José Fernández and Two Others Die in Boating Accident (Update, reply 37: Toxicology reports show cocaine + alcohol in JF's system)

[burnzy24]

Before everyone renders a complete judgement yet, police have interviewed a "highly reliable" witness who claimed that Fernandez was not driving the boat. This witness claims they were talking on the phone to Fernandez right before the accident and heard Fernandez giving directions to another person. http://sports.yahoo.com/news/witness-suggests-jose-fernandez-wasnt-driving-boat-at-time-of-fatal-accident-162442388.html

[torts]

it doesn't matter what the witness says, the second that toxicology report came out, the court of public opinion cast their judgement on him and wont waiver.

[MrTPlush]

Before everyone renders a complete judgement yet, police have interviewed a "highly reliable" witness who claimed that Fernandez was not driving the boat. This witness claims they were talking on the phone to Fernandez right before the accident and heard Fernandez giving directions to another person. http://sports.yahoo.com/news/witness-suggests-jose-fernandez-wasnt-driving-boat-at-time-of-fatal-accident-162442388.html

 

It doesn't really matter who was driving to be honest. Either Fernandez was driving(bad) or one of the two other people were driving. The later is still just as bad because they were getting directions from a drunk guy on cocaine and neither of his friends even knew how to drive a boat. The crash is mostly if not all Fernandez' fault any way you want to spin it.

[stoutdude04]

Before everyone renders a complete judgement yet, police have interviewed a "highly reliable" witness who claimed that Fernandez was not driving the boat. This witness claims they were talking on the phone to Fernandez right before the accident and heard Fernandez giving directions to another person. http://sports.yahoo.com/news/witness-suggests-jose-fernandez-wasnt-driving-boat-at-time-of-fatal-accident-162442388.html

 

It doesn't really matter who was driving to be honest. Either Fernandez was driving(bad) or one of the two other people were driving. The later is still just as bad because they were getting directions from a drunk guy on cocaine and neither of his friends even knew how to drive a boat. The crash is mostly if not all Fernandez' fault any way you want to spin it.

 

Do you know for a fact that neither of his friends knew how to drive a boat? I am actually curious as I never read that.

 

If he had someone sober behind the wheel I find it hard to be upset with him. He may have been giving directions minutes before the crash...or maybe seconds. I am not sure which.

 

Your opinion that it is his fault no matter the circumstance is confusing to me.

[MrTPlush]

Before everyone renders a complete judgement yet, police have interviewed a "highly reliable" witness who claimed that Fernandez was not driving the boat. This witness claims they were talking on the phone to Fernandez right before the accident and heard Fernandez giving directions to another person. http://sports.yahoo.com/news/witness-suggests-jose-fernandez-wasnt-driving-boat-at-time-of-fatal-accident-162442388.html

 

It doesn't really matter who was driving to be honest. Either Fernandez was driving(bad) or one of the two other people were driving. The later is still just as bad because they were getting directions from a drunk guy on cocaine and neither of his friends even knew how to drive a boat. The crash is mostly if not all Fernandez' fault any way you want to spin it.

 

Do you know for a fact that neither of his friends knew how to drive a boat? I am actually curious as I never read that.

 

If he had someone sober behind the wheel I find it hard to be upset with him. He may have been giving directions minutes before the crash...or maybe seconds. I am not sure which.

 

Your opinion that it is his fault no matter the circumstance is confusing to me.

 

Yes it was reported neither had much, if any, experience driving boats. I saw it in quite a few articles. I would have to find one of the article when I have time.

 

Allowing someone to drive your boat when they have no experience puts a lot of blame on yourself. Even more so if they aren't licensed to do so and it's required.

[brewerfan82]

It doesn't really matter who was driving to be honest. Either Fernandez was driving(bad) or one of the two other people were driving. The later is still just as bad because they were getting directions from a drunk guy on cocaine and neither of his friends even knew how to drive a boat. The crash is mostly if not all Fernandez' fault any way you want to spin it.

 

Do you know for a fact that neither of his friends knew how to drive a boat? I am actually curious as I never read that.

 

If he had someone sober behind the wheel I find it hard to be upset with him. He may have been giving directions minutes before the crash...or maybe seconds. I am not sure which.

 

Your opinion that it is his fault no matter the circumstance is confusing to me.

 

Yes it was reported neither had much, if any, experience driving boats. I saw it in quite a few articles. I would have to find one of the article when I have time.

 

Allowing someone to drive your boat when they have no experience puts a lot of blame on yourself. Even more so if they aren't licensed to do so and it's required.

And do you know they weren't licensed? There's a lot of reading between the lines going on here. I agree that *depending on the circumstances* there's a good chance a lot of the fault is probably on Fernandez, but when you're talking about someone that lost their life at such a young age, it seems a bit cold to jump on them and push their guilt so hard when you're only going on the tidbits of information provided by the media. No one here was on that boat, no one will ever know for sure what exactly happened. The guy did some amazing things in his short life and brought joy to many people. It sounds like he may have made some bad decisions his last night here, but I doubt he did so with malintent. Let him rest in peace.

