Lucroy Trades/Proposals (part 2)

[beekay414]

If the Indians are willing to part with Zimmer, Sheffield and a wildcard like Luke Wakamatsu, I'm all for that deal.

[torts]

 

eh

 

So basically... the same players that could have gotten Carlos Gomez, except now the Brewers have to give up more.

[nate82]

 

I don't think it's realistic that the Red Sox even give up one of 3B Rafael Devers or RHP Anderson Espinosa in a deal for 1 1/2 years of Lucroy, let alone BOTH+.

 

I also think that RHP Lucas Giolito is 100% untouchable via trade with the Nationals as well.

 

I think the Rangers, Dodgers, or Rays match up well with us for trade partners.

 

Lucroy

for

RHP Luis Ortiz, OF Lewis Brinson (Rangers)

or

RHP Jose De Leon, OF/1B Cody Bellinger (Dodgers)

or

RHP Brent Honeywell, 1B Casey Gillaspie (Rays)

 

I think a third, lower level piece could be added to these deals as well, but I would be happy to land two-blue chip prospects for Lucroy at this point.

Which of these 3 hypothetical deals do Brewer fans find most attractive?

 

For 1 1/2 years of a catcher playing at an All-Star level and a team trying to trade for Lucroy are going to have to give up at least 2 A type prospects. Anything less and the Brewers are losing on the deal by a lot.

 

The team that is acquiring Lucroy is getting 1 1/2 years at a very small salary plus they are getting a compensation pick when Lucroy leaves the following year. So the team acquiring Lucroy is getting more than just 1 1/2 years of an All-Star level of play at catcher. Just for a 1/2 of a season for Lucroy would be Devers + B-/C type prospect.

 

The market right now for hitters no matter the position is in favor of the seller as the buyer is going to have to pay a premium in order to get a player they want.

 

The Rays are not going to be buyers in this market so you can cross them off the list. The Rangers are also not going to trade for Lucroy unless they can get him for Brinson and a lower level prospect.

 

The Dodgers also don't make any sense at all for a Lucroy trade. They already have their catcher for the next few years in Barnes and Grandal. I don't see the Dodgers giving up on Grandal this early. Though Braun to the Dodgers does make sense here and depending on how much the Brewers pick up salary wise will determine the type of prospects the Brewers will get in return.

[dacrew101]

 

I don't think it's realistic that the Red Sox even give up one of 3B Rafael Devers or RHP Anderson Espinosa in a deal for 1 1/2 years of Lucroy, let alone BOTH+.

 

I also think that RHP Lucas Giolito is 100% untouchable via trade with the Nationals as well.

 

I think the Rangers, Dodgers, or Rays match up well with us for trade partners.

 

Lucroy

for

RHP Luis Ortiz, OF Lewis Brinson (Rangers)

or

RHP Jose De Leon, OF/1B Cody Bellinger (Dodgers)

or

RHP Brent Honeywell, 1B Casey Gillaspie (Rays)

 

I think a third, lower level piece could be added to these deals as well, but I would be happy to land two-blue chip prospects for Lucroy at this point.

Which of these 3 hypothetical deals do Brewer fans find most attractive?

 

For 1 1/2 years of a catcher playing at an All-Star level and a team trying to trade for Lucroy are going to have to give up at least 2 A type prospects. Anything less and the Brewers are losing on the deal by a lot.

 

The team that is acquiring Lucroy is getting 1 1/2 years at a very small salary plus they are getting a compensation pick when Lucroy leaves the following year. So the team acquiring Lucroy is getting more than just 1 1/2 years of an All-Star level of play at catcher. Just for a 1/2 of a season for Lucroy would be Devers + B-/C type prospect.

 

The market right now for hitters no matter the position is in favor of the seller as the buyer is going to have to pay a premium in order to get a player they want.

 

The Rays are not going to be buyers in this market so you can cross them off the list. The Rangers are also not going to trade for Lucroy unless they can get him for Brinson and a lower level prospect.

 

The Dodgers also don't make any sense at all for a Lucroy trade. They already have their catcher for the next few years in Barnes and Grandal. I don't see the Dodgers giving up on Grandal this early. Though Braun to the Dodgers does make sense here and depending on how much the Brewers pick up salary wise will determine the type of prospects the Brewers will get in return.

 

So which team is giving up two A type prospects? And who are these prospects?

[Mass Haas]

New York Daily News: Mets must trade for Jonathan Lucroy — even if it means giving up Zack Wheeler

[SRB]

[sarcasm]New York media: Mets must trade for Jonathan Lucroy — even if it means giving up Bartolo Colon[/sarcasm]

[adambr2]

I'm not against the idea of acquiring Wheeler. He certainly comes as a major risk, but it's not often that you get a chance to acquire an ace-caliber starter who was a top 7 prospect at one point.

