Shouldn't Villar be moved permanently to 3B?

[MrTPlush]

Additionally, your choice of words is weird. "competent?" Sorry, there are lots of competent catchers in AAA. a 33 year old Lucroy should be average to above average...that's far better than "competent"

 

Competent=Average

 

Signing a catcher over the age of 30 is something we would regret before the ink even dries. Why would we sign any player over the age of 30 to a contract? That just isn't a good idea. Maybe if we were ready to compete next year this could be a worthwhile risk, but we would be extending him years before we would be competing. So for the next 3 years we would be praying nothing happens to Lucroy or we will have a replacement level first baseman getting paid $15mil+(Joe Mauer type situation).

 

I think the fact the Brewers flat out told Lucroy no on extension talks is pretty telling where their relationship is going.

[DHonks]

I've never thought of competent as average. I think of competent as barely acceptable. A D-student shows some competency. They are FAR below average.

[MrTPlush]

I've never thought of competent as average. I think of competent as barely acceptable. A D-student shows some competency. They are FAR below average.

 

-"having the necessary ability, knowledge, or skill to do something successfully."

-"(of a person) efficient and capable."

-"acceptable and satisfactory, though not outstanding."

 

Though I see where you would think is lesser than average because it is usually used in a very negative way and usually with the word "not" in front of it.

[1992casey]

In baseball, average is better than the median, which means that there are more below average players than above. That makes average a pretty good thing.

[MrTPlush]

In baseball, average is better than the median, which means that there are more below average players than above. That makes average a pretty good thing.

 

You are right in the fact average is slightly above average in general and depending on the position above average. Like a 90 OPS+ is below average in general terms, but for a catcher that would likely be about average. Which is what I would expect from Lucroy in 3+years making him average...but as you said that might put him an inch above average due to so many below average.

 

I think you just made the situation more complicated than it needed to be...you are still right in what you said though. No matter how you want to slice that apple Jonathan Lucroy wouldn't be worth $15mil+ either way and that is the point. If we really want to complicate things we can start a conversation on the inflation in baseball and if it will continue at record pace. Because then maybe an average catcher is worth $15mil+ and it would not be a total overpay. Then again the concern for injury and the risk of a great decline would still make it too risky for us and probably not a good idea.

[Crash2303]

fwiw Aaron Hill has been on fire lately. Obviously his 3HR performance boosted his numbers, but he's on a nine game hitting streak and since April 20 he's hit .299 with an OPS of .841.

[FVBrewerFan]

Back to Villar. I don't see any reason to move him to 3B right now. He had a good month, but way too early to say he's any kind of long term solution at 3B. We don't even know if he's the best long term solution for UT. He is holding down the fort at SS this season, after that he could be traded, moved to platoon at 2B, moved the 3B, or UT. Or, he could still fall flat and turn into yet another AAAA guy.

[1992casey]

The thing I always fear is that if a player is moved from shortstop, the powers that be frequently seem to decide that he should never play there again.

 

Aside from that, when I look at Jonathan's major and minor league offensive stats, I see a SLG percentage that's weak for third base. His OBP and OPS stack up well for a starting second baseman or shortstop. And his numbers would be excellent for a utility player.

 

In other words, I see a Craig Counsell type. That's a guy who can play 2B and SS regularly but should only be playing 3B regularly when a team lacks a better option.

[jerichoholicninja]

Why does he have to play only one position? The 3B and 2B in the system are still a ways off. Arcia should be the SS of the future but that is far from a guarantee. Villar is not a good enough hitter to be the owner a position on a competing team. His value is going to be that he will start almost every day and can play any infield position so you can platoon him with Scooter/Rivera/Arcia/Gatewood/Lara/Neuhaus or whatever others infielders they have.

[rickh150]

Why can't he play some 3B this year??? Slide him to 3B; put Rivera there for a few games at the least. They move other infielders around. Bewildering.

If he is going to be at 3B next year OR if he is a utility man, he should get some game practice there this season... Perfect opportunity to learn, adapt, get used to a different position when games matter. For those of you who play or played either position, you know the changes in angles of throws, responsibilities on cut offs, playing the bunt, etc.

There is no need to play him every cotton picken day at SS this year when he will be moving next year. Overall, I know this is a minor or very minor issue. Yet, each game I see the lineup, I think of it again and wonder why.

[MrTPlush]

Why can't he play some 3B this year???

 

Who said he couldn't occassionally? Your question was to permanently move him.

[FVBrewerFan]

Right, plus they already have 3 other guys getting time at 3b. And there's five more months of baseball, so there's that.

[clancyphile]

Add in Phillips to CF and our middle of the field looks good. Position of catcher is a crap shoot though.

 

Not if Lucroy is extended...

