Formula 1

[BillScottCanRake]

Are there any fans of F1 here?

 

I'd never really been much into racing, but I started watching at the end of the 2013 season thanks to Top Gear (UK) and have been been either watching or recording each race since the beginning of 2014. My wife likes Lewis Hamilton and follows him on social media, but she's a very casual racing fan and only watches with me if she doesn't have anything better to do (which isn't too often). So my fandom has been pretty lonely.

[TheEndless7]

I've preferred Indycar to Formula 1 of late, but watch pretty much all forms of Motorsport. Never been a big Hamilton fan, think he has a tendency to play bumper cars and isn't the same caliber of the likes of Alonso or Vettel; but he is certainly on more social media and around more than any other F1 driver. Kinda hoping Rosberg pulls it out this year.

 

A week from Sunday is always a good day for racing, as it's both the Monaco Grand Prix and the Indy 500. The racing in Indycar the last few years, especially on the road courses, has been phenomenal, well, excluding Simon Paganaud running away with the last three; but that was still super impressive even if it didn't make for the best TV.

[BillScottCanRake]

The first driver that I really liked in F1 was Jules Bianchi - what he did with Marussia in 2014 at Monaco was pretty remarkable. Since his crash at Suzuka, I haven't had a rooting interest until Haas this year.

 

I have started watching more Indycar races this year since the guys on NBCSN have been talking it up and it has been enjoyable. I'll definitely watch the Indy 500 after Monaco this Sunday. I have thought about going to Road America to catch the Indycar race there since it's going to be easier for me to go to that than Austin, Montreal or Mexico City to watch F1.

[TheEndless7]

I'm looking forward to the return to Road America myself. I lost my rooting interest in racing when Dan Wheldon died a few years back. Since then; I haven't really picked a team or driver to follow and just enjoy the racing. Although I was pulling for Hinch to put it on the pole at Indy.

 

One thing to note is how bad the ABC Broadcast team is compared to the NBC/NBCSN team. It's literally like they're not paying any attention at times. Often large shakeups will happen on track at Indycar events on ABC that they won't even mention. And even after years of the same crew, they still pronounce driver names incorrectly. And not even hard ones, ones like Rahal.

 

I had to laugh during Q's yesterday when each of Hinch's first three qualifying laps were faster than the average time he needed for pole, and Cheever insists he needs to go even faster to get on pole. Simple math is hard I guess!

 

But long-story short, don't judge Indycar on the ABC broadcast, it's honestly like they have no idea how to present a race. Often there's all sorts of passing, intrigue, strategy and what not that they just don't bother showing or talking about that one then has to read about the next day.

[TheEndless7]

On a side note, Formula 1 has actually had a string of interesting movies come out lately too.

 

"Rush" is a look into the 1976 title fight between Niki Lauda and James Hunt, staring Daniel Bruhl and Chris Hemsworth as Lauda and Hunt, and, while dramatized at points (although not the ones involving Lauda's wreck in Germany) is really a well made movie.

 

"1" is a documentary narrated by Michael Fassbender about the history and development of Safety features in Formula 1. It features a good amount of time with Mario Andretti and really chronicles the history of the sport with a focus on when it no longer became okay for driver to die in a racecar. A lot of modern race fans forget how deadly the sport was for a very long time.

 

and "Senna" is a biopic about Ayrton Senna, his rise, and his rivarly with Alain Prost. It's perhaps too critical of Prost at points, but also a great look into the sport.

[BillScottCanRake]

Thanks for the suggested viewing. I've been tempted to watch "Rush" but haven't done so yet, and I hadn't heard of "Senna" (the documentary, I've heard of the man). I have seen "1" right around the time of Bianci's crash in Japan, so it was very timely when I saw it.

 

I recently watched "Weekend of a Champion" on Netflix about Jackie Stewart's week at Monaco in 1971. It was well worth watching, I thought.

 

Thanks for the movie suggestions!

[BillScottCanRake]

That was an interesting weekend in open wheeled racing.

