Lucroy and Jeffress to the Rangers for CF Lewis Brinson, RHP Luis Ortiz, PTBNL…(Lucroy comments, post 523; PTBNL is Ryan Cordell, post 581)

[MrTPlush]

PTBNL might be a 2016 draft pick if they won't announce it until after the season.

Not allowed anymore

[jerichoholicninja]

Trade Deadline threads:

 

Bringing out the worst in BF.net since 2001.

 

?

 

Pretty darn good discussion if you ask me.

 

You must have just skipped all the posts calling other posters stupid or saying "you don't understand baseball" and calling Stearns an idiot.

[stoutdude04]

PTBNL might be a 2016 draft pick if they won't announce it until after the season.

 

Pretty sure you can't do that anymore. Could someone refresh my memory?

 

Beat by tplush

[logan82]

PTBNL might be a 2016 draft pick if they won't announce it until after the season.

Bope. Player has to be eligible the day of the trade. Players can't be traded in the season they are drafted.

[Cirilloing]

Here's a conspiracy theory (not at all what i think happened, but...) What if Stearns heard from Texas last minute as they were agreeing to Cleveland deal but liked what Texas was offering more? They then had Lucroy veto the trade, promising a better city and situation. Deal was already in place, but with the agreement to wait it out so as not to make it seem obvious.

[MrTPlush]

All I know is we got three players incredibly likely to make an impact on the MLB squad. Not some lottery ticket guys in low A-ball along with 10 Johnny Hellweg types.

 

Stearns said he wanted to spread the talent and he did that. He has gone after lower minor guys(Diaz/Peralta) and now he picked from the top.

[jerichoholicninja]

Here's a conspiracy theory (not at all what i think happened, but...) What if Stearns heard from Texas last minute as they were agreeing to Cleveland deal but liked what Texas was offering more? They then had Lucroy veto the trade, promising a better city and situation. Deal was already in place, but with the agreement to wait it out so as not to make it seem obvious.

 

If there's any conspiracy theory it's that Cleveland got cold feet after giving up what they did for Miller and then made unreasonable demands of Lucroy to get him to veto.

[LouisEly]

PTBNL might be a 2016 draft pick if they won't announce it until after the season.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/05/all-drafted-players-now-eligible-to-be-traded-after-world-series.html

[fondybrewfan]

If the PTNBL could generally fit into our Top 30 (Not as easy as it used to be) I will be happy; even as is getting two very high upside guys is very encouraging.

 

I just hope Brevard County doesn't kill there hopes and dreams just like it has all of our other prospects.

[MrTPlush]

Here's a conspiracy theory (not at all what i think happened, but...) What if Stearns heard from Texas last minute as they were agreeing to Cleveland deal but liked what Texas was offering more? They then had Lucroy veto the trade, promising a better city and situation. Deal was already in place, but with the agreement to wait it out so as not to make it seem obvious.

 

And 9-11 was carried out by leprechauns right?

[markedman5]

Here's a conspiracy theory (not at all what i think happened, but...) What if Stearns heard from Texas last minute as they were agreeing to Cleveland deal but liked what Texas was offering more? They then had Lucroy veto the trade, promising a better city and situation. Deal was already in place, but with the agreement to wait it out so as not to make it seem obvious.

 

I think the moon landing being faked has a better chance of being true then that scenario.......

[Sixto]

It was actually leprechauns who landed on the moon and aliens for 9-11 --- I thought you guys were smart

[Raw Biz]

PTBNL might be a 2016 draft pick if they won't announce it until after the season.

Bope. Player has to be eligible the day of the trade. Players can't be traded in the season they are drafted.

 

Is that true though? I thought they couldn't be named as the PTBNL until the day after the end of the World Series but you have 6 months from the trade to name the PTBNL.

[LouisEly]

Stearns jsut said the PTBNL will be set after the MiLB season. Not sure the reason.

 

I think this is a good sign that it is a pitcher, as that gives 1) additional time to scout and b) additional time to choose someone else if this pitcher ends up getting hurt, or if the pitcher they want has been hurt and they want to monitor his recovery for a while.

 

Edit: Wondering if they are monitoring Matuella's rehab, with Jurado as a backup plan. I don't think Mendez is out of reach either.

 

Edit 2: Payano is on the 7-day DL too. I'll take some odds that it is one of Matuella, Payano, or Jurado.

[TheCrew07]

[ It's not about 2 highly ranked players vs 1 ranked and 4 lower-level lottery tickets, it's about the fact that X% of ranked prospects don't pan out and that risk needs to be offset by additional quantity.

 

Luc is one of the most valuable players in the game. Two prospects, no matter how highly ranked, isn't going to do it even if it is just for 1.4 years of service time.

