What Fringe prospects are you watching and why?

[CheezWizHed]

My thoughts on mid-season promos:

 

I look at mid-season promotions two ways:

- Players that are out-classing their competition (there are only a few I could see this year)

- Players playing decently, but benefit from the draft class pushing for room from below. (Most of what I bring up here).

 

Wisconsin

Burkhalterto A+ wouldn't surprise me. Edit: Forgot about Burkhalter's injury.

 

Depending on how aggressive the Brewers are, any one of Miguel Diaz, Marcos Diplan or Freddy Peralta could go also. I doubt any of them based on age alone, but worthy based on numbers.

 

There are a number of relievers at Wisconsin that are older and may warrant a bump: Nate Griep, Scott Grist, Drake Owenby.

 

Blake Allemand is surely going back even without Neuhaus. I have to imagine we have a SS or 2B coming up from the draft to cover his departure. Denson might get some consideration also. He isn't lighting the world on fire, but the draft might push him up also.

 

Brevard:

At A+, I'd guess a few guys might get released. Older BPs that aren't pitching so well (Kaleb Earls, Brad Kuntz).

 

Is it too early for Perrin to bump again? Maybe a Zack Hirsch(25), Gage Smith (25), or Jon Olczak (22) gets bumped to the AA BP. Edit: Sorry missed that Gage was moved up already.

 

I can see getting Coulter to AA for good behavior and time served. Not so much on performance this year, but I thought he did enough last year to be promoted.

 

Johnny Davis (26) already moved up. Less of a chance, but maybe on Dustin Demuth (24) too.

 

Biloxi

Cooper is an obvious one that is deserving. Brett Phillips isn't killing it as we would wish, but still worth AAA considerations.

 

Stephen Kohlscheen (27), Tyler Spurlin (25), and Stephen Peterson (28) all could move up to the AAA BP.

 

Colorado Springs

More likely we will see some releases more than promotions as there aren't too many spots at the MLB level and this team represents the most older middling prospects; several of whom aren't performing well.

- Some combination of Jim Miller (34), Brooks Hall (26), Ariel Pena (27), Sam Freeman (28), Ben Guez (29), Eric Young (31), or Andy Wilkins (27) might be released.

- Manny Pina is a shoo-in to make the MLB squad if Lucroy is traded. Free Nate ORF!!!

- No SP is worthy of bumping up to the MLB level yet (as an SP), but some SPs/RPs might make the MLB BP at some point: Mitch Lambson (25), Damien Magnifico (25), Austin Ross (27), Drew Gagnon (26), or Brent Suter (26)

[gregmag]

I can see getting Coulter to AA for good behavior and time served.

 

I love this, both as humor and as insight. All I know about Coulter is his numbers, and I understand there may well be good coaching-scouting reasons to leave him in Brevard. But sticking a power prospect in that power-sucking hellhole for two seasons sure seems like a weird way to try to develop an asset.

 

Our minor league affiliations at A+ and AAA are a big problem. Maybe Lopez would be struggling just as badly if he didn't have to pitch his home games on the moon, but no one can tell me this is optimal. I've always thought (maybe incorrectly, who knows) that extreme hitters' and pitchers' environments were bad for building successful teams, let alone developing talent, because your information is skewed and your strategies are accordingly distorted. I worry that we're rebuilding with one hand tied behind our back.

[Hammer]

I worry that we're rebuilding with one hand tied behind our back.

 

This has been my fear for the last two seasons. Hopefully the AAA mess is fixed after this year...

[reillymcshane]

When can we expect to see promotions through the minors.

 

Who would you suggest?

 

On the hitting side who do you promote from WI to BC beside Allemand if Neuhaus ever returns? It's not like there's anyone in BC from a position player perspective who's AA worthy at this time, and I have hard time sending players back a level they've already succeeded at. The hitters in AA all belong there for the entire year, and Nashville is filled with veteran depth like usual.

 

Which pitchers do you move and where? I wouldn't want any of the young pitchers in WI promoted, let them work on command at a level where they can have success. Who in BC is promotion worthy other than Ventura, and I'd rather he spend all season in A+. Perrin and Ponce should pitch there the rest of the year. Now that Hader was bumped I don't see anyone in AA who's promotion worthy either.

 

I would consider the following moves:

 

- Coulter to AA. Just want to kick start the guy. You can move Taylor to CF with Phillips getting the promotion.

- Garrett Cooper to AAA. Andy Wilkens and Will Middlebrooks are filler. Just let one of those guys go and let Cooper play full-time at 1B.

- Devin Williams to A+. He did well there last year, so let's keep him moving. I thought he'd be at BC this year.

- Blake Allemand to A+ - not sure if there is space for him, but if there is, up he goes.

- Nate Orf to AAA - not sure if there is space for him, but if there is, up he goes.

