Insider Stuff

[brewmann04]

I am 50 and been a brewer fan all my life hopefully I get to see my Brewers back in the playoffs and win the 1st WS

[gregmag]

Fantastic stuff, splitterpfj. Thanks for sharing it. I think your source's impressions, for a lot of us here, aren't surprising but definitely are reassuring. Also, this is the best deadline anxiety brain candy I've seen all week. How the hell is any Brewers fan supposed to be getting any work done now?

 

Also, great back-and-forth on Theo. The points about financial advantages are strong, but money has ruled baseball for a long time, and the Red Sox couldn't win until Theo came along. If he wins with the Cubs, I think he's a no-brainer Hall-of-Famer. Having advantages is one thing; using your advantages to do things no one else could do is something else.

[3and2Fastball]

I am 50 and been a brewer fan all my life....

 

The Brewers weren't a team in 1966. How is that for nit-pickin' on a Monday morning?!

 

I think the biggest chance for Stearns to have sustained success in Milwaukee is to be ahead of the curve on whatever the trend in MLB will be in 2020 and then again in 2025. If he can define the trend before everyone else, and then zig again while everyone else zags, he can do great things with a more limited budget. Easier said than done, but MLB is a copycat world. Be the cat everybody copies, not the trend follower.

[Austin Tatious]

On Jimmy Nelson .... "The Brewers made an attempt to send him to Boston for Anderson Espinoza. They aren't, "shopping him", but they'd do a deal."

 

IMO the Bosox still need another pitcher. I would just go down their list. If they would not take Nelson for Espinoza maybe they'd do Nelson for Kopech. It's good that there is dialogue between the clubs.

 

Kopech is a massive risk but he has good ceiling. Syndergaard was once traded. There could be a parallel track here. The Bosox are obviously in.

[nate82]

Nate, the Brewers asked for Espinoza when they realized he could be had .... Boston chose Pomeranz.

 

That is interesting and I would have went with Nelson over Pomeranz as Nelson has more team control left.

 

I wonder if a Lucroy deal is on the table with the Red Sox and the Brewers are just waiting on the Rangers to find a third team or become serious with their offers. I actually believe the Brewers have given up on trying to get Gallo and the Rangers are just being reluctant on giving up any of their young pitching prospects.

[MadThinker88]

Nate, the Brewers asked for Espinoza when they realized he could be had .... Boston chose Pomeranz.

 

That is interesting and I would have went with Nelson over Pomeranz as Nelson has more team control left.

 

I wonder if a Lucroy deal is on the table with the Red Sox and the Brewers are just waiting on the Rangers to find a third team or become serious with their offers. I actually believe the Brewers have given up on trying to get Gallo and the Rangers are just being reluctant on giving up any of their young pitching prospects.

 

It could mean something else, both potentially bad for the Brewers & it's rebuilding process:

1) the Brewers wanted Espinoza plus for Nelson. A reflection of possibly over estimating the value of their own talent.

 

2) if it was a Boston choice straight up (Nelson or Pomeranz for Espinoza only) and they went with Pomeranz, it could signify that many pieces of Brewer talent is not highly regarded outside of Milwaukee (and its fan base).

[QuevedosTongue]

Nate, the Brewers asked for Espinoza when they realized he could be had .... Boston chose Pomeranz.

 

That is interesting and I would have went with Nelson over Pomeranz as Nelson has more team control left.

 

I wonder if a Lucroy deal is on the table with the Red Sox and the Brewers are just waiting on the Rangers to find a third team or become serious with their offers. I actually believe the Brewers have given up on trying to get Gallo and the Rangers are just being reluctant on giving up any of their young pitching prospects.

 

It could mean something else, both potentially bad for the Brewers & it's rebuilding process:

1) the Brewers wanted Espinoza plus for Nelson. A reflection of possibly over estimating the value of their own talent.

 

2) if it was a Boston choice straight up (Nelson or Pomeranz for Espinoza only) and they went with Pomeranz, it could signify that many pieces of Brewer talent is not highly regarded outside of Milwaukee (and its fan base).

 

Am I wrong thinking that Pomeranz over Nelson is a no-brainer? The Sox made this deal to win this year, the effect of future years on this deal is minimal to non-existent. So, why would they even consider Nelson over Pomeranz, given those parameters? Nelson has been worth 1.0 WAR by Fangraphs, 0.2 WAR by Baseball Prospectus. Pomeranz has been worth 2.3 WAR by Fangraphs, 3.0 WAR by Baseball Prospectus. I guess I just don't understand why Boston would consider Nelson over Pomeranz.

[splitterpfj]

He was pretty spot-on - demand was there to move Lucroy and Smith, and the Brewers were set to deal Jeffress, for a lot, or keep him right here.

 

I'll try to do this again before the Winter Meetings.

[lynchp]

He was pretty spot-on - demand was there to move Lucroy and Smith, and the Brewers were set to deal Jeffress, for a lot, or keep him right here.

 

I'll try to do this again before the Winter Meetings.

 

 

Based on you saying the Brewers wanted a lot for Jeffress or they would keep him, shouldn't he still be in Milwaukee? Don't believe the Brewers received a lot for Jeffress considering the trade was Lucroy, Jeffress for 2 high ranked prospects and a PTBNL (who generally never amounts to anything).

