2016 HOF candidates (Griffey, Piazza voted in; post 30)

[SRB]

So the greatest player of all time (Barry Bonds) gets shut out again because everyone suspects he took PEDs, but Mike Piazza gets voted in? Oh brother. This entire exercise if just an embarrassment at this point.

[SRB]

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2008/0521/mlb_g_mpiazza_300.jpg

 

Just a normal looking guy, full of character and fitness.

[homer]

So the greatest player of all time (Barry Bonds) gets shut out again because everyone suspects he took PEDs, but Mike Piazza gets voted in? Oh brother. This entire exercise if just an embarrassment at this point.

 

Bonds admitted to taking steroids.

[Jenkins5]

Here was Tom's ballot:

 

Jeff Bagwell

Barry Bonds

Roger Clemens

Ken Griffey Jr.

Trevor Hoffman

Edgar Martinez

Mike Mussina

Mike Piazza

Tim Raines

Curt Schilling

 

He said he now draws the line at if a player had admitted PED use or not. Bonds & Clemens have not

[AKCheesehead]

Ruth I understand. No criteria had been firmly set and the number of eligible players was huge. If I asked people to name the top ten films of the last 50 years how many would be unanimous?

 

Using Ruth as an example to justify not voting for an obvious Hall of Famer is comparing apples to oranges.

 

I agree with you up to the point of his being the first class to be inducted, with no established criteria. But his persona and accomplishments were so far above and beyond anything baseball had ever seen up until that point. At the time he was inducted, he had 714 home runs, the next closest was Gehrig with 378. If somebody didn't vote for him, they must have been watching a different sport.

[SRB]

So the greatest player of all time (Barry Bonds) gets shut out again because everyone suspects he took PEDs, but Mike Piazza gets voted in? Oh brother. This entire exercise if just an embarrassment at this point.

 

Bonds admitted to taking steroids.

 

Not entirely correct. He admitted to using a substance that he did not know to be steroids. Sanctimonious lunatics attempted to convict him of perjury for lying about that, and failed.

[homer]

So the greatest player of all time (Barry Bonds) gets shut out again because everyone suspects he took PEDs, but Mike Piazza gets voted in? Oh brother. This entire exercise if just an embarrassment at this point.

 

Bonds admitted to taking steroids.

 

Not entirely correct. He admitted to using a substance that he did not know to be steroids. Sanctimonious lunatics attempted to convict him of perjury for lying about that, and failed.

 

"Barry Bonds admits using steroids during his baseball career, his lawyer told a jury Tuesday. The catch is that Bonds' personal trainer misled him into believing he was taking flax seed oil and arthritis cream.

 

''I know that doesn't make a great story,'' Allen Ruby said during his opening statement at the home run leader's perjury trial. ''But that's what happened.''

 

Assistant U.S. Attorney Matt Parrella called such claims ''ridiculous and unbelievable'' and portrayed Bonds as a liar during his first chance to present the government's position."

[SRB]

"Barry Bonds admits using steroids during his baseball career, his lawyer told a jury Tuesday. The catch is that Bonds' personal trainer misled him into believing he was taking flax seed oil and arthritis cream.

 

''I know that doesn't make a great story,'' Allen Ruby said during his opening statement at the home run leader's perjury trial. ''But that's what happened.''

 

Assistant U.S. Attorney Matt Parrella called such claims ''ridiculous and unbelievable'' and portrayed Bonds as a liar during his first chance to present the government's position."

 

See my post above...

[jerichoholicninja]

Here was Tom's ballot:

 

Jeff Bagwell

Barry Bonds

Roger Clemens

Ken Griffey Jr.

Trevor Hoffman

Edgar Martinez

Mike Mussina

Mike Piazza

Tim Raines

Curt Schilling

 

He said he now draws the line at if a player had admitted PED use or not. Bonds & Clemens have not

 

So would he have voted for admitted the spit ballers and ball-doctorers that are in the Hall? Writers need to get off their high horses and vote for stat lines, not the names attached to them.

[MrTPlush]

It will never fail to amaze me how many people get their panties in a bunch over a few people not voting for a guy with 99% of the vote...seriously does it even matter? Who the heck cares if a few guys opt to vote for someone who may need a boost and whatnot. At this point sooooo many guys have never gotten 100% of the vote to even get it now wouldn't be some banner achievement. Just seems incredibly stupid that countless people flip out and there are article on the topic. He got in and on first ballot. No difference between 75% and 100%...nothing.

[jjgott]

It will never fail to amaze me how many people get their panties in a bunch over a few people not voting for a guy with 99% of the vote...seriously does it even matter? Who the heck cares if a few guys opt to vote for someone who may need a boost and whatnot. At this point sooooo many guys have never gotten 100% of the vote to even get it now wouldn't be some banner achievement. Just seems incredibly stupid that countless people flip out and there are article on the topic. He got in and on first ballot. No difference between 75% and 100%...nothing.