 

I understand where you are coming from but I completely disagree, actually it's about a quantity of quality prospects. I've beat on the Overbay trade so many times but I'll use it as an example again. At the time of the trade so many people including myself thought we cleaned up because the Brewers got 2 first round picks and 1 second round pick, but the players were actually nothing special: A back of the rotation pitcher, a never was pitcher, and a 4th outfielder. It was amazing how quickly my opinion of that trade turned completely around as I realized the MLB draft at that time wasn't about talent as much as it was signability. The scouting reports were so underwhelming I was wondering why the Brewers didn't target Marcum or McGowan who were much better prospects, and Marcum was similarly close to MLB as Bush. It was a classic Melvin "mlb piece" trade, and the more I read and learned, the more I despised those quantity deals, and they have become the antitheses of my organization building philosophy.

 

You can have 20 Darren Fords in your organization but none of them will ever be Lorenzo Cain, 4 and 5 tool talents are pretty rare and those players simply are not physically gifted enough to reach those heights.

 

Prospects do absolutely fail, as do many flash in the pan MLB players, so the trick is to mitigate the risk with multiple impact prospects, an organization like Milwaukee can't throw them away buying short term solutions because the Brewers don't possess the financial resources to plug the holes left behind with talented Free Agents. Instead of having 1 or 2 pitchers that could be top of the rotation types we need to have 5 or 6 because surely some fail and/or get injured, and we need to continually develop our own top of the rotation pitching.

 

The problem with the Brewers is that there's only ever been 1 stud pitching prospect at a time so when they get hurt or flame out, there's nothing left. Melvin blamed Rogers and Jones' injuries for the reason the Brewers had a bad rotation, but it was actually the lack of projectable arms which was the issue. The Brewers have never been good enough developing pitching to be able to count on such limited numbers of true prospects. We need 5-6 legitimate top of the rotation starting pitchers scattered through the minors at any given time and we aren't there yet, even after today. If you have 10 Dave Bush type pitchers in your organization you can probably field a full rotation or close to it out of that 10 by the time they reach MLB, but that rotation isn't going to win you a championship nor is that group filthy enough to provide shut down relievers.

 

If Hader and Bickford fail as starters we're almost assured of quality relievers, in relief Bush type pitchers are nothing more than cannon fodder middle relief.

 

The Brewers have a ton of CF depth now which I think is awesome, I would love to have a similarly athletic outfield as the Pirates currently do. I get people want true corner outfields but I've been chasing pitching and more dynamic athletes for a long time and now we have a GM with a similar philosophy. I care less about HRs than I do about run prevention, get on a base and good things will happen.

[FVBrewerFan]

If the PTNBL could generally fit into our Top 30 (Not as easy as it used to be) I will be happy; even as is getting two very high upside guys is very encouraging.

 

I just hope Brevard County doesn't kill there hopes and dreams just like it has all of our other prospects.

 

They won't be in BC next year, so one less fear.

[Sixto]

I wondered if the Brewers farm system is still where pitching prospects go to die.

[Ennder]

I agree that it seems a little light unless the PTBNL is a real prospect. The two trades today combined looks very reasonable though. Overall I feel the organization is in a really good spot for the start of the rebuild.

[Austin Tatious]

Lots of scattered thoughts here in the middle of interruptions from work:

 

1. My personal view, but I preferred Brinson's skill set to Gallo's. I would have been fine with Gallo but I like Brinson's tools.

2. Ortiz's weight is what it is, but he has potential. I see a #2 or #3 in the rotation.

3. I am really glad we got upside here. I feel like we have plenty of quantity, so getting some quality here is good.

4. I think Stearns did whatever he could do.

5. Having said all that, with both Lucroy and Jeffress going, I would have expected a little more. This can be resolved if the third piece is not a scrub but actually a good prospect. Tavares, Guzman, even Jurado, any of those three would make me very happy with this deal. I doubt it's Mendez.

[Jose Cardenal1]

Maybe the PTBNL is currently on the DL. Brewers may want to see that the player comes back fine before accepting that player.

[3and2Fastball]

My sense is that Ortiz may need Tommy John in the next 2-3 years (not exactly shocking as tons of pitchers get Tommy John) but when he comes out the other side of that will be a solid #3 MLB starter

 

More excited about Brinson

[And That]

Per TH, Stearns' quote on the PTBNL is:

 

Stearns on PTBN from Texas: “Will be done in couple of months after the minor league season."

 

A couple of months after the minor league season is after the World Series. Not to parse the wording too much, but that seems overly specific. Betting it's a 2016 draft pick.

[reillymcshane]

If I am correct, a PTBNL must be eligible to be traded when the actual trade takes place. Since 2016 draft picks are ineligible to be traded now, they cannot be the person designated as the PTBNL.

[FVBrewerFan]

Lots of scattered thoughts here in the middle of interruptions from work:

5. Having said all that, with both Lucroy and Jeffress going, I would have expected a little more. This can be resolved if the third piece is not a scrub but actually a good prospect. Tavares, Guzman, even Jurado, any of those three would make me very happy with this deal. I doubt it's Mendez.

 

This is how I feel. PTBNL shouldn't be THAT important, but I'm hung up on that too. Fully admit, probably more than I should be.

[JDBrewCrew]

Give me Speas