Lucroy Trades/Proposals

[Warning Track Power]

Agreed on Brinson. Brinson and Tate and I call it a day.

[Hammer]

Personally, I think you have to add pitching with this trade. Tate, Ortiz and 2 lower list P's would do it for me...

[Warning Track Power]

@Hammer:

 

I hear you on the pitching. My ideal, dream scenario is Lucroy for Giolito straight up. I would be very comfortable with a rotation of Giolito, Nelson, Peralta, Jungmann, Davies with Hader, Lopez, Houser, Williams and Medeiros potentially coming. However, I think the Brewers need to target elite prospects and Giolito is likely not going to be dealt. Given this, I look at the Rangers and Nationals and see Brinson and Trea Turner as the likely jewels of any deal with those teams. If it's Texas, Brinson and Tate. If it's Washington, Turner and Robles (if we have to add to get Robles it's probably worth it).

 

I put my faith in Stearns & Montgomery that they will be able to draft and develop pitching better than their predecessors.

[Hammer]

To me, the Rangers do make the most sense as a trading partner as they are the closest to being considered a World Series favorite. While I know position really shouldn't matter at this point, the Brewers have so many outfielders in their top 20 list already that adding another one doesn't seem like the best use of a very valuable resource. Just my .02 though...

 

All of that said, it will be probably take the first injury or two in spring training to find where his true landing spot is. I still think teams are waiting to see if he can take that first foul tip to the face before making a substantial trade offer...

[Jenkins5]

Glad to see the one many crush all over, Ryan Cordell free falling to 16, closer to where he belongs.

 

Jurado will be in most peoples top 10 come this season. He essentially is a 20 year old Jorge Ortega how with an ability to miss bats usually around a 8+ K/9. I say Ortega because he is a pinpoint command guy, Jurado at younger age offers much better stuff. He has some power projections as well topping out with a sinking 95 mph fastball.

 

Overall I'm still sticking to my guns of Brinson or Mazara / Jurado OR Mendez/ Then one of the following Fobres, Guzman, Taveras, Payano, Yrizarri, B. Martin, Beras (tough to swing)

 

Overall we might be get a little more overall value if we drop from Gallo to Brinson or Mazara. If we get Gallo, we aren't getting much else.

 

I will not touch Ortiz no matter the potential, his weight will be a huge battle for him his entire career. It would be the Ed Lacy type discussion every season until he eventually gone. He has a cupcake and he gains 15 pounds.

 

Matuella I have now crossed off since he also has new back issues if his arm issues were not enough. He has all the potential to be a frontline guy but Mark Rogers very well could be his career path.

 

Cordell no thank you ever! We can do better than AAAA 5th OF prospects.

 

Tate I'd take but I struggle to find a good package around him that would include a bat that I'd like. A arm heavy deal like Tate, Mendez or Jurado, and then a high upside bat like Forbes or Tavares (really would love to bring him in....they gave us bonus baby Diplan last year) would be fine.

 

Morgan is a guy who is very intriguing with his approach and bat but with his size, not sure I'd ever settle in a 3B. Basically would be just another 2B/SS prospect.

 

Kivlehan is older and still far to unrefined. I won't take.

 

Eric Jenkins- I would not be shocked what so ever if Jenkins is included in any deal with Rangers based on all the talk and pre draft rumors linking Brewers to him. Brewers must have shown plenty of signs they were pretty interested in him and he fits the bill of what Brewers are looking for. He has incredible speed. I won't be shocked if he steals 50-60 bases this season in A ball. He walks at 11% clip and has solid hit tool. Power is not part of game right now now, not much of an OF arm but he is a good snag.

 

Mendez fits the DS bill perfect for a pitcher. Big projectable lefty who is growing and adding power. Most important he has great feel for pitching and controlling the zone while still K'ing around 1 per Inning. I'd be very happy with either Jurado or Mendez coming back in any deal he have with Texas. Both are 20 -21 years old and have plenty of upside.