[Fear The Chorizo]

The driver of the boat at the time of the crash was one of the two were recovered beneath it - the other one (not Fernandez, most likely Macias - the friend of his other friend with him who he just met hours earlier) was recovered on the other side of the jetty after presumably being ejected from the front of it when it crashed, at full speed nonetheless. Anyone who's been on a 30-ish foot sport fishing boat going 50 mph knows that having a phone conversation while driving it is basically impossible, and even doing so while riding up at the bow is probably not worth attempting due to the noise of the boat engine and even the air whipping past you. Seating on that type of boat would basically have Fernandez and one other person both sitting with direct access to the wheel, throttle/controls, and navigation system. An impaired Fernandez was either driving or giving directions to the driver of a boat going full speed at 3am. The jetty they struck apparently has had multiple crashes - just none that led to significant injuries or fatalities because speeds of the other boats were nowhere near as fast as what Kaught Looking was traveling when it struck the rocks.

 

Very likely the person who heard Fernandez giving directions while on the phone call witnessed something that happened while the boat was either idled or moving at a slow rate while they were trying to figure out direction/bearings. After Fernandez would've gotten off the call, he could have started piloting the boat almost instantly - we're not talking a 50' yacht with a separate wheelhouse and living quarters. Unless the witness was on the phone with Fernandez while the crash happened, it doesn't really shed any light on who ultimately was driving at that time - frankly it doesn't matter, because if he was the only one on the boat familiar with how to interpret the navigation system and jetty lighting/markers, someone behind the wheel without that knowledge doesn't have the experience to know what good judgement even is. And unless Fernandez entrusted boat piloting duties to Macias, a guy he didn't know prior to that night, both Fernandez and Rivero had cocaine in their system - meaning both likely drivers/navigators were impaired.

[owbc]

It's a tragedy. It's also a tragedy when other 20-somethings die in Miami, which occurs nearly every weekend. Usually it's a mangled car on I-95 or one of the other highways, or an overdose, or some other unnecessary death. I saw it all the time when I lived there. Miami-Dade county averages nearly 1 traffic fatality per day and 20% of them are alcohol-related. Recreational drug use is rampant.

 

I don't excuse any of it. It's a part of the culture that needs to disappear ASAP. I doubt it will, but at least maybe people will start thinking twice before endangering others with their reckless behavior. For that reason, it was essential that these results got released. People need to know that this was a preventable death.

[MrTPlush]

Yes it was reported neither had much, if any, experience driving boats. I saw it in quite a few articles. I would have to find one of the article when I have time.

 

Allowing someone to drive your boat when they have no experience puts a lot of blame on yourself. Even more so if they aren't licensed to do so and it's required.

And do you know they weren't licensed?

 

Nope, good thing I didn't say that.

[jerichoholicninja]

it doesn't matter what the witness says, the second that toxicology report came out, the court of public opinion cast their judgement on him and wont waiver.

 

As has clearly been evidenced by pretty much every post in this thread since this one.

 

People died. Lots of lives have been effected. It sucks. Everything else is pretty much irrelevant.

[DuWayne Steurer]

For that reason, it was essential that these results got released. People need to know that this was a preventable death.

 

I mean......I agree, but this changes nothing. Nobody *cares* really. I mean they care, but this won't change how more than potentially a handful of people change their substance use habits. It didn't happen to their family, so it literally does not matter in the greater scheme of things.

 

For most people, there's a disconnect. You have to see this hit home before it makes any sense.

[tmwiese55]

Has there been any reports on the toxicology of the other guys? I see some speculating on who was driving, just curious if they were all buzzed up?

[trwi7]

I think they said both had alcohol in their systems but neither was legally drunk and one of them also had cocaine in their system.

[owbc]

For that reason, it was essential that these results got released. People need to know that this was a preventable death.

 

I mean......I agree, but this changes nothing. Nobody *cares* really. I mean they care, but this won't change how more than potentially a handful of people change their substance use habits. It didn't happen to their family, so it literally does not matter in the greater scheme of things.

 

For most people, there's a disconnect. You have to see this hit home before it makes any sense.

 

But that's why I think this tragedy has a disproportionate opportunity to change the culture.

 

http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/dan-le-batard/article104096841.html

 

These kind of emotional connections in sports are so rare. We didn’t know him. But we did. Fernandez’s exile story was our story, from fleeing to freeing, so we mourned as a family and asked questions with no answers and appreciated life and love a little more than we did a few minutes earlier.

[CheezWizHed]

For that reason, it was essential that these results got released. People need to know that this was a preventable death.

 

I mean......I agree, but this changes nothing. Nobody *cares* really. I mean they care, but this won't change how more than potentially a handful of people change their substance use habits. It didn't happen to their family, so it literally does not matter in the greater scheme of things.

 

For most people, there's a disconnect. You have to see this hit home before it makes any sense.

 

Isn't that enough to make it worth releasing the information???

[JohnBriggs12]

Fernandez was hailed after his tragic death as this tremendous young man and role model. Maybe he was, but it turns out he was also making poor choices and taking unnecessary risks not unlike many immature adults with lots of money do. It's both sad and tragic but not completely random.

[Fear The Chorizo]

http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/18921310/investigation-finds-jose-fernandez-was-operating-boat-fatal-crash

 

Probably the most unfortunate part of this story is the legal battle this will cause over Fernandez's estate and how it will impact the lives of his mother, former girlfriend and newborn daughter, not to mention the families/friends of the other two killed that night.

[MrTPlush]

Someone tell the Marlins it isn't too late to not retire his number.