they can re-stock the system. Or, there are all sorts of alternatives. Maybe Dubon becomes the CF of the future. Maybe the NL gets the DH, and that shakes things up.

 

Dubon and Diaz give the Brewers the flexibility to have options, and that's a good thing.

[sveumrules]

As a point of comparison the Red Sox traded for Carson Smith last offseason. He was coming off 70 innings of 2.31 ERA (2.12 FIP, 166 ERA+) work with Seattle & had five years of team control remaining. The return was Wade Miley & Jonathan Aro with the Mariners also sending Roenis Elias to Boston with Smith, who ended up requiring elbow surgery and only pitched 2 2/3 inning for Boston in 2016.

 

Compare that to the package we are getting for only three years of Thornburg coming off 67 innings of 2.15 ERA (2.83 FIP, 199 ERA+) work & it's hard for me to not think the return justifies the send.

[JohnBriggs12]

Peralta and Hader in the Brewer pen on opening day?

 

Remember Sale spent a year in the White Sox pen.

 

I do like Dubon. Hard finding advanced young hitters that make contact at a high rate like that these days. He's listed at 6 feet, 160 pounds, so my guess is he's got room for 25-30 more pounds and more power as his body matures. He's a guy who could put up some eye-popping numbers at altitude. Heck if Shaw doesn't pan out, maybe Dubon ends up at 3B sooner rather than later.

[JDBrewCrew]

Another Scouting Report on Dubon

 

http://2080baseball.com/reports/mauricio-dubon/

[MrTPlush]

I think Diaz will be at A+ ?

 

My bad whoops

[chuckiehacks]

Thornburg has always been one of my favorites, but I love this deal. The prospects, particularly Dubon, seem like a nice haul, but I feel like Thornburg's elbow is on borrowed time. He's one of the few hard throwers that tried the "rest/rehab instead of surgery" option with success. That would make me concerned for future elbow issues.*

 

*I'm not a doctor, nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

[MadScientist]

Anyone else think Pennington has a very good chance of at least being Thornburg two years from now? With that in mind the Brewers traded Thornburg in seasons where they won't compete to get new Thornburg back when they will, and picked up a possible solution to the third base hole and a solid 2B/SS prospect, and maybe another player as well.

[JohnBriggs12]

Anyone else think Pennington has a very good chance of at least being Thornburg two years from now? With that in mind the Brewers traded Thornburg in seasons where they won't compete to get new Thornburg back when they will, and picked up a possible solution to the third base hole and a solid 2B/SS prospect, and maybe another player as well.

 

He's probably 3 years away at best. He figures to be in Appleton's rotation this year so no I don't think Brewers had that in mind necessarily.

[Mass Haas]

Via Alec Dopp at 2080baseball.com --

 

[MrTPlush]

Anyone else think Pennington has a very good chance of at least being Thornburg two years from now?

 

Highly doubtful. Though that is more a compliment to Thornburg than a knock on Pennington.

[HighHeat19]

Love the trade. I think Pennington is being underrated. Hard thrower who had a pretty good WHIP last year. Both of these kids seem to be intelligent and hard workers with no baggage. If Dubon could develop a little more power it would be nice to see him slide over to third base. Nothing wrong with have an athletic third baseman who can steal some bags. I can see Dubron as a .300 hitter with 15 HR, 20 SB a year kind of guy.

 

The trade is about as fair as it can get. Every other GM knew that Thornburg was available so you have to know that this was the best offer on the table. Look at it from Boston's end end, 1 year wonder with an injury history? Tip of the hat to Mr. Stearns today.

[JDBrewCrew]

MLB Network RadioVerified account

‏@MLBNetworkRadio

Stearns on Travis Shaw, "We like players with versatility. I'm sure you'll see him at all 3 positions (3B,1B,LF)." #Brewers