 

At least for me, it's not that I am outraged they didn't vote Griffey in with 100% of the vote, it's just asinine that some voters feel they have an obligation to not allow someone in with 100% because Ruth didn't get in with 100%. Goes along with the whole "unwritten rules" of baseball thing. Sometimes this sport and its media take themselves WAY too seriously.

[Bikeage77]

I think it's ridiculous that writers won't vote for one guy because they know they will get in to give another guy a "push." How can anyone deny Griffey being a HOFer. That's my gripe, vote for the best candidates, don't vote to do someone else a favor.

 

If it were up to me, you'd get less than 10 votes and guys could stay on for 5 years. This campaigning to get into the HOF business is a joke. What makes you a HOFer in year 9 or 10 when you weren't one in year one or two? That's what drives me nuts about the voting process. The stats haven't changed over that time, they were either good enough when they retired or they weren't, it shouldn't take a writer 9 years for them to change over their vote.

 

At the same time I don't necessarily think there are any players in the Hall that shouldn't be in, so maybe the process works (Around 1.5% of all players make it) but guys would get in faster, there would be more filtering, and less debate.

[Outlander]

If the writer knows it is a slam dunk than the writer isn't denying Griffey in this case from being a HOFer. Players stats don't change but it doesn't mean the player shouldn't get elected. It has been a number of years now where more than ten should be elected so it makes complete sense that certain players are not going to be elected. Certain hall of famers that are in the elite class like Griffey or Maddux are going to be bumped to the front of the line but the others have to wait their turn because there are so many hall of fame players on the ballot recently and the PED/steroid issue has made it worse.

[pacopete4]

They have a simple job. Vote the players who are most deserving in. That includes Griffey. If they didn't vote for him, they didn't do their jobs correctly. The rest is a bunch of hooey.

[And That]

It's not like if they want to give another guy a push, they can't also vote for Griffey.

[sveumrules]

I think it's ridiculous that writers won't vote for one guy because they know they will get in to give another guy a "push." How can anyone deny Griffey being a HOFer. That's my gripe, vote for the best candidates, don't vote to do someone else a favor.

 

If it were up to me, you'd get less than 10 votes and guys could stay on for 5 years. This campaigning to get into the HOF business is a joke. What makes you a HOFer in year 9 or 10 when you weren't one in year one or two? That's what drives me nuts about the voting process. The stats haven't changed over that time, they were either good enough when they retired or they weren't, it shouldn't take a writer 9 years for them to change over their vote.

 

At the same time I don't necessarily think there are any players in the Hall that shouldn't be in, so maybe the process works (Around 1.5% of all players make it) but guys would get in faster, there would be more filtering, and less debate.

 

With the current backlog of worthy candidates I'd be strongly against lowering the number of players a writer can vote for or the number of years a player can stay on the ballot. If anything the writers should be able to vote for as many players as they feel are deserving, imposing an arbitrary limit only exasperates the current situation.

 

I also don't think that most of the writers are changing over their vote when they vote for someone in later years that they didn't vote for the first time around. For instance, I think there are 19* players on the ballot in 2017 that deserve to be in the Hall based on the standards established by the players already elected. I would only be able to vote for 10 of those 19 players. If at some point in the future I voted for one of the nine deserving players I left off in 2017, it wouldn't be because my opinion changed on that player it would be because the politics of the balloting system finally allowed me to put that player in my top 10.

 

*Bonds, Clemens, Mussina, Schilling, Bagwell, Walker, Manny, Raines, I-ROD, Edgar, Sheff, Vlad, Sosa, Kent, McGriff, Posada, Lee Smith, Trevor Hoffman & Billy Wagner.

[LouisEly]

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2008/0521/mlb_g_mpiazza_300.jpg

 

Just a normal looking guy, full of character and fitness.

I think that's a little different than this:

 

http://coedmagazine.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/barry-bonds-after.jpg

 

http://coedmagazine.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/barry-after.jpg?w=628&h=451

 

Lots of guys in baseball have big forearms - you need strong forearms to swing a bat with power - but you don't see Piazza with the biceps, neck, and traps that Bonds had.

[AKCheesehead]

Hardest hit ball I ever saw in person was a double from Bonds at Miller Park. I'd say at the most it got about 10-12 feet up and blasted the wall in right center. The thing darn near looked to have a vapor trail behind it.

[502 to Right]

I think the writer's HOF voting should be one year only. No limit on the number you can vote for--vote for as many newly eligible players as you want. Anyone who doesn't get in during year 1 goes to the veteran's committee.