Lucroy and Jeffress to the Rangers for CF Lewis Brinson, RHP Luis Ortiz, PTBNL…(Lucroy comments, post 523; PTBNL is Ryan Cordell, post 581)

[1992casey]

It was mentioned earlier that naming the PTBNL could be as late as after the World Series. Hopefully, "after the minor league season" means immediately after the season. But a later date still fits that description.

[Thundercat32]

When did Jeremy Jeffress turn into the second-coming of Mariano Rivera? The guy has a substance abuse problem.

 

You are overemphasizing Jeffress' substance issues. Jeffress failed his last drug test in 2009. By his own admission he was using to deal with epilepsy. The Blue Jays made him get treatment, found a better medication for him and subjected him to extra drug tests. By all accounts the marijuana use is far in the past with Jeffress.

 

I agree with the rest of your assessment on this trade, but it's been over 7 years since his last drug test. I feel like he has that under control. He knows what will happen if he fails another test.

 

Absolutely NOTHING will happen if he fails another drug test. MLBPA does NOT suspend players for testing positive for marijuana.

 

 

Schlitz001,

 

I agree with you. It does seem to be an issue in Jeffress' past; however, do you think the Rangers highlighted that concern as a negotiation tactic? I would if I were the Rangers. It does hurt his value and makes the two top pitching prospects for Jeffress pretty much a pipedream.

 

Baldkin,

 

Eh, I quoted an article, and then had to make an edit because I read the article wrong & cited the wrong paragraph. It seems like you are right in terms of expectation, but incorrect in terms of the letter of the law. Also, apparently players can still be suspended for marijuana, under the JDA, if they are convicted of possession by a court of law; although, there again players who have been convicted of marijuana use have yet to be suspended (though, I don't know of a player with Jeffress' past who has been convicted, yet).

 

Here's the article, if anyone's interested: http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/marijuana-and-the-joint-drug-agreement/

 

I do agree this new information boosts Jeffress' value. However, it doesn't eliminate completely the chance of a lengthy suspension for Jeffress; also, given his previous poor judgement (which is how it would be spun if he were to fail another drug test or caught with marijuana in his possession), I don't think the possibility of Jeffress using another substance can be ruled out, either. He certainly carries more risk than another reliever with a clean drug use record. So, it's still a consideration if I'm the Rangers.

[1992casey]

What I'm getting from the article is that a player needs to be in a treatment plan and violate it before a marijuana suspension can happen.

[Thundercat32]

What I'm getting from the article is that a player needs to be in a treatment plan and violate it before a marijuana suspension can happen.

 

Yeah, I misread the article (it's 1am & I've had a few cold ones!). But, I edited my post & corrected my error.

 

Cliffs: Drug suspension much less likely. Concern for Jeffress previous drug use not completely eliminated if I'm the Rangers.

[ZBTMP]

I don't get the barfing over Fasola. He may not be a 50 FV, but he is an intriguing arm. His scouting report coming into this year combined with a >20% k-bb% makes me think he is a good bet to be a key bulpen contributer at some point in the not so distant future. What am I missing?

 

Fasola looks like he could be a big-league reliever right now, with easy mid-90s heat that seems to get on hitters even quicker than that and also a potentially plus slider. He shows some feel for a changeup as well, but if the slider comes around like it should, he won’t need it much. Not only does he have the stuff to be a solid bullpen piece, but he pounds the zone with better frequency than most relievers as well. Developmental needs mostly center around commanding his slider, as he tends to spin out toward first base and leave it on the arm side of the plate. Being able to bury it down to the glove side consistently will push the pitch up another notch, giving him setup potential.

[MillerParkSouth]

I think the barfing is people holding out hope that the PTBNL will be a top prospect, as unlikely as that is.

[ZBTMP]

I think the barfing is people holding out hope that the PTBNL will be a top prospect, as unlikely as that is.

 

Given his exceptional statistical profile, scouting report of multiple plus pitches, and relative high floor due to proximity to the majors I wouldn't assume his inclusion on the list means a younger guy like Guzman isn't on the list.