[Jenkins5]

@Hammer:

 

I hear you on the pitching. My ideal, dream scenario is Lucroy for Giolito straight up. I would be very comfortable with a rotation of Giolito, Nelson, Peralta, Jungmann, Davies with Hader, Lopez, Houser, Williams and Medeiros potentially coming. However, I think the Brewers need to target elite prospects and Giolito is likely not going to be dealt. Given this, I look at the Rangers and Nationals and see Brinson and Trea Turner as the likely jewels of any deal with those teams. If it's Texas, Brinson and Tate. If it's Washington, Turner and Robles (if we have to add to get Robles it's probably worth it).

 

I put my faith in Stearns & Montgomery that they will be able to draft and develop pitching better than their predecessors.

 

You mean Lucroy, Smith, and Khris Davis for Giolito right? He is about as untouchable as they come. Lucroy is good but nearly good enough to land a Ace who is on the door step and will be cheap for 6 years. Washington is about to pay Harper 35+ million a season, they aren't going to give away a cheap ace for jelly beans. Now if he was in Rookie ball or the A- A+ range, yest it could have worked but not when he is at his highest value about to hit the bigs. Really you need to trade a top notch franchise player like a Kersaw, Greinke, Cabrera, Trout, Price, type player to get him and Lucroy is not on that level.

 

I'd be fine with a pitcher heavy deal. Never can have too many high ceiling arms. Tate, Jurado, Payano, and Brett Martin

 

Overall you need to add someone with Lucroy if you want the grand package like the Houston deal. In no way would I say Lucroy is that much more worth than Gomez. Originally Gomez was going to net Wheeler & Flores or Santana, Hader, Houser ish. So have to assume that is what we are looking at for a return.

 

I want

[StearnsFTW]

Personally I don't care about position at all. If it's a need, great, but just get the best players you can imo.

 

Brinson and Tate would be phenomenal, I just don't know if it's realistic.

[Jenkins5]

Personally I don't care about position at all. If it's a need, great, but just get the best players you can imo.

 

Brinson and Tate would be phenomenal, I just don't know if it's realistic.

 

I think Brinson is the most must get in there system. I agree position doesn't matter. Create the biggest logjam you can and take top 3 guys. Brinson & Phillips in the same OF would be pretty electric. Those are two guys who can fly around! Slide Brinson to RF. Move Braun/Domingo to LF depending who is the guy when the time comes in 2017.

[JackNicholson1974]

I hate to be a downer but I would be shocked if we got a package anywhere close to what people are hoping for, either from Texas or Washington. I have to remember that we are fans of the Brewers and therefore do not properly value our players, much like fans from these teams dont properly value their players. For example, I was reading an article linked here somewhere about the Segura trade, written by Dbacks site. In the comments section people were wondering why Lucroy was not included as part of the package.

 

His true value is most likely somewhere in between. He isnt going to bring back multiple top 100 prospects and he isnt a throw in to a larger, crappy deal.

 

If Texas wants him I would expect a Tate level prospect and 2-3 others from deeper in the system outside the top 100.

[StearnsFTW]

Personally I don't care about position at all. If it's a need, great, but just get the best players you can imo.

 

Brinson and Tate would be phenomenal, I just don't know if it's realistic.

 

I think Brinson is the most must get in there system. I agree position doesn't matter. Create the biggest logjam you can and take top 3 guys. Brinson & Phillips in the same OF would be pretty electric. Those are two guys who can fly around! Slide Brinson to RF. Move Braun/Domingo to LF depending who is the guy when the time comes in 2017.

 

The thought of a Clark/Phillips/Brinson outfield makes me drool.

 

To jacknicholson's point, I agree that there may be some of that going on, but personally, I don't think the package I proposed is unrealistic. Top shelf guy, low level high upside arm and a lower ceiling "need" guy strikes me as possible.

