Lucroy and Jeffress to the Rangers for CF Lewis Brinson, RHP Luis Ortiz, PTBNL…(Lucroy comments, post 523; PTBNL is Ryan Cordell, post 581)

[markedman5]

Ryan Cordell, acquired today to complete the Lucroy trade, joins the Brewers' prospect list at No. 18: atmlb.com/2c2VH1S

[brewcrewdue80]

Braun must be as good as gone. To take Cordell after Brinson/Phillips and Corey Ray draft pick. Santana. Broxton. Is there a new Defensive shift I'm unaware about? 6 OFs 1 Infielder Pitcher and catcher? Maybe that's the new "Tank strategy"

 

I'm not a fan of another toolsy meh type OF. Numbers aren't elite in any single category. Only positive is 6' 4" but he's fully grown at 24. So his body isn't growing in to more power to project. Just seems too ordinary for a position the team has a dozen ordinary types within it's minors. Add the necessary need to add to 40man for a AA highest reach guy, and makes this even more disappointing.

[MrTPlush]

A bit disappointing after the now fake report of it being a comparable prospect to Brinson/Ortiz. He isn't anything special to be honest. He was been old for his league the past two years...not old old but surely not a young buck. Has some power and speed so that is something to dream on.

[Austin Tatious]

Agree with everyone else. I liked Cordell a year or two ago when I thought he had a shot at 3rd. But since he cannot play third, he's essentially a Meh. We don't know if he's any better than a Nieuwy except Cordell isn't really a cf and is already physically advanced. If he becomes a quality 4th OF, that might be a victory.

 

If Brinson becomes a stud cF and Ortiz becomes a solud number 2 or number 3 starter, then Cordell as a fourth OF would still end up being a useful piece if he can get there.

[clancyphile]

Braun must be as good as gone. To take Cordell after Brinson/Phillips and Corey Ray draft pick. Santana. Broxton. Is there a new Defensive shift I'm unaware about? 6 OFs 1 Infielder Pitcher and catcher? Maybe that's the new "Tank strategy"

 

I'm not a fan of another toolsy meh type OF. Numbers aren't elite in any single category. Only positive is 6' 4" but he's fully grown at 24. So his body isn't growing in to more power to project. Just seems too ordinary for a position the team has a dozen ordinary types within it's minors. Add the necessary need to add to 40man for a AA highest reach guy, and makes this even more disappointing.

 

I like it.

 

The Brewers have a gaping hole at first base. Slide Braun over to first until Ronnie Gideon comes through the system (I'm in love with his power bat - looks very promising).

 

The 2017 outfield looks like Santana in left, Brinson in center, and Broxton in right. Young, but good. Arcia's gonna be the 2017 shortstop. Third base and second base will be handled by some combo of Perez and Villar. Catcher by some combo of Pina, Pinto, Susac, and/or Maldonado.

 

That is a starting eight that I like.

 

The good news kinda ends there. The bad news, aside from catcher, I don't see depth in-house. Rivera's a nice bench option, but he's good-field, no hit. Orf's an OBP machine, but not much pop or speed. Cordell becomes interesting as an option, but I think I'd give him until mid-2017 before calling him up. The outfield has more options, but I think Counsell's too enamoured with Nieuwenhuis. I like Michael Reed as a 4th OF option - he has OBP skills, but regressed a little at Colorado Springs.

 

Now, help could come from whoever the Brewers get from trading Scooter Gennett and Chris Carter. But that is the weakness I see now.

[FVBrewerFan]

Higher OPS in AA this year than Phillips or Nottingham, or Coulter A+/AA combined season. Yea, Cordell is 24 but he is coming off a very solid season.

[Ennder]

Color me unimpressed, oh well. Still not an awful trade but definitely not a good one for my money.

[patrickgpe]

We grabbed three top ten prospects from the Rangers. Maybe Cordell doesn't float your boat at the moment but it's hard to argue that we didn't receive higher end talent in return for Lucroy/Jeffress.

he does slot in #18 for the brewers for what its worth

[brewmann04]

I just hope that DS can find a way to move some of those OF for a quality Starter

[MrTPlush]

Higher OPS in AA this year than Phillips or Nottingham, or Coulter A+/AA combined season. Yea, Cordell is 24 but he is coming off a very solid season.

 

He should be having more than just a solid season when he is 24 years old at AA. He dominated some lower levels as a college draftee. Color me not too impressed. Not saying he isn't a prospect, but sure isn't something special at this point.

 

I have seen some make it seem like his power won't play at a corner OF position, but he has an OPS over .800 and 20+ homerun power. His slugging % is actually quite high. He has a Marcell Ozuna type line and that isn't too bad.

[clancyphile]

Higher OPS in AA this year than Phillips or Nottingham, or Coulter A+/AA combined season. Yea, Cordell is 24 but he is coming off a very solid season.