[homer]

I wonder if the Brewers are scouting the rookie leagues for a "get him before he breaks out" guy like one of the pitchers in the Lind deal. I'd be totally ok with that.

[zjl3]

"the advice was to take multiple players from the lower levels"

 

OK, the main issue is that the Rangers traded D. Tate BEFORE the Lucroy deal was finished. It is very possible that Tate was included in that list of multiple players from the lower levels. Maybe that had something to do with Brinson being taken instead?

[brewcrewdue80]

"the advice was to take multiple players from the lower levels"

 

OK, the main issue is that the Rangers traded D. Tate BEFORE the Lucroy deal was finished. It is very possible that Tate was included in that list of multiple players from the lower levels. Maybe that had something to do with Brinson being taken instead?

 

A poster gave his insider list I recall of Mendez, Guzman, Jurado, and Payano in order of priority. But someone decided on Brinson/Ortiz/ptbnl.

 

Seems the scouts advice werent taken. Howd you like to be that group?

If your advice isnt taken, then why not just make your next priority list the worst 5 you seen in a teams top 30? Your work doesnt matter with ignoring your opinions.

 

Arcia's stance. Maybe theres a body frame that allows him to make it work. Youth, slender, and athleticism? As he ages and body fills out some more maybe then he takes a more traditional stance?

I will say his swinging was Gomez like in agression. I dont see an approach where he has any intention of using CF/Opposite field. Thats a little worrisome for immediate future. But at same time, if hes swinging this way and gets eaten alive by ML Pitching. Well he gets to work on that in AAA to start next year

[brewcrewdue80]

Oh just to create a riot, Joey Gallo was sent to the minors upon the trade anouncement. So If the Ptbnl cannot play a Mlb game, well he would qualify as not doing that currently and eligible for ptbnl. Have fun with that tidbit

[MKE81]

"the advice was to take multiple players from the lower levels"

 

OK, the main issue is that the Rangers traded D. Tate BEFORE the Lucroy deal was finished. It is very possible that Tate was included in that list of multiple players from the lower levels. Maybe that had something to do with Brinson being taken instead?

 

A poster gave his insider list I recall of Mendez, Guzman, Jurado, and Payano in order of priority. But someone decided on Brinson/Ortiz/ptbnl.

 

Seems the scouts advice werent taken. Howd you like to be that group?

If your advice isnt taken, then why not just make your next priority list the worst 5 you seen in a teams top 30? Your work doesnt matter with ignoring your opinions.

 

Arcia's stance. Maybe theres a body frame that allows him to make it work. Youth, slender, and athleticism? As he ages and body fills out some more maybe then he takes a more traditional stance?

I will say his swinging was Gomez like in agression. I dont see an approach where he has any intention of using CF/Opposite field. Thats a little worrisome for immediate future. But at same time, if hes swinging this way and gets eaten alive by ML Pitching. Well he gets to work on that in AAA to start next year

 

Wasn't that list of 4 players the list for the PTBNL? I thought that person mentioned Stearns wanted several lower ranked prospects instead of just Brinson but thought he didn't name those prospects.

[LouisEly]

I don't recall that being order of priority, or priority could mean in sequential order but final recommendations not necessarily in that order. You could have different scouts scouting different players, and another scout (or scouts) could have had a different recommendation. I also find it difficult to believe that they weren't scouting Brinson/Ortiz at all as they are not on that list. My understanding is that it was Brinson/Ortiz or several lower level guys with both packages on an equal value field, and they chose the former.

 

Different scouts are going to have different recommendations. Happens all the time, especially in the draft.

[MrTPlush]

Oh just to create a riot, Joey Gallo was sent to the minors upon the trade anouncement. So If the Ptbnl cannot play a Mlb game, well he would qualify as not doing that currently and eligible for ptbnl. Have fun with that tidbit

 

Yah...no.