[jerichoholicninja]

Hasn't every major trade made during this rebuild, aside from Lind, brought back as much or more than us posters thought? Gomez and Fiers got us two top 100 prospects plus a young MLB OF, Ramirez was expected to be a dump but brought back a probable bullpen guy, Parra got us a young 4/5 starter, Krod got a high upside middle infielder and many thought no team would ever trade for him, Segura has been crap for almost his entire career but still returned a very high upside prospect (with some help from Aaron Hill).

 

Texas and Washington have had very talented teams for a few years and spent a lot of money but have absolutely nothing to show for it. One of them is going to get desperate and give up the goods for Lucroy. My gut is telling me both have made very good offers but Stearns is doing his best to play them against each other to squeak a little bit more out.

[superfly]

Gallo is at the position of need for us. I'd take him as part of a deal and hope he figures it out.

[StearnsFTW]

Gallo is at the position of need for us. I'd take him as part of a deal and hope he figures it out.

 

Gallo scares the hell out of me. No thanks.

[Kelbysdaddy]

Gallo is at the position of need for us. I'd take him as part of a deal and hope he figures it out.

 

Gallo scares the hell out of me. No thanks.

Count me in on this one! No doubt he has extreme power and will hit 40-50 HRs but that K rate is insane. He is still young so sure, he could improve his plate discipline but I get the feeling he's thinking about nothing besides hitting a homer every time he steps to the plate. He's just another Mark Reynolds as far as I'm concerned. Not like that is so bad but I'd rather have someone else be the centerpiece of a trade for luc.

[3and2Fastball]

so.... still nothing? No new rumors? All quiet?

 

re: Gallo. His ceiling is very high. Could be another Rizzo (or better). Could be another Chris Carter. Worth rolling the dice on, in my opinion.

[StearnsFTW]

His upside, to me at least, is Adam Dunn. Which would be fantastic. His downside is a complete bust though.

 

Brinson is going to be a good to very good player imo. I'd take that and run, assuming he comes with other prospects

[Warning Track Power]

Gallo is at the position of need for us. I'd take him as part of a deal and hope he figures it out.

 

Gallo scares the hell out of me. No thanks.

Count me in on this one! No doubt he has extreme power and will hit 40-50 HRs but that K rate is insane. He is still young so sure, he could improve his plate discipline but I get the feeling he's thinking about nothing besides hitting a homer every time he steps to the plate. He's just another Mark Reynolds as far as I'm concerned. Not like that is so bad but I'd rather have someone else be the centerpiece of a trade for luc.

Count me as three on this one.

 

I see his floor as a Mark Reynolds/Chris Carter/Russell Branyan type. If I am trading Lucroy, I want a player whose floor is more than those guys. Trading Lucroy is likely the last deal that could bring elite talent and while Gallo could be an elite talent, his floor scares me to death. I'll gladly sacrifice 10-20 of his 40+ HR if we can acquire a player who will also hit .280-.310.

[Austin Tatious]

Interesting third piece from Texas might be Josh Morgan. Keith Law reporting saying he is moving to catcher from infield.

 

See the link

 

[superfly]

Gallo is at the position of need for us. I'd take him as part of a deal and hope he figures it out.

 

Gallo scares the hell out of me. No thanks.

Count me in on this one! No doubt he has extreme power and will hit 40-50 HRs but that K rate is insane. He is still young so sure, he could improve his plate discipline but I get the feeling he's thinking about nothing besides hitting a homer every time he steps to the plate. He's just another Mark Reynolds as far as I'm concerned. Not like that is so bad but I'd rather have someone else be the centerpiece of a trade for luc.

 

 

If we weren't sooooooooooo deep at OF I would agree. The dearth of talent at 1B/3B is a serious issue going forward unless it is addressed.

 

OF - Braun, Davis are entrenched for some time barring a trade or serious injury.

