2016-05-25 Brewers (Guerra) at Braves (Foltynewicz), 6:10 PM CDT [Brewers win, 3-2; 13 innings]

[adambr2]

Ugh. I think he missed it. I get not reversing it, but I don't know how you reverse the play at 1st last inning then.

[1992casey]

Nice 10-pitch save for Torres!

[adambr2]

Counsell managed extras brilliantly tonight. It's refreshing to see a manager not save his closer on the road for the lead only to lose it first and blankly ask reporters after the game, 'Well who was I supposed to have close the game if I didn't have my closer? '

[trwi7]

Am I the only one not enjoying this season at all? We get old scrubs like Hill, Niewenhuis and Presley being favored over guys like Perez, Flores and Broxton.

 

We have a good bullpen when it would be fine to have an awful bullpen to knock us into the top 3 range for a pick.

 

Don't get me wrong, we could have an enjoyable team but Counsell favors gritty veterans because that's the type of player he was. If I was Stearns I would be telling Counsell that Broxton, Flores and Perez are starting at minimum 3 out of every 4 days regardless of their results. The older guys can be thhe rah-rah guys on the bench, pinch hit and get the occasional start.

[1992casey]

Yikes. The attendance tonight was 12,869.

[AKCheesehead]

BA had a crackup quote tonight, "Brewers as a team thrown out for the cycle."

[pacopete4]

Am I the only one not enjoying this season at all? We get old scrubs like Hill, Niewenhuis and Presley being favored over guys like Perez, Flores and Broxton.

 

We have a good bullpen when it would be fine to have an awful bullpen to knock us into the top 3 range for a pick.

 

Don't get me wrong, we could have an enjoyable team but Counsell favors gritty veterans because that's the type of player he was. If I was Stearns I would be telling Counsell that Broxton, Flores and Perez are starting at minimum 3 out of every 4 days regardless of their results. The older guys can be thhe rah-rah guys on the bench, pinch hit and get the occasional start.

 

Most ridiculous post I've seen in awhile. A fan upset at their team for playing their best 25 guys. Not only that but a guy like Nieuwenhuis, Hill, etc.. Can actually bring pieces back if they continue to do well. On top of that, if this team didn't start off pitching so bad we would be even closer to the Wild Card. This team is starting to play some good baseball and that's without Garza, Knebel, and Smith. How you can't enjoy what this team is doing is really beyond me.

[trwi7]

Am I the only one not enjoying this season at all? We get old scrubs like Hill, Niewenhuis and Presley being favored over guys like Perez, Flores and Broxton.

 

We have a good bullpen when it would be fine to have an awful bullpen to knock us into the top 3 range for a pick.

 

Don't get me wrong, we could have an enjoyable team but Counsell favors gritty veterans because that's the type of player he was. If I was Stearns I would be telling Counsell that Broxton, Flores and Perez are starting at minimum 3 out of every 4 days regardless of their results. The older guys can be thhe rah-rah guys on the bench, pinch hit and get the occasional start.

 

Most ridiculous post I've seen in awhile. A fan upset at their team for playing their best 25 guys. Not only that but a guy like Nieuwenhuis, Hill, etc.. Can actually bring pieces back if they continue to do well. On top of that, if this team didn't start off pitching so bad we would be even closer to the Wild Card. This team is starting to play some good baseball and that's without Garza, Knebel, and Smith. How you can't enjoy what this team is doing is really beyond me.

 

Bite me with your first sentence. It's an opinion I was wondering if anyone else shared.

 

And I'm not convinced we're playing our best guys anyways. We should be playing guys that could possibly have a future with the team anyways. And what exactly are Nieuwenhuis and Hill going to get us? Maybe a bullpen prospect for Nieuwenhuis? Maybe the same for Hill if we kick in some money? That's not valuable enough to be starting them everyday.

[adambr2]

I've actually enjoyed the season more than I thought I would.

 

Unless you're just totally tanking, which we're not yet, there still should be some balance between trying to play young guys and trying to field your best team.

 

Yeah, Hill plays too much, but Walsh is not a real prospect. He's a total utility lottery ticket.