- Brett Phillips to AAA - Since last year, he's got almost 500 plate appearances at AA. That's essentially a full season. He's got a .276 BA, .355 OBP, .457 SLG and an .811 OPS. That includes 134K and 47BB. Those are solid numbers for a CF to produce. I'd say bump him up and face the next level of competition. The strikeouts this year are concerning, but I don't want them to be the only reason he's held back. He can easily play instead of guys like Eric Young Jr.

 

These moves are all really done without thinking about

[FVBrewerFan]

Orf is already at AAA. Cooper can get promoted to AAA, that's fine, but he's just as much filler as Middlebrooks or Wilkins. Devin Williams will be in BC, he's just getting back up to speed from his injury.

 

Coulter...I would consider actually moving him down to Appleton. Then bring him up to A+ next season since they won't be playing in BC then.

 

Phillips, I don't know. I could go either way, I guess I'll leave it up to the player development folks.

[Mass Haas]

Colorado Springs

More likely we will see some releases more than promotions as there aren't too many spots at the MLB level and this team represents the most older middling prospects; several of whom aren't performing well.

- Some combination of Jim Miller (34), Brooks Hall (26), Ariel Pena (27), Sam Freeman (28), Ben Guez (29), Eric Young (31), or Andy Wilkins (27) might be released.

 

Miller and Guez were released earlier this season, CWH.

[CheezWizHed]

Miller and Guez were released earlier this season, CWH.

Doh! I had to edit that post about 3x to fix issues like that... But I knew someone would find something I missed. Either they aren't playing anywhere or I missed the new team on the milb.com page.

 

Our minor league affiliations at A+ and AAA are a big problem. Maybe Lopez would be struggling just as badly if he didn't have to pitch his home games on the moon, but no one can tell me this is optimal. I've always thought (maybe incorrectly, who knows) that extreme hitters' and pitchers' environments were bad for building successful teams, let alone developing talent, because your information is skewed and your strategies are accordingly distorted. I worry that we're rebuilding with one hand tied behind our back.

 

I may be one of the few that disagrees with this (at least partially). I think you have to adjust expectations at A+ and AAA, but I don't think they are necessarily bad places to learn how to play ball. I like Brevard better than Colorado Springs, but I think each has their own challenges. The goal of the minors is teaching people to play baseball. Having people to learn in different environments can be advantageous if you teach the players appropriately:

1) In Colorado Springs you really have to learn to pitch with "bad" breaking pitches. Fastball location (keep it down) and change-ups are probably more desirable. Work on getting more groundballs.

2) In Brevard, your hitters should be focusing more on line drives and less on flyball hitters. It should also help people focus in on centering on the ball.

 

I still would prefer to be out of Colorado Springs, but I don't think Brevard is a bad place. You just have to realize:

1) 800 OPS at Colorado Springs is "nothing", but is a great season at Brevard.

2) Pitchers with a 4-5 ERA in CS is pretty normal. And ERAs of 6 might not be the end of the world either (certain pitchers will do better than others depending on how they rely on their breaking stuff).

3) If you can't make it at Brevard with good numbers, you don't deserve a bump up. But the real make or break lies at AA.

[Outlander]

Orf is already at AAA. Cooper can get promoted to AAA, that's fine, but he's just as much filler as Middlebrooks or Wilkins. Devin Williams will be in BC, he's just getting back up to speed from his injury.

 

Coulter...I would consider actually moving him down to Appleton. Then bring him up to A+ next season since they won't be playing in BC then.

 

Phillips, I don't know. I could go either way, I guess I'll leave it up to the player development folks.

I don't really agree with that. He is an older prospect but this is only his fourth year professionally and has been able to produce 350/414/486 during his time in AA. Middlebrooks has been playing for nearly a decade and everybody pretty much knows what he is a this point. Jason Rogers didn't make it the majors until 26 and he was flipped for prospects, maybe Cooper could produce moderately during these transitional years and be flipped for something as well.

[reillymcshane]

Orf is already at AAA.

He just got called up today, so I'll take credit for making it happen

[FVBrewerFan]

Exactly, you should! Well ,called up yesterday but who's counting?!? ; )

 

As for Cooper, the difference between him and Rogers is power. Rogers carried a similar OBP as Cooper, but had stretches with big power. I can't imagine trading him for anything, but you never know. If it's between keeping Cooper or Middlebrooks though, yea I would keep Cooper.

[igor67]

Actually I'm in the camp that the extreme power sapping effect of Brevard seems just as bad as the artificial boosts from Colorado Springs. Particularly for the higher strikeout high power types. So much of their potential value is just taken away that its pretty easy to kill a guys career good teaching or not. Roache kind of made it through, Coulter has been abused by the park. And looking at some of the high risk reward types we were all excited about its the last place I would want to send Harrison or Gatewood next year. They've made strides after tough first years, but not a giant leap that they would need to be able to get through Brevard, and I just don't see them surviving another down year. OK is fine with the hope that if they can at least keep treading water and advancing the tools might really take over at some point, but Brevard makes me very nervous they won't end up looking like Coulter on a bad day.

