The Shift

[dacbrewers]

How many shifted plays have cost us a double play? I counted two today and have seen it happen numerous times this year.

[FVBrewerFan]

Not sure, but it has also cost some outs when Scooter has to make long throws against his body when he's behind 2nd or on the left side of IF. He just doesn't have the arm strength to pull that off.

 

Guessing the shifts are still a net gain, but I do wonder if they would be better off just playing straight-up at DP depth in DP situations.

[Warning Track Power]

I have wondered for a few seasons how long it will be before MLB outlaws extreme shifting for the sake of increasing offense. In other words, I foresee a time in the not to distant future where MLB states two IF must remain on both the left and right of 2nd base. It just seems like an idea that will be implemented for the "integrity of the game."

[MrTPlush]

What a crime against baseball that would be. Lets not reward people who fail to learn how to hit it to all fields. The DH is waaaaaaaaaaaay ahead of outlawing shifts and that is still well off ever happening.

[Baldkin]

More often than not, the fault is on the player, not the shift when a double play isn't able to be turned. He was either out of position or didn't realize (because he wasn't in his normal spot) that he needed to cover the bag.

 

You can say it cost them, but if a guy was fielding it out of position because of the shift, that's a clean base hit normally, right?

[jerichoholicninja]

People only remember the times when a hit gets through the shift and not the countless times it takes away a hit.

 

I will agree it makes for awkward double plays and has put Scooter in positions where he has no business making a throw a few times this season. If they are shifting for a RHB it seems it would make more sense to put Scooter at the "3B" spot so he doesn't have to throw across his body.

[FVBrewerFan]

That would be a great idea if/when Rivera is 3B. Maybe Walsh too. Another random thought. Shifts to the right side of diamond don't seem to be as awkard.

[Ennder]

If something works 60% of the time it still fails 40%. There are probably times they should tone down on the shifts but overall they are a good thing.

[3and2Fastball]

I have wondered for a few seasons how long it will be before MLB outlaws extreme shifting for the sake of increasing offense. In other words, I foresee a time in the not to distant future where MLB states two IF must remain on both the left and right of 2nd base. It just seems like an idea that will be implemented for the "integrity of the game."

 

That would be a weird rule. And it would still allow shifting. A SS vs a LH hitter could stand within a foot of second base, for instance

[DuWayne Steurer]

I have wondered for a few seasons how long it will be before MLB outlaws extreme shifting for the sake of increasing offense. In other words, I foresee a time in the not to distant future where MLB states two IF must remain on both the left and right of 2nd base. It just seems like an idea that will be implemented for the "integrity of the game."

 

 

Mannfred has already talked about this, and it would be a terrible rule (IMO).

 

Also, I know the data suggests that shifting creates more outs (by a rather wide margin) than hits that it allows. But I would also say that the Brewers (as they're the only team I watch regularly) probably need to do a better job of maintaining the possibility/probability of being able to turn double plays when they're shifting with runners in force position.

[superfly]

I don't get it. This team is weak on defense in the infield, we shouldn't be making it any harder for them. Such as Scooter being put in positions to make throws that aren't made for him.

[Samurai Bucky]

I have wondered for a few seasons how long it will be before MLB outlaws extreme shifting for the sake of increasing offense. In other words, I foresee a time in the not to distant future where MLB states two IF must remain on both the left and right of 2nd base. It just seems like an idea that will be implemented for the "integrity of the game."

This reminds me of "calling a field" when I played with my buddies as a child.

 

Does anybody have a feeling for if the shifts tend to shift towards a batter pulling the ball instead of hitting it the other way? It would be shading to left for the right handed hitter and to right for the left handed hitter.

 

If so, could it be because youth hitters are not being taught to spray the ball as opposed to "grip it and rip it?"

[JackNicholson1974]

Why would they outlaw shifts? Have they outlawed laying a bunt down the third base line and taking first base and starting a rally? I think it was Houston that did that against us a few times this year already. I loved seeing that. Keep it up and teams will be forced to stop shifting.