 

Broxton should probably play more and probably will, but again, these guys like Broxton and Flores are just filler. We're not talking real prospects. Santana is, and Counsell has been good about playing him every single day when healthy. I guarantee if Phillips comes up, or Arcia comes up, it won't be to ride the bench.

 

Niewenhuis didn't really start getting this much time until Broxton went down, so we'll see what happens now. Plus I'm sure the thinking is that if him or Hill have any value at the deadline they won't hesitate to deal them and get even younger.

[rickh150]

Am I the only one not enjoying this season at all? We get old scrubs like Hill, Niewenhuis and Presley being favored over guys like Perez, Flores and Broxton.

 

We have a good bullpen when it would be fine to have an awful bullpen to knock us into the top 3 range for a pick.

 

Don't get me wrong, we could have an enjoyable team but Counsell favors gritty veterans because that's the type of player he was. If I was Stearns I would be telling Counsell that Broxton, Flores and Perez are starting at minimum 3 out of every 4 days regardless of their results. The older guys can be thhe rah-rah guys on the bench, pinch hit and get the occasional start.

 

Most ridiculous post I've seen in awhile. A fan upset at their team for playing their best 25 guys. Not only that but a guy like Nieuwenhuis, Hill, etc.. Can actually bring pieces back if they continue to do well. On top of that, if this team didn't start off pitching so bad we would be even closer to the Wild Card. This team is starting to play some good baseball and that's without Garza, Knebel, and Smith. How you can't enjoy what this team is doing is really beyond me.

 

 

 

Agree.... I am never ok with rooting AGAINST the home team for whatever reason.

[1992casey]

Calling a post ridiculous is unnecessary condescension, especially when it's used as the topic sentence. Obviously, responding with "bite me" isn't any better.

 

At any rate, getting back to trwi7's point, I think you have a mess if the pitching is too ineffective. You're going to have a bunch of tired out pitchers, and you're going to be making way too many roster moves to deal with the situation. While I don't think a guy like Nieuwenhuis is likely to get much in a trade, it's possible that a bullpen pitcher might bring back something worthwhile.

[dlk9s]

Yikes. The attendance tonight was 12,869.

 

I'm going on Thursday. I didn't pay pennies for tickets because I wanted good seats, but still got very nice seats for a reasonable price. Odds are, I'll be able to grab every foul ball on the right side without battling anybody.

[trwi7]

[dt][/dt]

Calling a post ridiculous is unnecessary condescension, especially when it's used as the topic sentence. Obviously, responding with "bite me" isn't any better.

 

At any rate, getting back to trwi7's point, I think you have a mess if the pitching is too ineffective. You're going to have a bunch of tired out pitchers, and you're going to be making way too many roster moves to deal with the situation. While I don't think a guy like Nieuwenhuis is likely to get much in a trade, it's possible that a bullpen pitcher might bring back something worthwhile.

 

I absolutely agree you don't want pitchers out there giving up runs every inning. To me it's just frustrating that we finally have a solid bullpen (for the most part, I don't think much of Cappy and especially Boyer) of younger, hard throwing relievers in a rebuild when we could've used arms like them in 2008 and 2011 when it actually mattered instead of like the two or maybe three reliable arms we had.

 

And we absolutely could get something good for some of our bullpen arms. Jeffress especially and Smith if he pitches well when he comes back, either alone or as part of a package involving Lucroy or Braun to sweeten it.

[adambr2]

[dt][/dt]

Calling a post ridiculous is unnecessary condescension, especially when it's used as the topic sentence. Obviously, responding with "bite me" isn't any better.

 

At any rate, getting back to trwi7's point, I think you have a mess if the pitching is too ineffective. You're going to have a bunch of tired out pitchers, and you're going to be making way too many roster moves to deal with the situation. While I don't think a guy like Nieuwenhuis is likely to get much in a trade, it's possible that a bullpen pitcher might bring back something worthwhile.

 

I absolutely agree you don't want pitchers out there giving up runs every inning. To me it's just frustrating that we finally have a solid bullpen (for the most part, I don't think much of Cappy and especially Boyer) of younger, hard throwing relievers in a rebuild when we could've used arms like them in 2008 and 2011 when it actually mattered instead of like the two or maybe three reliable arms we had.