 

Ideally, you'd like to get a guy with more control, but you'd still have Wheeler through 2019. So in a perfect world, you're competitive by 2018 again, but if not, if Wheeler is performing at his ceiling, he could easily be flipped to reload again.

[RockCoCougars]

The Brewers dodged a bullet with the Wheeler deal last summer, why would they go back again? He's damaged goods and it seems like a lifetime ago he was traded for Beltran.... his career path is starting to take the trajectory of Bill Pulsipher's.

 

I will admit that I wanted to see him gone after his off-season interview, but now I say any deal for Lucroy at this point should begin with the other team's top prospect. If that's 'unreasonable', I'd just hold onto him.

[dacrew101]

I dislike wheeler as a headliner to but holding onto him is even worse...

[brewcrewdue80]

What is so special about Wheeler. Ace? His stats have him at 100 ERA+? When he comes back...seems like Harvey went through his injury and back since Wheelers injury, he'll finish the season. Pitch his Arb season to 150?IP next season=not tradeable. 2nd Arb year maybe get the 190IP. And his final year when he can approach ace level Innings...He's a rental in trade. It's nowhere near enough for him to headline a trade.. Plus we get him for Arb? So immediately he's paid 4-5million next season I'd assume. If he completed it healthy.

 

Gotta be a better Pitcher out there for our rebuild. Make it 3team and find these gems. Atlanta has found a way.

[adambr2]

The Brewers dodged a bullet with the Wheeler deal last summer, why would they go back again? He's damaged goods and it seems like a lifetime ago he was traded for Beltran.... his career path is starting to take the trajectory of Bill Pulsipher's.

 

He is pretty much at exactly where we would have hoped he would be at if we HAD completed the trade last year.

[MrTPlush]

The Dodgers "don't make any sense at all"? They have gotten absolutely awful production from their catchers. That alone is a great reason for them to trade for Lucroy. They also don't have any large money invested into a catcher long term to really stop a deal. Yasmani Grandal was a solid cacher the last two years, but nothing really all that special. Brewers could always take him in a trade. I sure wouldn't mind taking back Grandal as a solid piece of a trade.

[MilwaukeeBeers]

The Dodgers "don't make any sense at all"? They have gotten absolutely awful production from their catchers. That alone is a great reason for them to trade for Lucroy. They also don't have any large money invested into a catcher long term to really stop a deal. Yasmani Grandal was a solid cacher the last two years, but nothing really all that special. Brewers could always take him in a trade. I sure wouldn't mind taking back Grandal as a solid piece of a trade.

Personally I think they're our best option. I hate hypothetical trades but I've been racking my brain and came up with this.

 

Dodger Receive

Jonathan Lucroy

Will Smith

 

Brewers Receive

Yaz (Not sure of value, but he's having an awful year feel free to omit him)

JDL (Crown jewel in this trade) 23

Cody Bellinger (Has plus power potential, a lot of swing and miss though) 20

Walker Buehler (Lottery ticket coming off TJ. Mid rotation type) 21

Yadier Alvarez (Another lottery ticket but big time arm... Yuuuge potential) 19

Mitch Hansen (Last lottery ticket, has a very smooth swing, 2nd rounder last year) 20

 

A lot of risk is involved in this deal, but the value seems to be there...

 

Side note hypothetically say someone in the org. is in love with Gavin Lux, is he a POSSIBLE PTBNL? (not in this deal) Assuming he signs, how would that work with the Trea Turner rule and everything?

[A Swing and A Drive]

That haul from the Dodgers is wishful thinking, but there's no way they give up 3 pitching prospects of that caliber (Alvarez, De Leon, and Buehler), even with Will Smith included in the deal. I think if you add in Smith, we may be able to get De Leon and Buehler, along with a couple of other next tier pieces, like Bellinger or Hanson. I'd also be interested in 2B Will Calhoun.

 

However, my guess is that the Dodgers would also want to include one of their catchers in the deal (Grandal or Barnes), thus taking out a prospect or two.

 

I am hopeful that a market for Lucroy will develop, but it's hard to see a realistic match at this point. With that said, it would be a shock if Lucroy is still a Brewers past the end of this July (trade deadline).

 

I'm still hoping the Rangers come around and get in on the bidding for Luc, as I like their prospects.

[JohnBriggs12]

I still say the best match out there is the Cubs. Yeah I know they have Wilson Contreras waiting in the wings, but 2 of their big 3 starters are not signed beyond 2017, and do they want to trust that staff with a raw rookie in 2017, one who has 7 passed balls aready in AAA this year? Besides that, Montero has a balky back and Ross is retiring after this year. Cubs certainly have the resources to extend Lucroy too and watching him win championships will be a tough pill to swallow, but if he brings back Contreras and Vogelbach, or perhaps Schwarber instead of Contreras that's a solid return of potential middle of the order bats. something the Brewers will be in dire need of. Cubs aren't deep in pitching in their system, so they might want an arm included in the deal if they are giving up those 2.