 

Monaco was highly entertaining. The mixed weather brought out a number of different strategies and a few on track incidents (Sauber? Really?). And a botched pit stop probably costing Ricciardo a win (Red Bull gives you wings, but not tires). I loved seeing Perez get a podium for Force India. Not a lot of overtaking, but it sounds like there never really is at Monaco. Still, I enjoyed it thoroughly.

 

The Indy 500 had a great finish and result, but didn't hold my interest quite as much. In Formula 1 I didn't have a rooting interest, but I was definitely pulling for Rossi at Indy, which made the last 10 laps or so really exciting. I found it interesting that Rossi was 33rd at one point and still won, which is something that I'd never expected would be possible, but it sounds like that isn't necessarily unusual. The back-and-forth, trading positions between the first and second place drivers was odd to me. I understand the why of it from watching the race, but there was something about it that just doesn't seem right. I am excited to see IndyCar return to non-oval circuts in Detroit and Road America in the near future, because they make more sense to me than oval track racing.

[Samurai Bucky]

Since I'm not as well informed...

 

Does F1 have oval tracks, or is there always some type of road racing component to those races?

[TheEndless7]

To Samurai Bucky:

 

Formula 1 does not race on any oval track. For a long time the F1 Championship INCLUDED the Indy 500, but that phased out during the 1960s. They only race on natural terrain road courses or temperary street circuits. Last weekends Monaco GP is their superbowl, taking place on the streets of Monaco. Other notable events include the Belgian Grand Prix at Spa, widely considered one of the best road courses in the world, the Italian Grand Prix at Monza, the Canadian Grand Prix at Circuit Gilles Villeneuve in Montreal, The Japanese Grand Prix at Suzuka, and the US GP in Austin.

 

F1 is a more 'World Sport' as they race all over the world, taking 2-3 weeks often between races, hitting a variety of countries, but always on a 'road' course. One of my personal favorite events (and I'm in the minority) is the Singapore Grand Prix in Marina Bay, where they race on a temporary street circuit at night. Open Wheel cars do not have headlights, so they bring in hundreds of bulbs to light the track to the point that it's clear as day to planes and what not overhead. It's a unique event on a challenging track.

 

At BillScott:

 

Monaco is often the most boring race on the F1 Calendar. The cars have evolved past the track limits, and they're left with not beign able to do much other than follow the leader. It's too narrow for them to effectively really race. This years was one of the most entertaining Monaco's in recent years. I thought Hamilton should have been forced to cede the position to Riccardio after he went off, and then cut back onto the racing line. The rule is pretty clear that when you're 'off' you do not get the racing line. He had the faster car though, which became clear after VSC's, and probably would have gotten him out of the tunnel one one of the laps. Heck, had he just drag-raced him to the next corner he'd have probably passed him back then. But I found that to be a horrible non call.

 

If the situation were reversed Hamilton would have driven straight into Riccardo and whined afterwords about how the guy going off has to give up the right away. Hamilton does stuff like that constantly, and it's infuriating. People tend to forget how dangerous racing is (Both series had driver deaths last year, Indycar on track, F1 as a result of an accident a year earlier) and the rules exist for a reason. Doing something where the outcome is 'guy who has the line either has to hit me, or stop' is not good racing. It's dirty. Riccardio wasn't furious at his teams botched stop (which was hilarious) or the fact that Lewis jumped A VSC that no one seemed to notice (gained a 3 second gap under the last safety car), but the fact that nothing happened to Lewis, after he LOST the lead, for giving him the option so 'wreck or cede'. That's a NASCAR mentality that will ruin the sport. There was a report a few months back that indicated only Mercedes and Ferrari turned a profit as F1 teams. They can't afford reckless actions destroying 4.5 million dollar machines.

 

As for the indy 500, I'm also in the minority that I hate the current package. They can't actually race, it just becomes a back and forth from the tow between 1-2 and the rest of the field stacks up behind. It's a NASCAR esque pack racing, which tends to be rather dangerous in open wheel racing as it leads to wheel on wheel contact, which leads to cars going airborne, which leads to cars in catch fencing, which leads to Dan Wheldon. Their current package provides much better road course racing than it does oval racing. Although Iowa, being so short, tends to be interesting.

