Baseball's bad seeds

[jerichoholicninja]

I've seen a lot made the last couple years on this board about not wanting a certain player because he's a cancer, clubhouse killer, etc. There are plenty of players in baseball history that had a reputation like that with plenty of evidence to back it up like Barry Bonds. But, and I'm not trying to be a dick or anything, can some of these accusations be backed up with significant evidence? Just because a reporter reports some anonymous people think a player has issues doesn't make it true or as bad as reported. We've all known people in our lives who have a terrible reputation but you can't see it in your dealings with them. So these guys like Puig, Pierzynski, Latos, etc. who some fans think are scum because of whatever reports, what evidence is there to prove this is true? Like I said, this isn't a gotchya or anything like that, I'm really curious if there is any real truth to this or do most guys gets their reputations from unsubstantiated claims made by anonymous people.

[Baldkin]

1) Just because guys remain anonymous doesn't mean that what they say isn't true.

 

http://www.latimes.com/sports/dodgers/dodgersnow/la-sp-dn-dodgers-yasiel-puig-divide-20151119-story.html

 

2) A LOT more gets heard and done than gets reported on. Many reporters/news outlets are scared to lose their credentials if they print something bad about a team or a player.

[monty57]

There are different circumstances for different players. Here's a Bleacher Report write up from Dec '15 regarding Puig:

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2597460-is-there-anybody-left-in-los-angeles-whom-yasiel-puig-hasnt-alienated

 

He seems like someone who has turned players on the Dodgers against each other. That is what I'd consider a clubhouse cancer and would like to avoid.

 

Meanwhile, there are players like Pierzynski (who you mentioned) who seemed to upset the other team, but never had a problem with his teammates. I'd say Molina is like that with the Cardinals. Those players can get your team "hated" by other fans, but can actually bring your team together.

 

Bonds was his own special category, and the dislike towards him is mostly due to steroids allowing him to add about 100 lbs of muscle and put together video game statistic years when he was around 40 years old.

 

There are all kinds of personalities in baseball, and not everyone is going to get along, but most can at least tolerate each other and cheer each other on as teammates. Puig seems to be one of those few that really can tear a team apart.

[sveumrules]

Here's one for AJ Pierzynski...

 

One of those now-it-can-be-told stories the White Sox, A.J. Pierzynski's new employer, surely haven't heard: During a Giants exhibition game last spring, Pierzynski took a shot to his, shall we say, private parts. Trainer Stan Conte rushed to the scene, placed his hands on Pierzynski's shoulders in a reassuring way, and asked how it felt. "Like this," said Pierzynski, viciously delivering a knee to Conte's groin. It was a real test of professionalism for the enraged Conte, who vowed to ignore Pierzynski for the rest of the season until Conte realized how that would look. The incident went unreported because all of the beat writers happened to be doing in-game interviews in the clubhouse, but it was corroborated by a half-dozen eyewitnesses who could hardly believe their eyes. Said one source, as reliable as they come: "There is absolutely no doubt that it happened."

 

Also remember Paul Wagner telling a Bonds story on WSSP awhile back. From looking at game logs it appears it was September 15, 1992. Wagner came in with the Pirates down 2-1 in the 5th and retired the side. In the Pirates half of the inning Bonds hit a 2 run HR to give them the lead and set up Wagner for his first career win. Wagner said Bonds came in and was high fiving everyone in the dugout but when he got to Wagner he spit at his feet and said something along the lines of "Don't (expletive) blow this game, rookie." Also believe there is a story out there about Bonds' college teammates voting to kick him off the team because they couldn't stand the guy.

[monty57]

Here's one for AJ Pierzynski...

 

Okay, so maybe I was wrong in my comment about Pierzynski not having problems with his teammates :-)

[CheezWizHed]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2597460-is-there-anybody-left-in-los-angeles-whom-yasiel-puig-hasnt-alienated

 

I'm not saying the guy isn't a cancer, but I question a couple of these things...

 

Andy Van Slyke's dad said that Kershaw said... Maybe Kershaw did, but those things more often than not come out far from the truth.

 

And the story about Greinke throwing Puig's luggage off the bus... I'm failing to see what Puig did wrong and seeing far more of Greinke being a jerk. The team is upset over a big loss, the vets order the rookies to get pizza, then get annoyed that its taking too long. So when Puig is looking for his suitcase, Greinke grabs it and throws it on the street... I'm not sure how that is Puig's fault.

 

But if we get Puig, we better get Gonzalez with him. Seems like the only mentor he has.

[jerichoholicninja]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2597460-is-there-anybody-left-in-los-angeles-whom-yasiel-puig-hasnt-alienated

 

I'm not saying the guy isn't a cancer, but I question a couple of these things...

 

Andy Van Slyke's dad said that Kershaw said... Maybe Kershaw did, but those things more often than not come out far from the truth.

 

And the story about Greinke throwing Puig's luggage off the bus... I'm failing to see what Puig did wrong and seeing far more of Greinke being a jerk. The team is upset over a big loss, the vets order the rookies to get pizza, then get annoyed that its taking too long. So when Puig is looking for his suitcase, Greinke grabs it and throws it on the street... I'm not sure how that is Puig's fault.