[FVBrewerFan]

I don't recall that being order of priority, or priority could mean in sequential order but final recommendations not necessarily in that order. You could have different scouts scouting different players, and another scout (or scouts) could have had a different recommendation. I also find it difficult to believe that they weren't scouting Brinson/Ortiz at all as they are not on that list. My understanding is that it was Brinson/Ortiz or several lower level guys with both packages on an equal value field, and they chose the former.

 

Different scouts are going to have different recommendations. Happens all the time, especially in the draft.

 

Yes, the poster (wildcat) had solid source, but it was about some of the players they were scouting, who they liked, etc. Wildcat pretty such said the rest is just conjecture on his part, and the scout's. Really appreciate the behind the scenes stuff he provided, but I see a lot of people reading way too much into it.

[Thundercat32]

Fwiw, Joey Gallo has insanely high K% rates. Never a season below 26%. Most over 33.3%, and a couple over 39%. The guy has a hole(s) in his swing. Brinson instead of Gallo might be the Rangers doing us a tremendous favor.

 

If we had acquired Gallo, who's the hitting instructor in this organization that's going to instruct the young man how to fix this hole(s) in his swing?

[homer]

Fwiw, Joey Gallo has insanely high K% rates. Never a season below 26%. Most over 33.3%, and a couple over 39%. The guy has a hole(s) in his swing. Brinson instead of Gallo might be the Rangers doing us a tremendous favor.

 

If we had acquired Gallo, who's the hitting instructor in this organization that's going to instruct the young man how to fix this hole(s) in his swing?

 

Russell Branyan

[Point Beer Is Best]

Oh just to create a riot, Joey Gallo was sent to the minors upon the trade anouncement. So If the Ptbnl cannot play a Mlb game, well he would qualify as not doing that currently and eligible for ptbnl. Have fun with that tidbit

 

The PTBNL cannot be on the 25 man roster (not the same as "play a MLB game") at the time the trade was agreed upon. That immediately eliminates Gallo from consideration.

[rwa12]

After the first 2 games, I'm not sure we gave up enough for Brinson.

 

I'm not entirely sure if this should be in blue or not...

[QuevedosTongue]

After the first 2 games, I'm not sure we gave up enough for Brinson.

 

I'm not entirely sure if this should be in blue or not...

 

At this point I think it's pretty clear the Brewers won this trade.

[pacopete4]

Lol, come on you guys. While Brinson might become the best player in baseball, he could always amount to nothing. It's way to early to judge this trade.

[I Heart Brewers]

Nah, he's clearly G.O.A.T.

[LouisEly]

Interview with Lucroy - it's a good read. And Lucroy does make a few good points - while Gomes isn't doing well this year, he is younger than Lucroy and under contract until 2020 (Lucroy says getting paid more, but not per year), and Napoli is a free agent after the season. There is a real possibility that Lucroy would be primarily 1B/DH for the Indians next year especially if the Indians can't move Gomes in the offseason. They don't have the payroll flexibility to have Gomes as a backup catcher.

 

http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/17224273/texas-rangers-catcher-jonathan-lucroy-talks-vetoing-cleveland-leaving-milwaukee-getting-traded-winner

[RWeeksFan23]

Wow, definitely a good read. I gained a little respect for Lucroy after reading that. I just don't get why they wouldn't assure Lucroy he'd be the starting catcher next year. He's clearly a better player than Yan Gomes...

[Thundercat32]

Lol, come on you guys. While Brinson might become the best player in baseball, he could always amount to nothing. It's way to early to judge this trade.

 

You can ask a girl out, take her to a nice dinner, and if she doesn't put out, then you can make a decision about whether asking her out or not was a good decision. That's a time when results orientated thinking is okay.

 

When you put money into a stock, it was either a good or bad idea when you made the decision not after the fact. This is an excellent strategy the Brewers are deploying. Whether Brinson lives up to his potential or not is irrelevant. If they stay with this strategy, it won't be long before they do hit on a big-time, franchise-altering player. Trading away pieces of the future for guys like Jonathan Broxton & picking up retreads like Kyle Lohse was never the answer. This much is clear now.