[splitterpfj]

He was pretty spot-on - demand was there to move Lucroy and Smith, and the Brewers were set to deal Jeffress, for a lot, or keep him right here.

 

I'll try to do this again before the Winter Meetings.

 

 

Based on you saying the Brewers wanted a lot for Jeffress or they would keep him, shouldn't he still be in Milwaukee? Don't believe the Brewers received a lot for Jeffress considering the trade was Lucroy, Jeffress for 2 high ranked prospects and a PTBNL (who generally never amounts to anything).

 

Hi lynch, welcome to the site.

 

A couple of things ...

 

On Jeffress - that's why Stearns didn't want to package him with Lucroy - he was shopping for more in separate deals, or he would have kept Jeffress into the winter. When the Cleveland deal couldn't happen, the Brewers were left with the Mets, who didn't come close to what Stearns wanted, and Texas.

 

Knowing this, TX pushed for Lucroy, but demanded a package deal that included Jeffress - they got that - in return, the Brewers moved the conversation a bit up the ladder, getting the numbers 2 and 3 prospects in the Rangers' farm system, and at the end, getting the PTBNL. That wasn't how Stearns wanted to do it, but it was making the best of the situation, which I would say was a fair exchange.

 

As to PTBNL's not amounting to anything - Michael Brantley was the PTBNL from Milwaukee to Cleveland, and Brantley became the only player who panned out for the Indians from that deal. My point is simply - don't assume - they're all just prospects right now.

[Boomer5]

It appears in this case the PTBNL is significant and only classified as such because they demanded JJ and we ran out of time. I expect the prospect to be a big deal though not Gallo obviously.

[brewmann04]

yes going have to wait till DS makes that final addition

[splitterpfj]

On Ryan Braun ... "Not right now, it's just too much to sort out. He's worth it, and teams know it, but they don't want to pay the price. Ask again in the winter."

 

This seems to be exactly how it played out with Braun - teams tried to get him as a salary dump for Milwaukee, sending, "guys" to the Brewers, but Milwaukee waited that out, insisting that they wouldn't be doing that.

 

Braun proved his worth, after the back surgery, so teams moved into the, "go get him" stage, and here we are.

[monty57]

On Ryan Braun ... "Not right now, it's just too much to sort out. He's worth it, and teams know it, but they don't want to pay the price. Ask again in the winter."

 

This seems to be exactly how it played out with Braun - teams tried to get him as a salary dump for Milwaukee, sending, "guys" to the Brewers, but Milwaukee waited that out, insisting that they wouldn't be doing that.

 

Braun proved his worth, after the back surgery, so teams moved into the, "go get him" stage, and here we are.

 

It would be sad to see Braun traded. As long as he's in the lineup, the Brewer offense is relevant, but the writing seems to be on the wall that he will be traded. As you said, he's proven himself after his injuries, and during the offseason teams will likely have more payroll room to fit him in.

 

It is nice to see that they're demanding a good return and not just salary relief. I'd expect a lot in terms of prospects if the Brewers pay a big chunk of his salary.

[brewmann04]

I don't like it but if DS can get two stud Pitchers this team will contend sooner than later with the other talent he has acquired.

[Boomer5]

I can see Braun traded but not with Puig being a centerpiece. We have plenty of young OFers here and in the minors, and honestly I'm not so sure Villar shouldn't be our LF at some point.

[Invader3K]

I can see Braun traded but not with Puig being a centerpiece. We have plenty of young OFers here and in the minors, and honestly I'm not so sure Villar shouldn't be our LF at some point.

 

That's how I feel, but that's probably why the deal didn't get done on August 31st. The Brewers will take Puig, but not as the center piece. They want high upside prospects...and for Braun, that is what they should be looking for.

 

It will be tough for me when Braun leaves. He has been my favorite baseball player since his debut as a third baseman rookie. Yet, I think it's probably best for him and for the franchise if he moves on.

[brewmann04]

I agree I can see the Brewers in turn moving Puig but the brewers need to focus on some of those Dodgers Arms to help the rebuild.

[monty57]

I think Puig was the "Aaron Hill piece" in that potential trade. The Dodgers would insist we take him in order to get him off the roster and clear salary, and in return we'd get better prospects. If this ends up being the route we take, I hope (A) the prospects we'd get back would be mind blowing, and (B) Puig can revive his career like Hill did, so we'd be able to trade him away for more prospects, and © Puig stops the Prima Donna routine and just plays baseball.

 

If Puig really is the clubhouse cancer he's portrayed as, I don't really want him anywhere near our rebuilding team. When you have that attitude around a bunch of high-priced vets, you're a nuisance. When you have that attitude around a young roster, you could cause a lot of harm.

[rwa12]

I agree on the clubhouse issue, Monty, especially as many of our younger players are Latin. Bad influence.

 

I think the Dodgers see him as a talent, in the proposed deal, McCarthy was the Hill piece. I want nothing to do with Puig, and think the headache of trying to turn him is essentially trading a dollar (Braun) for three quarters (Puig), and then trading those quarter for a handful of dimes and nickels.