 

But if we get Puig, we better get Gonzalez with him. Seems like the only mentor he has.

 

When you spend basically 9 straight months with the same people you're going to get on each others nerves and stuff is going to happen. Throw in that veterans are generally given a free pass to be dicks to young guys (like above) and it's tough to really figure out who the bad guy is in some incidents.

 

If Puig really was turning players against each other that certainly is an issue but it also doesn't reflect well on the coaching staff or the player leaders on the team either that let it happen.

 

In regards to the Pierzynski story, I am in no way giving him a free pass but we've all had those situations where something really painful happens to us and when someone asks if we are ok our first reaction is take it out on them in some way. I'm sure most of us have even done exactly what he did at least once after we've gotten hit in the nuts.

[nate82]

Here's one for AJ Pierzynski...

 

One of those now-it-can-be-told stories the White Sox, A.J. Pierzynski's new employer, surely haven't heard: During a Giants exhibition game last spring, Pierzynski took a shot to his, shall we say, private parts. Trainer Stan Conte rushed to the scene, placed his hands on Pierzynski's shoulders in a reassuring way, and asked how it felt. "Like this," said Pierzynski, viciously delivering a knee to Conte's groin. It was a real test of professionalism for the enraged Conte, who vowed to ignore Pierzynski for the rest of the season until Conte realized how that would look. The incident went unreported because all of the beat writers happened to be doing in-game interviews in the clubhouse, but it was corroborated by a half-dozen eyewitnesses who could hardly believe their eyes. Said one source, as reliable as they come: "There is absolutely no doubt that it happened."

 

 

I am sorry but that is just funny and I have done the same thing to a friend when he asked how it felt.

[DHonks]

I've heard plenty of stories in Arizona about Curt Schilling. The media loved his golden-boy status, but the teams didn't like his antics.

[dlk9s]

I've heard plenty of stories in Arizona about Curt Schilling. The media loved his golden-boy status, but the teams didn't like his antics.

Considering what he acts like now, I have no doubt he was just awful in the clubhouse.

[DuWayne Steurer]

Jonathan Papelbon seems like an actual dick to everyone around him.

 

Most guys who are just general "jerks"..... I don't care. If you're a 5 WAR player, can mash, and aren't out getting arrested and whatnot.......you do you, I don't really care if you're just kind of a jerk.

 

But there are a few special guys who really make their workplace toxic.

 

 

 

And I don't know if Curt Schilling is a jerk or a clubhouse cancer, he just seems like he's all sorts of Tinfoil Hat crazy.

[pacopete4]

How did this guy not make the list?

http://www.jonbaas.com/film_mr3000c1.jpg

[dlk9s]

He turned out ok, though.

[stoutdude04]

 

 

And I don't know if Curt Schilling is a jerk or a clubhouse cancer, he just seems like he's all sorts of Tinfoil Hat crazy.

 

I did enjoy one of his video games he created though...so I let him slide.

[jerichoholicninja]

Jonathan Papelbon seems like an actual dick to everyone around him.

 

His is an interesting case that sort of supports one of my earlier points. After he choked Harper in the dugout how many fans and players came to his defense because "Harper was just an annoying kid mouthing off to a veteran"? Fans and the media give veteran players a pass all the time when they have issues with young players because these kids "don't know their place". In most instances both parties share blame but the younger guy will get the blunt of the negativity because he's young and should just kowtow to whatever a veteran player wants to inflict on him.

[dlk9s]

 

 

And I don't know if Curt Schilling is a jerk or a clubhouse cancer, he just seems like he's all sorts of Tinfoil Hat crazy.

 

I did enjoy one of his video games he created though...so I let him slide.

YOU were the one?

[1992casey]

Fans and the media give veteran players a pass all the time when they have issues with young players because these kids "don't know their place".

 

I think the ideal situation (and what usually happens) is that a young player "knows his place" and the veteran does everything he can to help the younger guy.

 

I recall a rookie showing up and handing out autographed pictures. That certainly would have gone over like a lead balloon.

[TURBO]

I recall a rookie showing up and handing out autographed pictures. That certainly would have gone over like a lead balloon.

 

Wow, who was that?

[1992casey]

I want to say it was J.D. Drew, but I'm not 100% sure on that anymore.

[stoutdude04]

 

 

And I don't know if Curt Schilling is a jerk or a clubhouse cancer, he just seems like he's all sorts of Tinfoil Hat crazy.

 

I did enjoy one of his video games he created though...so I let him slide.

YOU were the one?

 

Haha...I know I know. Not shockingly my 10$ worth of rentals didn't help his company survive.

[PrestigeWorldwide]

I don't recall what he did, but as a rookie Gregg Jeffries did something to anger his veteran teammates that resulted in them smashing every single one of his bats.

[DuWayne Steurer]

 

 

And I don't know if Curt Schilling is a jerk or a clubhouse cancer, he just seems like he's all sorts of Tinfoil Hat crazy.

 

I did enjoy one of his video games he created though...so I let him slide.

YOU were the one?

 

 

Surprisingly, the game itself got decent to good reviews from most of the gaming publications (never played it myself) but fared extremely poorly in sales. I imagine it had a lot do with marketing, and just super high expectations.