[umphrey]

Move him for who? Rivera needs playing time and Aaron Hill needs to be benched? I do hope Aaron Hill isn't starting for us in July but I'm not THAT eager to bench him.

[brewcrewdue80]

Well, we can address the idea come mid-July. What if the Rangers traded us Gallo for Lucroy? There's Hill+Walsh+Perez kinda taking up the 3b position for now.

 

In my perfect world, Hill and Gennett are traded before the deadline. Arcia is called up post Super 2 chance. Villar is pushed to 2b/3b mix along with Rivera/Perez rotation among the 3. I like the fact Villar is bringing some OB+SBs to the top of the order. Fun mix in a couple months Villar, Arcia, and Braun top 3 in order. You still have Cecchini as a 3b to call up.

I just think under the current roster makeup, it's more of why would you move Villar to 3b now vs him at SS currently? Who you got playing SS everyday?

[brewmann04]

from talking to some of the writers Believe Villar will shift to 3rd when Arcia comes up.

[MrTPlush]

from talking to some of the writers Believe Villar will shift to 3rd when Arcia comes up.

 

Yes he is going to 3B baring an unlikely Scooter Gennett trade.

[SoCalBrewfan]

In my opinion, the Brewers need to give some additional thought to team defense. It's terrible right now, and while we certainly didn't expect to win this year, it's not a good developmental situation for the younger pitchers on the roster. Villar, for all that's he's been solid with the bat, seems to be part of the problem, as he's consistently rated as below average defensively at short. (You may not trust individual fielding metrics, but they're across the board negative for him.) It remains to be seen whether he'd be an above average fielder at third, but I'd rather get some insight on that, and whether he might be a medium-term solution at 2b or 3b, given that it's already a lost season.

[pacopete4]

They should hope Scooter gets hot after his return and trade him before July 31st. Scooter is a liability at 2b. Other than hitting RHP at a solid clip, he doesn't really add much to this team. Put Villar at 2B where he belongs. Let Perez/Walsh/Rivera, whoever finish the season at 3B and see if any of them stick. If not, we know the hole that needs to be filled via FA possibly.

[1992casey]

I just think under the current roster makeup, it's more of why would you move Villar to 3b now vs him at SS currently? Who you got playing SS everyday?

 

That's the whole thing. You have Rivera and probably Pérez. Villar is far and away the best current option at short.

 

Hernán hasn't played a lot of shortstop in the majors, although he played there a lot as a minor leaguer. I don't know if there's a deficiency at that position or if things have just worked out that way. With the absence of any definitive information, I'll assume that things have simply worked out that his teams have needed him more at second and third.

 

There's no rush to bring up Arcia. He's been playing well, but he isn't playing so well that he's forcing a callup. That'll happen eventually. At that point, Villar becomes the second best option at short; it makes sense that he continues to play there for now.

[jerichoholicninja]

I just think under the current roster makeup, it's more of why would you move Villar to 3b now vs him at SS currently? Who you got playing SS everyday?

 

That's the whole thing. You have Rivera and probably Pérez. Villar is far and away the best current option at short.

 

Hernán hasn't played a lot of shortstop in the majors, although he played there a lot as a minor leaguer. I don't know if there's a deficiency at that position or if things have just worked out that way. With the absence of any definitive information, I'll assume that things have simply worked out that his teams have needed him more at second and third.

 

There's no rush to bring up Arcia. He's been playing well, but he isn't playing so well that he's forcing a callup. That'll happen eventually. At that point, Villar becomes the second best option at short; it makes sense that he continues to play there for now.

 

People talk about Perez as a short stop but he's hardly even played there. Some of it might be because there have always been better options but he just doesn't look like a short stop to me. Too tall and not athletic enough.

[MrTPlush]

Well at this point Villar isn't going to be moved to 3B because Aaron Hill is hitting pretty well. He is a solid veteran player and should be easy to flip at the deadline for a prospect or to save money.

[FVBrewerFan]

Hill and Perez will be playing 3B this year, maybe even Cecchini at some point. Villar can play SS all year. Then when Arcia comes up next year, we'll see. So many factors come into play, a lot can happen in a year. Villar can be traded, he can move to 3B, but most likely he becomes the UT guy. Split some game with Scooter at 2B, and play some 3B and SS here and there.

[Boomer5]

What about drafting an advanced college bat (and at 5 slightly under slot as I have seen him 7-10 in various mocks) like Nick Senzel to project at 3B?

 

Id rather have Villar at 2B to pair with Arcia.

[FVBrewerFan]

This year's draft has nothing to do with Villar, or anyone else. You get the best player you can, without going crazy over slot. Sure, they could draft a 3B. But even if they do, who knows if he ever makes it to MLB, and if he does it's at least 3 years down the road. By then, who knows what Villar is.