 

But it certainly doesn't feel like 'real' racing. When they're just trading spots every few laps based on how well the draft worked and they have no real way to defend. They hype 'SIXTY LEAD CHANGES!' but they're all just the guy getting out of hte way, knowing that he'll pass back in a lap. It becomes anti-climatic.

 

Nitpikcy, Rossi was never 33rd, no matter what he'd like you to think. He was never, at any point, behind Buddy Lazier, who was four laps down before he even took to the track. But this hasn't been uncommon lately purely because the package forces them together. There's so little difference between the cars that unless there's a problem, lapping becomes rare.

 

Detroit has had some good racing the past few years. And you get double the fix as they run a full race on Saturday and another full race on Sunday as their last 'double header' it's usually a good weekend.

 

I can't wait to see them at Road America.

[BillScottCanRake]

I thought Hamilton should have been forced to cede the position to Riccardio after he went off, and then cut back onto the racing line. The rule is pretty clear that when you're 'off' you do not get the racing line. He had the faster car though, which became clear after VSC's, and probably would have gotten him out of the tunnel one one of the laps. Heck, had he just drag-raced him to the next corner he'd have probably passed him back then. But I found that to be a horrible non call.

 

One of the things that sort of bugs me is the inconsistent application of the rules from race to race. I am with you that Hamilton should have had to cede his position to Ricciardo when he cut the chicane, but I wasn't totally surprised that he wasn't penalized because that sort of thing really seems to be hit-and-miss in F1. What is a "racing incident" at one race is penalize for causing a collision at another. Sometimes exceeding track limits is a big deal and sometimes it's ignore. That lack of consistency drives me batty sometimes, especially as someone who is still trying to learn the sport. Does the FIA have professional stewards that go from race-to-race or do they hire different ones for each race?

 

They can't afford reckless actions destroying 4.5 million dollar machines.

 

Sauber. It would have almost been funny if they weren't in such dire straits financially. I don't want Sauber to be the next Caterham.

 

But it certainly doesn't feel like 'real' racing. When they're just trading spots every few laps based on how well the draft worked and they have no real way to defend. They hype 'SIXTY LEAD CHANGES!' but they're all just the guy getting out of hte way, knowing that he'll pass back in a lap. It becomes anti-climatic.

 

That's what I was trying to articulate. I enjoyed the race and Rossi winning, but it didn't make me want to take a vacation to Indy next year.

 

One thing that I was really surprised to see was drivers still racing that were down 20, 30, 40 laps. Was that an ABC snaffu or do drivers not retire like they do in F1 and drive to the bitter end?

[nate82]

 

One thing that I was really surprised to see was drivers still racing that were down 20, 30, 40 laps. Was that an ABC snaffu or do drivers not retire like they do in F1 and drive to the bitter end?

 

The drivers basically have to stay on the track if they can still drive due to contractual stipulations with the sponsors of the race car.

[TheEndless7]

 

One thing that I was really surprised to see was drivers still racing that were down 20, 30, 40 laps. Was that an ABC snaffu or do drivers not retire like they do in F1 and drive to the bitter end?

 

The drivers basically have to stay on the track if they can still drive due to contractual stipulations with the sponsors of the race car.

 

That's mostly more a NASCAR thing of late. In most cases in Indy the car will retire, unless it's in a points battle and can gain something from putting in a few more laps. ((IE a few years ago Power crashed at I think Fontana, they repaired the car, and he did like 12 laps, because that put him at more laps than another retired car, adn gave him 2 more points in the championship, it's the difference between all positions scoring poitns and just the top ten like F1)) But the 500 is special, and with how the purse is split like a NASCAR one, Lazier staying on the track putting in laps put him ahead of cars that crashed much later, and ended up in a bigger pay day for Lazier. I do think he retired after it became clear that he couldn't gain any more positions, but I could be wrong.

 

In Indycar they have a 'Leaders Circle' thing at the end of the year where purse money is distributed to the top 20ish in the points, I forget the exact number, so if you're in a position where running a few more laps with a less than stellar car can get you a bigger payday at the end of the year, they try to put in the laps.