Brent Suter's contract selected, will start tomorrow in Seattle

[Greenleaf1]

My guess is we load up on cheap free agent lefties like we do every year. Suter won't be anywhere near the only lefty competing in ST for a spot in the BP, but I agree that he stands a good chance of staying there.

 

I think he's earned a chance in the rotation though, at least 2-3 starts at some point to show his stuff. Unless our minor league pitching dramatically improves next year and 3 or 4 guys are suddenly ready to come up I think Suter's going to get a chance to start some games next year.

[jerichoholicninja]

My guess is we load up on cheap free agent lefties like we do every year. Suter won't be anywhere near the only lefty competing in ST for a spot in the BP, but I agree that he stands a good chance of staying there.

 

I think he's earned a chance in the rotation though, at least 2-3 starts at some point to show his stuff. Unless our minor league pitching dramatically improves next year and 3 or 4 guys are suddenly ready to come up I think Suter's going to get a chance to start some games next year.

 

Who was it this year? Or last year? Smith was the only lefty for quite a while.

[TooLiveBrew]

My guess is we load up on cheap free agent lefties like we do every year. Suter won't be anywhere near the only lefty competing in ST for a spot in the BP, but I agree that he stands a good chance of staying there.

 

I think he's earned a chance in the rotation though, at least 2-3 starts at some point to show his stuff. Unless our minor league pitching dramatically improves next year and 3 or 4 guys are suddenly ready to come up I think Suter's going to get a chance to start some games next year.

 

Who was it this year? Or last year? Smith was the only lefty for quite a while.

Capuano this year.

[markedman5]

My guess is we load up on cheap free agent lefties like we do every year. Suter won't be anywhere near the only lefty competing in ST for a spot in the BP, but I agree that he stands a good chance of staying there.

 

I think he's earned a chance in the rotation though, at least 2-3 starts at some point to show his stuff. Unless our minor league pitching dramatically improves next year and 3 or 4 guys are suddenly ready to come up I think Suter's going to get a chance to start some games next year.

 

Who was it this year? Or last year? Smith was the only lefty for quite a while.

 

Also Sam Freeman this year and Neil Cotts last year

[FVBrewerFan]

My guess is we load up on cheap free agent lefties like we do every year. Suter won't be anywhere near the only lefty competing in ST for a spot in the BP, but I agree that he stands a good chance of staying there.

 

I think he's earned a chance in the rotation though, at least 2-3 starts at some point to show his stuff. Unless our minor league pitching dramatically improves next year and 3 or 4 guys are suddenly ready to come up I think Suter's going to get a chance to start some games next year.

 

Who was it this year? Or last year? Smith was the only lefty for quite a while.

 

Also Sam Freeman this year and Neil Cotts last year

 

And Sean Nolin

[Greenleaf1]

 

Also Sam Freeman this year and Neil Cotts last year

 

And Sean Nolin

 

Zach Duke a few years ago. Cesar Jimenez last year on waivers midseason then signed him again this offseason.

 

I'd be surprised if they didn't try the same strategy next year.

[clancyphile]

My guess is we load up on cheap free agent lefties like we do every year. Suter won't be anywhere near the only lefty competing in ST for a spot in the BP, but I agree that he stands a good chance of staying there.

 

I think he's earned a chance in the rotation though, at least 2-3 starts at some point to show his stuff. Unless our minor league pitching dramatically improves next year and 3 or 4 guys are suddenly ready to come up I think Suter's going to get a chance to start some games next year.

 

I think he ought to get a good shot at starting, but he does seem to be very effective in the bullpen as a fall-back. If anything, he certainly has shown he can start and fill just about every bullpen role (hasn't been tried as a closer yet, but hey... a left-handed Doug Jones?).

 

As for talent, I think there is definitely some: Based on his production, his control and command seem to be in the 70 range on the 20-80 scale. That would indicate two very plus "tools" pitching-wise.

[rwa12]

Not to be too much of a smart aleck, but I would guess command and control are easier when you throw everything 80 mph. I really like Suter in the bullpen, I think he's a nice change of pace. Good for a spot start as necessary, kinda the pitching equivalent of a utility man. He's a lefty that can throw strikes, no reason he can't have a long career in the majors.

[Austin Tatious]

I agree with rwa and others. I like Suter as a potential lefty out of the pen.

[Austin Tatious]

The thing that would help him the most would be to slot him between 2 guys that really throw gas, so he's a huge change up to them. That's why he projects better in the pen, because his FB is already the slider velocity of an average FB pitcher, he has instant velocity differential.