[FVBrewerFan]

But they have a new home in Kissimee next year right?

[Mass Haas]

But they have a new home in Kissimee next year right?

 

If Manatees ownership decides to re-up with Milwaukee, the Brewers haven't exactly provided them with scintillating teams over the past decade (three winning teams since 2005).

 

Wouldn't it be something to end up in Lancaster or such, the complete opposite of Space Coast.

[CheezWizHed]

Particularly for the higher strikeout high power types. So much of their potential value is just taken away that its pretty easy to kill a guys career good teaching or not.

 

Only if you expect all metrics to be the same. Personally, I thought Coulter did enough last year (stat wise at least) to be promoted. This year, he fell off the table, but motivation could be a problem. Either way, its a way to find weak-spots in a player's approach by forcing them to adjust to adverse conditions.

 

Its probably better to avoid these spots (especially if they are exaggerated beyond the MLB level), but I don't think its the end of the world either. Honestly, you would think Colorado would want Colorado Springs. Give the players a taste of what they will experience at the MLB level before coming up.

[brewmann04]

i don't like the chances of the brewers leaving Col springs.

[Mr Southpaw]

Off subject, be big boys and just move to Madison.

[ZBTMP]

Anyone have a radar reading on Jordan Yamamoto this year? A 4.5:1 K:BB ratio is pretty sensational.

[JohnBriggs12]

Orf is already at AAA. Cooper can get promoted to AAA, that's fine, but he's just as much filler as Middlebrooks or Wilkins. Devin Williams will be in BC, he's just getting back up to speed from his injury.

 

Coulter...I would consider actually moving him down to Appleton. Then bring him up to A+ next season since they won't be playing in BC then.

 

Phillips, I don't know. I could go either way, I guess I'll leave it up to the player development folks.

I don't really agree with that. He is an older prospect but this is only his fourth year professionally and has been able to produce 350/414/486 during his time in AA. Middlebrooks has been playing for nearly a decade and everybody pretty much knows what he is a this point. Jason Rogers didn't make it the majors until 26 and he was flipped for prospects, maybe Cooper could produce moderately during these transitional years and be flipped for something as well.

 

Cooper is long overdue for a promotion. He's a doubles machine that only hits the occasional HR, but now he's showing he can also play OF, where the Brewers are seriously lacking. He's likely never a core player on a contending team, but certainly should be able to crack a rebuilding Brewer roster by next year if not September and who knows? He doesn't strike out a ton, so he'll likely not embarrass himself.

[FVBrewerFan]

Anyone have a radar reading on Jordan Yamamoto this year? A 4.5:1 K:BB ratio is pretty sensational.

 

He has movement on everything. Numbers are much better than that even if you take away an outing where he got absolutely hammered. Could be on my next 25 list.

[brewmann04]

Jordan is pitching like a battleship.

[MrTPlush]

Jordan, in my opinion, has a pretty high floor. All his pitches should be decent at the MLB level and he has great control. Problem is at this stage his ceiling isn't anything to get excited about.

[jerichoholicninja]

Jordan is pitching like a battleship.

 

I have no clue what this even means. I take it it's a good thing.

[TheCrew07]

Jordan is pitching like a battleship.

 

I have no clue what this even means. I take it it's a good thing.

 

I shudder to think of what's not being taught in history these days...

 

Isoroku Yamamoto was the Japanese naval commander during WWII.

 

The battleship's name was actually the Yamato, it was an awesome specimen for it's era:

 

[battlekow]

If Manatees ownership decides to re-up with Milwaukee, the Brewers haven't exactly provided them with scintillating teams over the past decade (three winning teams since 2005).

 

Wouldn't it be something to end up in Lancaster or such, the complete opposite of Space Coast.

I'd selfishly love it if they moved to the Cal League, because then I could go see them. Lancaster is a little over an hour away, a nice drive through the San Gabriels. Of course, we've seen that movie before in High Desert and it presents the same developmental issue.

 

I shudder to think of what's not being taught in history these days...

 

Isoroku Yamamoto was the Japanese naval commander during WWII.

 

The battleship's name was actually the Yamato, it was an awesome specimen for it's era

Forget history class--if you played StarCraft, you've (indirectly) heard of it: http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/Yamato_cannon

[SoCalBrewfan]

I shudder to think of what's not being taught in history these days...

 

Starcraft

 

Sigh....serious students of these matters know the Yamato's finest hour didn't come until 2199 or so. And now I will always think of Jordan 'Space Battleship' Yamamoto and his best pitch, the wave motion cannon.