 

Broxton, Liriano, Domingo Santana, Phillips, Clark, Tyrone Taylor, Coulter, Harrison, Reed, Roache. Phillips and Clark are what I would consider "great" prospects for us, Phillips will NEED a spot in the OF, and Clark probably will down the road too. Santana could well be starting soon, and we have Broxton & Liriano battling it out for CF out of the gate. Where the hell are all these guys going to play? Sure i'd take Brinson, hes a great prospect, but for crying out loud we have enough OF already. Not all of them will pan out, but there are several that will need a shot within 1-2 years at playing time.

 

There are zero (0) 3B in our top 30 prospects, and one 1B at the bottom of the list (Denson). This is the rare case where I would deal for a position of need and take a shot. Throw Peralta in there if it means getting another pretty good prospect, hell throw somebody else in too. 40HR 3rd basemen don't come around often, if he flames out so what? We traded a 30 year old Catcher for him who is on the verge of become Joe Mauer with his issues. He ain't 25 anymore folks, other than 2014 he's been a good catcher, not a great one.

[Kelbysdaddy]

I totally agree that we are stacked in the outfield and empty at 1B and 3B (unless you look at gatewood and Lara as 3B instead of ss, which I do) but IF we were to target Gallo, he'd be the only piece coming back. Very much a boom or bust move, if he strikes out 300 times a year and hits .210 people are going to complain about it being a terrible trade. I'd much rather take a guy like Miguel sano than Gallo.

[superfly]

I totally agree that we are stacked in the outfield and empty at 1B and 3B (unless you look at gatewood and Lara as 3B instead of ss, which I do) but IF we were to target Gallo, he'd be the only piece coming back. Very much a boom or bust move, if he strikes out 300 times a year and hits .210 people are going to complain about it being a terrible trade. I'd much rather take a guy like Miguel sano than Gallo.

 

Gallo struck out 50% of the time last season and still managed a .301 OBP. If he cuts that to even 30% of the time he's going to be more than adequate. He's already Mark Reynolds except he has 10 years to figure it out and be better than him.

 

Of course Miguel Sano is a better player/target at this moment, dude's going to be a perennial all-star. Give me a good reason why the Twins would trade him when they're coming out of a 5 or 6 year celler dweller and have nothing but blue skies ahead. I live in Twins territory....he ain't getting traded. Neither is Buxton.

[Jenkins5]

I could care less if we have 20 OF top prospects and zero 1B or 3B. That should not factor into the trades. You take best possible value with the most upside. If you have a log jam you then make more trades. Brinson is starting to look like he could be a star without the major bust concerns of Gallo. I would take Gallo if that is what is there but Brinson is the one I want. He offers so much more to his game. Defense, power, hit tool, can get on base, steal bases, and doesn't strike out at a 35-45% clip

[Yolk]

First, Joey Gallo is not a third baseman. Not a good one anyway. He'll almost surely be a corner outfielder because teams will want to use his arm at a position other than first base. Second, Joey Gallo will not be able to hit major league pitching with any consistency. The problem isn't all his approach as he's shown the ability to work counts and take walks. The problem is he has an incredibly difficult time making contact with pitches in the zone when he swings at them. I hate to hate on the guy but I just see him as the most overvalued "top" prospect in the game and I'm really hoping the Brewers stay away.

 

And, trading for a position of need right now is exactly the type of thing I hope we shy away from. A lot of good third basemen are former shortstops who either outgrow the position or hit enough to move over for another shortstop in the system.

[NievesNoNO]

The thing with Gallo is you'd have to believe that either:

1) He is THE exception, and could be successful with a contact rate that nobody else has made work.

2) He has the ability to improve ALOT on his contact %. Even the best recent high power low contact rate types have pretty much topped out at about 30% K rate in the minors.

[StearnsFTW]

I could care less if we have 20 OF top prospects and zero 1B or 3B. That should not factor into the trades. You take best possible value with the most upside. If you have a log jam you then make more trades. Brinson is starting to look like he could be a star without the major bust concerns of Gallo. I would take Gallo if that is what is there but Brinson is the one I want. He offers so much more to his game. Defense, power, hit tool, can get on base, steal bases, and doesn't strike out at a 35-45% clip

 

Yep.

 

This is it for me.