 

The idea that a soft tossing pitcher would benefit from a pitcher throwing gas the next night is false. You might try to throw the opposition off by having heat-soft tosser-heat so the third pitcher benefits from the speed differential from the soft tosser the night before. Not the other way around.

 

Regardless, the Brewers have Davies in that role. Get guys that are good pitchers. The better strategy is getting talented guys who can pitch and have arm talent. It's takes perseverance, good eye for drafting, and player development. Then you have a rotation that can win big.

[MKE81]

The thing that would help him the most would be to slot him between 2 guys that really throw gas, so he's a huge change up to them. That's why he projects better in the pen, because his FB is already the slider velocity of an average FB pitcher, he has instant velocity differential.

 

The idea that a soft tossing pitcher would benefit from a pitcher throwing gas the next night is false. You might try to throw the opposition off by having heat-soft tosser-heat so the third pitcher benefits from the speed differential from the soft tosser the night before. Not the other way around.

 

Regardless, the Brewers have Davies in that role. Get guys that are good pitchers. The better strategy is getting talented guys who can pitch and have arm talent. It's takes perseverance, good eye for drafting, and player development. Then you have a rotation that can win big.

Davies? 89-90mph isn't soft-tossing. Cubs/Braves must have had Maddux in that soft-tossing role forever too, right? Suter is 83-85 on fastball - that's somewhat common in HS. He should never have a rotation role.

 

But Suter out of the pen is effective for several reasons. Lefty. Huge change of pace following guys in the low-mid 90s. Works fast, which helps to make a player feel rushed in their approach and to eliminate a player quickly analyzing the pitches he's already thrown and guessing what's coming next so it's more reactionary. When you're used to seeing 90s it's a challenge seeing 83-84 with a 73 offspeed pitch. Versatility - can go several innings if needed and spot start (I think there's plenty of other options for spot starts though so wouldn't need him but he's capable of doing it).

 

If Suter is going 1 inning out of the pen he's typically only seeing 3-5 hitters so the other half of the lineup won't be effected if another hard throwing reliever is in when they hit. But it's that 1 inning that Suter is in the game where he can be effective and use his speed to his advantage.

[JohnBriggs12]

He upsets hitters' timing and that works even against big league hitters. He does it not only with the speed of his pitches, but with how incredibly fast he works. It's better off from the bullpen though because big league hitters will adjust the 2nd or 3rd time through.

[rwa12]

I'm going to do a cross sport non-exact comparison. Last week, in the US Open semi-finals, Djokovic was destroying Monfils. Monfils switched strategy and basically stopped trying. Took short choppy strokes, and basically fed the ball to Djokovic. Djokovic responded by overswinging and getting flustered. Suter is the baseball equivalent of this to me. It's not a knock on him, it's kind of like a strategy. When you put a guy in there, that theoretically, a high school hitter should be able to tee off on, I think guys overswing. His speed is deceiving, it looks easy to hit, but it's not. I'm not sure if this makes sense.

[dacbrewers]

Throwing strikes is key. Suter does that very well. Most of the guys that faced him in the St. Louis series were missing the ball by a foot. He made them look pretty ridiculous.

[reillymcshane]

 

As for talent, I think there is definitely some: Based on his production, his control and command seem to be in the 70 range on the 20-80 scale. That would indicate two very plus "tools" pitching-wise.

In all of MLB's top 100, only one guy gets a 70 for control. Heck, only one guy gets a 60 or 65. To say Suter has a 70 control is really stretching things.

[Thurston Fluff]

The thing that would help him the most would be to slot him between 2 guys that really throw gas, so he's a huge change up to them. That's why he projects better in the pen, because his FB is already the slider velocity of an average FB pitcher, he has instant velocity differential.

 

The idea that a soft tossing pitcher would benefit from a pitcher throwing gas the next night is false. You might try to throw the opposition off by having heat-soft tosser-heat so the third pitcher benefits from the speed differential from the soft tosser the night before. Not the other way around.

 

Regardless, the Brewers have Davies in that role. Get guys that are good pitchers. The better strategy is getting talented guys who can pitch and have arm talent. It's takes perseverance, good eye for drafting, and player development. Then you have a rotation that can win big.

Davies? 89-90mph isn't soft-tossing. Cubs/Braves must have had Maddux in that soft-tossing role forever too, right? Suter is 83-85 on fastball - that's somewhat common in HS. He should never have a rotation role.