 

He should be having more than just a solid season when he is 24 years old at AA. He dominated some lower levels as a college draftee. Color me not too impressed. Not saying he isn't a prospect, but sure isn't something special at this point.

 

I have seen some make it seem like his power won't play at a corner OF position, but he has an OPS over .800 and 20+ homerun power. His slugging % is actually quite high. He has a Marcell Ozuna type line and that isn't too bad.

 

I think he has 20-25 HR power, plus he can play 3B, SS, 1B, all three OF positions, and I bet in a pinch, he could cover second base as well.

 

He provides depth, and that has value on its own. Ideally, if Isan Diaz explodes and can move up the ladder very quickly, Cordell and Hernan Perez become part of a "Bench mob" that can give the Crew that extra edge.

[MadThinker88]

I wonder which pitchers (if any) were on the list for selection.

Not a fan of this PTBNL but if he was the best on the list, DS did what he could.

[Never Outhustled]

Higher OPS in AA this year than Phillips or Nottingham, or Coulter A+/AA combined season. Yea, Cordell is 24 but he is coming off a very solid season.

 

He should be having more than just a solid season when he is 24 years old at AA. He dominated some lower levels as a college draftee. Color me not too impressed. Not saying he isn't a prospect, but sure isn't something special at this point.

 

I have seen some make it seem like his power won't play at a corner OF position, but he has an OPS over .800 and 20+ homerun power. His slugging % is actually quite high. He has a Marcell Ozuna type line and that isn't too bad.

 

It should also be noted that Cordell's stats are inflated Texas League style.

[wichmae]

He cannot play SS or 3B to any of you who are considering it. He hasnt played IF in a year and was a disaster when he was there. He's most likely a guy who profiles much like Corey Hart or what we hoped Santana would be. Not sure why people are upset with this.

[And That]

It should also be noted that Cordell's stats are inflated Texas League style.

The Texas League's days of being an offensive haven have long passed. In terms of AA run scoring per game:

 

Eastern League: 4.34 runs per game

Texas League: 4.12

Southern League: 4.09

 

The Texas League had fewer runs scored per game than the following affiliated leagues, besides the Eastern League:

 

American League - 4.57

National League - 4.43

 

Pacific Coast League (AAA) - 4.78

California League (A+) - 5.00

Carolina League (A+) - 4.53

South Atlantic League (A) - 4.20

Northwest League (A-) - 4.81

Three of the four Rookie-level leagues, and it was tied with the fourth (the GCL)

 

OTOH, it had more runs scored than just five other affiliated leagues. It had 0.08 more runs per game than the dreaded Florida State League.

 

If you want to drill down further, Frisco, which is the Rangers' Texas League affiliate, scored exactly 4 runs per game.

[dacrew101]

I expected this ptbnl to underwhelm most, it wasn't really going to be a player on the same caliber as brinson and Ortiz

 

 

I'm fine with it, just wonder what we are going to do with all these outfielders

[Never Outhustled]

He cannot play SS or 3B to any of you who are considering it. He hasnt played IF in a year and was a disaster when he was there. He's most likely a guy who profiles much like Corey Hart or what we hoped Santana would be. Not sure why people are upset with this.

 

Domingo Santana was better in AA at age 20 than Cordell was 24. Santana is actually younger than Cordell.

[MKE81]

I think people had it stuck in their minds we were getting a legitimate young rotation arm or young high ceiling position player so when Cordell's name popped up they were disappointed. In order for the PTBNL to be near the same level as Brinson/Ortiz you're solely looking at Gallo and Mendez - both of whom were either already not an option or unlikely. Not sure what else you all wanted given Cordell was ranked Top 6-10 the past 2 seasons in their system by multiple publications. Just because he's not 20-22yrs old doesn't mean he's not a legitimate prospect and someone who can contribute at the MLB level. Not everyone develops at the same age.

 

If given a full 550AB season he's averaging very similar numbers at A, A+, AA - levels he's been at the age level of competition - with around 28 doubles, 8 triples, 25HR, 85rbi, 20SB while playing great defense in all 3 OF spots. How can you not be happy with that as the 3rd piece to this trade? At AA last year a lot of people have been saying he was playing hurt, which is why his numbers were so poor. He also had a couple injuries this year as well but even with his slash line dipping this year in AA the rest of his numbers stayed the course. He was actually the #2 CF prospect in their system behind Brinson. And by all accounts he's capable in CF but would be a better (plus) defender in a corner spot with an arm that can play in RF. He's a valuable player and most people on here are complaining (not surprising). The OF's in the system will decide who plays. The others will be traded for talent at other spots that will help this team become more competitive.

 

This trade was definitely better than the Indians trade. I don't think people should put a ton of stock in rankings but the Rangers system was rated higher (top 7) than the Indians (middle of pack) and Stearns just took their #2, 3, 6 (at time of trade) prospects with 2 of them being studs. Including Jeffress in the deal allowed for a much higher quality return.