 

I have to nitpick this point because we had a very solid bullpen in 2011. 2008 was pretty good, too.

 

There were some older veteran arms in both cases but the overall results were there.

[trwi7]

I have to nitpick this point because we had a very solid bullpen in 2011. 2008 was pretty good, too.

 

There were some older veteran arms in both cases but the overall results were there.

 

In 2008 it was really just Torres, Villanueva and Shouse and you really only wanted Shouse facing lefties, unless you were Ned and had him intentionally walk Ryan Howard to face Pat Burrell.

 

The 2011 bullpen was better than I remember and got better after trading for K-Rod.

[pacopete4]

It would be one thing is Arcia and Phillips were stuck on the bench behind Nieuwenhuis and Hill but we are not talking about those types of prospects. We are talking about second chance-r guys who we picked basically off the heap to see if any of them could be salvaged on this team. I think Counsell is doing a great job of playing guys here and there. We are a strong week away from making some noise in the National League. And this very well could happen finishing off the Braves and then heading home to play Cincy.

[SoCalBrewfan]

It would be one thing is Arcia and Phillips were stuck on the bench behind Nieuwenhuis and Hill but we are not talking about those types of prospects. We are talking about second chance-r guys who we picked basically off the heap to see if any of them could be salvaged on this team.

 

Yeah, but one of the advantages of not being expected to compete is that you can invest some playing time into a youngish guy like Hernan Perez or Ramon Flores and potentially make straw into gold. A start or two a week plus a couple of pinch hits doesn't really give those guys the chance to get into a consistent rhythm, and then some players will press to show they deserve more playing time. That said, I think they've actually done a decent job of putting some of the younger guys into situations where they can succeed. In particular it seems like both Perez and Flores are getting healthy and regular doses of playing time this month, and both have responded well. (Flores' numbers still look bad due to his terrible start but his May has been really solid.) I'd rather see Cecchini over Hill, for example, but I guess they're investing some PAs hoping that Hill will have some trade value.

[jerichoholicninja]

What exactly have Broxton or Flores done when they've gotten playing time? Been flat out horrible is about it. And it's not like Kirk is old either, at 28 he's in his prime. I can't imagine Counsell going to Kirk and saying "Sorry, we're benching you for a guy who's OPS'ing almost 200 points lower than you or another guy who's OPS isn't even above the Mendoza line." Ya, play the young guys but don't play the worse player just because he's younger.

[pacopete4]

What exactly have Broxton or Flores done when they've gotten playing time? Been flat out horrible is about it. And it's not like Kirk is old either, at 28 he's in his prime. I can't imagine Counsell going to Kirk and saying "Sorry, we're benching you for a guy who's OPS'ing almost 200 points lower than you or another guy who's OPS isn't even above the Mendoza line." Ya, play the young guys but don't play the worse player just because he's younger.

 

 

Exactly. Other than Hill (who we all know is here to build trade value), there isn't an older player blocking a younger one from playing. Kirk, Carter, etc... are still well within the age bracket of their primes and can be very valuable to this team moving forward this season and beyond.

[TURBO]

flip Hill, trade Hill...

 

Man, it's like a broken record around here when talking about this guy.

 

I hate to tell you guys, but I highly doubt anyone is going to want Hill in a trade. We only have him as a salary dump, and the only way we are going to unload him is for the same reason. I doubt anyone is going to come calling for Aaron Hill.

 

flip him, trade him, it's all a pipe dream...

[adambr2]

flip Hill, trade Hill...

 

Man, it's like a broken record around here when talking about this guy.

 

I hate to tell you guys, but I highly doubt anyone is going to want Hill in a trade. We only have him as a salary dump, and the only way we are going to unload him is for the same reason. I doubt anyone is going to come calling for Aaron Hill.

 

flip him, trade him, it's all a pipe dream...

 

Eh, he's not going to bring back anything of value, but if you can get a million in a salary dump and add a low level arm for organizational depth, sure, why not.