[1992casey]

It would be a huge overreaction to outlaw shifts because offense is down. Scoring has been up and down over the years, and any concerns expressed at the time seem to take care of themselves. If you're going to outlaw shifts, you may as well also outlaw the occasional five man infield. Both have their place. If teams want to try to gain a benefit or risk getting burned, it's their prerogative.

[FVBrewerFan]

Reality is, MLB wants shorter games and more runs scored. Not likely they would make a rule regarding shifts, but it's not impossible. I would expect the DH in the NL as the next step in creating more runs, actually surprised it hasn't happened yet.

[DuWayne Steurer]

Reality is, MLB wants shorter games and more runs scored. Not likely they would make a rule regarding shifts, but it's not impossible. I would expect the DH in the NL as the next step in creating more runs, actually surprised it hasn't happened yet.

 

 

As much as I don't want the DH in the NL, I would rather they do that than ban shifts, or make infielders stand in certain spots. That just seems entirely arbitrary and unnecessary.

[FVBrewerFan]

Agreed. I hate the DH, but would rather have DH than dictate where players must be positioned on the field. No reason MLB couldn't do both though, I just really doubt it.

[MrTPlush]

Reality is, MLB wants shorter games and more runs scored. Not likely they would make a rule regarding shifts, but it's not impossible. I would expect the DH in the NL as the next step in creating more runs, actually surprised it hasn't happened yet.

 

I think I mentioned this back when this (idiotic) idea was mentioned by Manfred that you can't really increase runs scored and shorten games. Causing more runs makes the games longer not shorter.

[Baldkin]

I have wondered for a few seasons how long it will be before MLB outlaws extreme shifting for the sake of increasing offense. In other words, I foresee a time in the not to distant future where MLB states two IF must remain on both the left and right of 2nd base. It just seems like an idea that will be implemented for the "integrity of the game."

This reminds me of "calling a field" when I played with my buddies as a child.

 

Does anybody have a feeling for if the shifts tend to shift towards a batter pulling the ball instead of hitting it the other way? It would be shading to left for the right handed hitter and to right for the left handed hitter.

 

If so, could it be because youth hitters are not being taught to spray the ball as opposed to "grip it and rip it?"

 

99% of shifts are towards the pull side. It's been shown by spray data, player tendencies, etc.... guys rarely hit the ball on the ground the other way. Fly balls & line drives, sure, but very rarely do guys excel at hitting grounders the opposite way. It's the weakest kind of contact.

[DuWayne Steurer]

 

99% of shifts are towards the pull side. It's been shown by spray data, player tendencies, etc.... guys rarely hit the ball on the ground the other way. Fly balls & line drives, sure, but very rarely do guys excel at hitting grounders the opposite way. It's the weakest kind of contact.

 

 

Tony Gwynn was supposedly a master at shooting grounders between short and third, but I wonder if there's evidence to back that up? Also, if there IS evidence to back it up, I suppose we just have to say he was one of those outlier types who is the exception to the rule.

[Thurston Fluff]

 

99% of shifts are towards the pull side. It's been shown by spray data, player tendencies, etc.... guys rarely hit the ball on the ground the other way. Fly balls & line drives, sure, but very rarely do guys excel at hitting grounders the opposite way. It's the weakest kind of contact.

 

 

Tony Gwynn was supposedly a master at shooting grounders between short and third, but I wonder if there's evidence to back that up? Also, if there IS evidence to back it up, I suppose we just have to say he was one of those outlier types who is the exception to the rule.

 

Maybe I'm way off on this but it seems to me guys who hit the other way tend to be able to hit to all fields. It isn't that they can only hit the other way but are just good enough to get a hit on pitches that cannot be pulled.

[dlk9s]

"The Shift" - a new MLB Network show not hosted by Harold Reynolds.