[Madhawk23]

I still say the best match out there is the Cubs. Yeah I know they have Wilson Contreras waiting in the wings, but 2 of their big 3 starters are not signed beyond 2017, and do they want to trust that staff with a raw rookie in 2017, one who has 7 passed balls aready in AAA this year? Besides that, Montero has a balky back and Ross is retiring after this year. Cubs certainly have the resources to extend Lucroy too and watching him win championships will be a tough pill to swallow, but if he brings back Contreras and Vogelbach, or perhaps Schwarber instead of Contreras that's a solid return of potential middle of the order bats. something the Brewers will be in dire need of. Cubs aren't deep in pitching in their system, so they might want an arm included in the deal if they are giving up those 2.

 

 

Ugh - I don't think I could stand seeing either Luc or Braun helping the Cubs win a World Series. If we are going to trade Luc to our hated rivals, the package in return would have to be higher than just Contreras and Vogelbach. Personally, I think I'd need Contreras, Jimenez, and Cease. If they say no to that deal, then you just hang up the phone. If they agree to that deal, I'd probably pull the trigger and then just hope that Luc falls flat on his face in the playoffs this October to prevent the Cubs from winning their first title. Contreras looks like he's going to be at worst a solid big league catcher, Jimenez sounds like their next stud prospect (is it even possible for them to have more of these guys in their system?), and Cease is a bit of a lottery pick with a big arm.

[Point Beer Is Best]

New York Daily News: Mets must trade for Jonathan Lucroy — even if it means giving up Zack Wheeler

 

The best scenario for us could be pitting the Nats & Mets against each other in bidding war.

[billymac]

Zach Wheeler is not a Stearns guy. 25 years old, only 3 years of control. Doesn't fit the young and controllable slogan that Stearns has been preaching and acquiring. If the Mets are going to get Lucroy, I highly doubt Strearns would put Wheeler(who hasn't pitched in over a year) as the headliner. They would have to offer others.

[Austin Tatious]

I would be disappointed with Wheeler for Lucroy.

 

The good news is that Stearns is reportedly driving a hard bargain.

 

The major fallacy some of you who constantly want to undersell our talent make is you don't understand negotiating. Fundamentally, you have to look at it from the buyer's point of view and market Brewer players accordingly. First, some of these buyers may be nervous that their direct competitor could get our guys. That is clearly an issue in multiple divisions. Second, some teams may realize that, due to age and circumstance of existing core, that their legitimate chance to win is in the next year or two. They can get into go-for it mode. Milwaukee needs to bargain from a position of strength, which I am sure they are. You help create an atmosphere of urgency on the other side. The other side needs to believe in the value to them that you are presenting. This is negotiating 101.

 

No, you will likely not get a clear cut upper level ace prospect in a trade. That is why it is absolutely vital to spend first round picks on your ace pitcher. Your real shot to get an ace in a trade is a lottery ticket prospect like Marcos Diplan who is dealing. Thus, sure, Giolito or Urias are off the table. That's another fallacy people have. They point out that many pitchers drafted high never make it. That's never the point. The way to look at is that most of the Chris Sale, Alex Fernandez type aces come out of the (mostly top half) of the first round. You may miss on a high draft pick but that's part of it and you likely will have to take multiple hacks at it.

 

But, an outfielder like Robles? You can absolutely probe that in a trade. The Nats have a mature team that is ready to win. And they have to deal with the Mets who can be in the same sweepstakes.

 

Same with the Giants and Dodgers in the west.

[Yolk]

I'm guessing my Lucroy for Profar wish is no longer a possibility with Profar tearing it up in Arlington now.

[A Swing and A Drive]

The Tigers seem like they will go ALL in this year if they are in contention in the wide-open AL Central.

 

Proposal

Tigers get:

C Jonathan Lucroy

 

Brewers get:

LHP Daniel Norris

OF Steven Moya

C James McCann or Salty

 

I know the Tigers just landed Norris last trade deadline, but with the emergence of Michael Fulmer, I think Norris could be had. Maybe throw in a reliever to get it done (besides Smith or Jeffress).

 

Thoughts?

[mlloyd10]

The Tigers seem like they will go ALL in this year if they are in contention in the wide-open AL Central.

 

Proposal

Tigers get:

C Jonathan Lucroy

 

Brewers get:

LHP Daniel Norris

OF Steven Moya

C James McCann

 

I know the Tigers just landed Norris last trade deadline, but with the emergence of Michael Fulmer, I think Norris could be had. Maybe throw in a reliever to get it done (besides Smith or Jeffress).

 

Thoughts?

 

Sure

[beekay414]

Thoughts?

 

Not good

[A Swing and A Drive]

Sure.

 

Not good.

 

Very insightful. Thank you fellas. Lol

 

I also like LHP Tyler Alexander from the Tigers. Perhaps he could be included.

[trwi7]

You would have to really like Norris because the rest is a whole lot of nothing. I like Norris but not that much.