 

http://www.baseballamerica.com/minors/cordell-opens-eyes-in-rangers-system/#MlER1QjSYQQzYlRg.97

[Thurston Fluff]

I expected this ptbnl to underwhelm most, it wasn't really going to be a player on the same caliber as brinson and Ortiz

 

 

I'm fine with it, just wonder what we are going to do with all these outfielders

I agree with you on the first part.

As for the second part, given the number of good prospects that fail, I don't think you can ever have too many in any position. Put as many talented players on the field as possible and it will work itself out. If we have the good fortune to have too many good players ready for the majors at any given time I don't think that is really a problem. Ditto goes for 40 man roster spaces. If we lose someone in the rule five it's just a sign of how far we've come.

[FVBrewerFan]

Braun must be as good as gone. To take Cordell after Brinson/Phillips and Corey Ray draft pick. Santana. Broxton. Is there a new Defensive shift I'm unaware about? 6 OFs 1 Infielder Pitcher and catcher? Maybe that's the new "Tank strategy"

 

Nothing to do with Braun. Seems more than a couple here seem to be almost upset by the number of OF in the system.

 

Why? Would it be better to get another pitcher just because he has P next to his name instead of OF? Stearns has proven he wants the best talent back in any trade, regardless of position or level.

 

Not even close to knowing if Phillips or Ray will make it. Or Clark, Coulter, or anyone else. Brinson will get a shot, but no lock that he can be quality starter. Injuries happen, and sometimes development doesn't.

 

At this stage it's still all about acquiring talent. Period. The day an OF is hitting .980 in AAA, ready for MLB and is blocked is the day I'll start worrying about too many OF.

[wichmae]

He cannot play SS or 3B to any of you who are considering it. He hasnt played IF in a year and was a disaster when he was there. He's most likely a guy who profiles much like Corey Hart or what we hoped Santana would be. Not sure why people are upset with this.

 

Domingo Santana was better in AA at age 20 than Cordell was 24. Santana is actually younger than Cordell.

Fairly certain you typed that wrong without looking up birthdates but Brinson literally just came from that AA team and was hitting pedestrian there as well. I also said profiles so not sure why youre trying to compare production. Two completely different things.

[HighHeat19]

DS is for sure trying to acquire the 5 tool player. You could see this in Houston when they traded for Gomez. And you can see this blueprint in other Houston players and prospects. The trouble I see, and just like Houston is that hitting eye is being neglected for the speed/arm/power tools. However, if your hitter eye can't put the bat on the ball those other tools are nil. You are seeing this as an issue with Kirk and Keon.

 

DS is definitely the anti one trick pony.

 

It is interesting to see that the Stros and Brewers currently have similar offensive numbers except for runs.

 

Personally, I would rather see the Brewers focus 70% on pitching and 30% on hitting. And acquire position players that are pure hitters/great eye w/ 20HR power.

 

However, I give the Brewers credit now for having a plan and sticking to it. Dougie seemed to try to throw mud and hoped it stuck with overpriced, over the hill pitching and Rob Deer look a-likes.

[MrTPlush]

Possible problem of having to many players at one position and having nowhere to put them? The Cubs had/have that problem. That's a problem a would love to have.

[MrTPlush]

Dougie seemed to try to throw mud and hoped it stuck with overpriced, over the hill pitching and Rob Deer look a-likes.

 

No, that was Mark Attanasio. Many of the overpriced signings were Attanasio telling him to do it. Melvin was also forced to keep filling the roster with old players etc. because Attanasio wanted to compete and that was no place for unproven rookies. Also didn't help payroll was maxed out forcing us to go with cheap options that weren't all that great. Doug Melvin threw mud at a wall because Attanasio insisted on trying to compete.

 

Back on topic David Stearns is going after the best talent. The odds we end up with 4 OFers(one can move to 1B) that all pan out to be notably above average is sadly pretty low.

[MNBrew]

Back on topic David Stearns is going after the best talent. The odds we end up with 4 OFers(one can move to 1B) that all pan out to be notably above average is sadly pretty low.

And the odds that we're going to have 3 repeat All-Stars is also sadly pretty low. OFs like the mid/late-'80s Blue Jays or the 1990-ish Pirates' teams just don't come around that often.

 

It seems quite evident that the idea behind the Stearns mantra of acquiring as much young, controllable talent as possible is really about improving your team's odds. Every time tries to improve their odds. Not all do it by the same method. Not all teams have the means to accomplish it to the extent they'd hope. And there's no sure-fire way to guarantee that good odds will yield the desired results on the field.

 

While we'll all have our opinions on most players, none of us has a crystal ball. I'm intrigued by Cordell but I'm not convinced of anything about him, good or bad. With him, as with all these guys acquired in the various trades & recent drafts, I'm going to be very curious to find out how these guys develop & how the Brewers' future unfolds.