 

If Suter's fastball is 83-85 that means he throws harder than Jamie Moyer did. You can't earn a spot if you aren't given a chance. If you don't give people a chance based on how hard they throw you risk losing out on a viable starter. This team cannot afford to miss out on any starting option. Given we are not likely to be competitive next season anyway there is no reason to eliminate anyone from competing for a starting role.

[monty57]

If you don't give people a chance based on how hard they throw you risk losing out on a viable starter. This team cannot afford to miss out on any starting option. Given we are not likely to be competitive next season anyway there is no reason to eliminate anyone from competing for a starting role.

 

Looking for players the traditional scouts hate was one of the "Moneyball" ways of finding value. Most people will disregard a player like Suter, but what would you rather have, someone who looks bad but gets results, or someone who looks good but doesn't get results?

 

Davies looks like a 12-year old, and Suter throws like a high schooler, but if they get batters out they should get their chance to shine. All the arguments against Suter are based on what people assume will happen. Let's give him a shot and see what actually happens before we give up on him.

[JohnBriggs12]

If you don't give people a chance based on how hard they throw you risk losing out on a viable starter. This team cannot afford to miss out on any starting option. Given we are not likely to be competitive next season anyway there is no reason to eliminate anyone from competing for a starting role.

 

Looking for players the traditional scouts hate was one of the "Moneyball" ways of finding value. Most people will disregard a player like Suter, but what would you rather have, someone who looks bad but gets results, or someone who looks good but doesn't get results?

 

Davies looks like a 12-year old, and Suter throws like a high schooler, but if they get batters out they should get their chance to shine. All the arguments against Suter are based on what people assume will happen. Let's give him a shot and see what actually happens before we give up on him.

 

I don't sense anyone is giving up on him. Look Kyle Hendricks is now the favorite to win the Cy Young and he's one or two MPH slower than Davies. I think Suter comes to camp next spring with a great chance to make the roster. What role that will be in is yet to be determined. There's probably more legit rotation candidates now than there are bullpen arms with a realistic shot. So his best chance might be as a reliever. That doesn't preclude him from starting at some point.

[rwa12]

I second Briggs statement. Well said.

[MrTPlush]

No not all arguments are on assumptions. One argument that he shouldn't be given a shot is simply because we have a lot better options than Suter for our rotation. That is just the reality of things. We are deep with solid starting rotation prospects. The only chance he gets a chance in the rotation is if he does well enough in spot starts to raise an eyebrow or two. Even then it seems like a long shot to even get a true chance.

[1992casey]

Timing is everything. If there are a couple of injuries and it's not desirable to promote a prospect, I could see Brent getting a shot.

[rwa12]

No not all arguments are on assumptions. One argument that he shouldn't be given a shot is simply because we have a lot better options than Suter for our rotation. That is just the reality of things. We are deep with solid starting rotation prospects. The only chance he gets a chance in the rotation is if he does well enough in spot starts to raise an eyebrow or two. Even then it seems like a long shot to even get a true chance.

 

We may have a number of starting rotation prospects in the system, but I don't believe we have many that are ready to compete at the MLB level. I would like to see Hader, but am wary of his control. Lopez has had more bad seasons than good. Jungmann is an enigma. Burgos seems to be a AAAA/#5 guy. I don't like Suter for the rotation, but he's certainly earned the opportunity, and I don't think he's really blocking anyone. If Hader/Ortiz/Bickford/Ponce etc. all work out as starters, he's obviously not in the conversation. But for 2017, he's probably in the top 8 being considered, barring trades/FA acquisitions.

[Greenleaf1]

I really can't imagine that in a market as dry for starting pitching as this offseason is that Stearns won't trade away at least one of our 6-man rotation right now, maybe more.

 

In the meantime, I don't see who else is ready from AAA to step into the rotation. Suter should get a good look in Spring Training for the rotation.

[clancyphile]

 

As for talent, I think there is definitely some: Based on his production, his control and command seem to be in the 70 range on the 20-80 scale. That would indicate two very plus "tools" pitching-wise.

In all of MLB's top 100, only one guy gets a 70 for control. Heck, only one guy gets a 60 or 65. To say Suter has a 70 control is really stretching things.

 

His career BB/9 in the minors is 2.5. The career HR/9 in the minors is 0.6.

 

I'd argue his primary skills are control and command - and they have to be very good if those numbers are that low.

[djoctagone]

suter gets one more start on friday in place of an injured taylor jungmann (hip).