Far Out Idea- new expansion team w/ a twist

[Crash2303]

I want to take a step farther from a question explored in this forum here:

http://forum.brewerfan.net/viewtopic.php?f=64&t=33479

 

I think it would be interesting to have a AAAA Traveling All-Star Team play against MLB teams during the regular season. before I get blasted for an idea I don't know if I even would advocate for, hear out the idea.

 

IDEA

* 25 man roster (with 15 guys on stand by) composed of anyone not on a MLB 25 man roster

* the team would play 120 games (comparable to the minor league season) playing each MLB team once, in a 4 game series

* the team would be a traveling team, meaning every game they would be the away team.

* each player would be a rental property of the AAAA team, in which their home team could recall them at any time at need.

 

BENEFITS

* this team would give additional players major league experience and an extended opportunity for teams to see if their player can play at that level. it is hard for some players getting limited playing time- PH duties or relief opportunities on short, short leashes, potentially giving teams stronger assets and players opportunities to be "known"

 

DOWNSIDE

* inflated MLB statistics playing against this lower echelon team, but actually how is that bad? fans will love that.

* this would essentially be an expansion team. but, instead of watering down the entire league with an extra guy or two on everyone's roster that doesn't get to play that much, who would normally be in the minors- teams can instead still hold those players, but give them actual playing time to see if they are better than what they've got. however, some cities would be upset at being passed over for a home team & the lost economic benefit that would come from that.

 

ROSTER CRITERIA

* not on another 25 man roster

* must be 27 years old or over (the age limit is in place to ensure that "prospects" are not included on this team, because teams will prefer to develop them themselves)

* each player would have an opportunity to decline the invitation

* can't have more than 2 players from same team

* ineligible if you have more than (positional players) 600 PA, (pitchers) 30 GS or 60 game appearances (these restrictions are to ensure that guys like Randy Wolf who have had extensive major league careers, but are now in the minors are not included, but just guys who "haven't had a chance" or are late bloomers)

* because of the potential of high turnover rates, there would be 15 players put on "stand by" that could be 'called up' to fill spots as needed- similar to a 40 man roster.

 

PRECEDENT & SUMMARY

* this is not unprecedented. The NBA D-League used to have a team called the D-League Select, which was comprised of guys not on NBA rosters (mostly non-prospects) who could still play and compete in the league (see Brian Butch). The difference is that in the NBA- team success is heavily weighted to impact players, because of the fewer players on the court and the amount of usage they receive. in baseball, this is less of a factor as one player (outside of starting pitchers), have similarly weighted opportunities for impact.

* I think you would see a few players make a mark and earn contributing MLB roster spots each season. In addition, I think this team would be competitive. it may not win a ton of games, but i think its range would be a 60-80 win team every year.

[reillymcshane]

Biggest issue (I see) is scheduling. Baseball already goes into late October, and teams already play 6 days a week. Adding four games into the schedule would be an issue.

 

Plus another team gives you 31 teams to schedule. This means on any given day a team cannot be playing - I'm sure this would cause some serious issues for the schedulers.

[pacopete4]

I read this and I'm not even sure what to even think other than... why? It just seems to serve very little purpose.

[jerichoholicninja]

I read this and I'm not even sure what to even think other than... why? It just seems to serve very little purpose.

 

This. I've always thought a traveling minor league team of free agents would be a good idea. Guys aren't signed to an organization but still get the opportunity to play. Sort of like the NBA's D-League.

[Crash2303]

the scheduling and standings would be obstacles, but as far as I see it, you don't add them, you insert them within the existing schedule- so each team would play 1 less Major League team/year and instead would play the AAAA Team. not sure how it'd work for standings other than maybe the AAAA team would not be included, but the wins/losses of other teams would be.

[BrewersSuperCollector]

I read this and I'm not even sure what to even think other than... why? It just seems to serve very little purpose.

 

This. I've always thought a traveling minor league team of free agents would be a good idea. Guys aren't signed to an organization but still get the opportunity to play. Sort of like the NBA's D-League.

 

 

They already have this. It's called the Independent League.

[jerichoholicninja]

I read this and I'm not even sure what to even think other than... why? It just seems to serve very little purpose.

 

This. I've always thought a traveling minor league team of free agents would be a good idea. Guys aren't signed to an organization but still get the opportunity to play. Sort of like the NBA's D-League.

 

 

They already have this. It's called the Independent League.

 

Except the talent level is so much lower than affiliated ball. A guy like Jim Henderson could sign a minor league deal with some team and never get called up because they don't have a need for him, regardless of how well he pitches. Or he could play for the AAA "Free Agent" team and be signed by any organization when they need a BP arm.

[Bombers]

All you need to do is follow the money. This team won't have any this MLB doesn't have any incentive. The expansion idea of expanding to Mexico City is the best idea I have heard. The whole country would become an instant fan and you would be placing a team in a city the size of New York City. If Mexico City got a team their fan base would be enormous.

[MrTPlush]

1. Minor League teams would be infuriated if you take their top players that bring fans to the park.

 

2. If my players is going to face MLB teams why don't I just put them on my team? Maybe you are contending and want to get their feet wet when you don't have a spot for them...but even then, why?

 

3. Scheduling would be very hard. Teams would not appreciate the heavily shuffling of that team. The talent level would varying a lot. Probably a good team to play in September when a lot of that top talent goes to the actual MLB team.

 

EDIT: You can disagree without being condescending.

[Crash2303]

a clarification- they wouldn't be "Free Agents"- instead they would be under contract with a home MLB team, and rented out to the AAAA team, but would be available to that team at any time if needed.

 

1. Minor League teams would be infuriated if you take their top players that bring fans to the park.

 

2. If my players is going to face MLB teams why don't I just put them on my team? Maybe you are contending and want to get their feet wet when you don't have a spot for them...but even then, why?

 

3. Scheduling would be very hard. Teams would not appreciate the heavily shuffling of that team. The talent level would varying a lot. Probably a good team to play in September when a lot of that top talent goes to the actual MLB team.

 

RE:

1) good point, but I think infuriated would be a strong word. teams would be limited to 2 players max eligible for the MLB team. for local reference, it would have been guys like Ben Guez or Jaye Chapman. Not sure that they are singularly bringing in large contingency of fans. I think fans are mostly excited about seeing up and coming prospects, who would not be eligible for the AAAA Traveling Team. but, you are right that it would potentially exclude 1-2 of the more productive players on a team.

 

2) this was covered a bit above, but over the past few seasons, in addition to the two mentioned above, think about brewer minor leaguers like Brendan Katin, Matt Clark, Eugenio Velez, Mat Gamel, Brad Mills, Michael Blazek, Hiram Burgos, Preston Guilmet. these were/are players who excelled at AAA, but were blocked by guys who beat them out in spring training or who aren't on the 40 man roster, making their promotion logistically difficult and test them out against major league competition. some may shown that they truly were AAAA players (aka unable to produce at the MLB level), but perhaps others like I hope Guez and Chapman will prove someday that they are capable big league players. but, both are unlikely to get that shot, because they are blocked at their positions and are not up and coming young prospects with longer leashes. it would be valuable for a team to test guys like them out against MLB competition and see what they in fact have- and might after a couple months choose them over someone who is on the roster, or dish them off in a trade.

 

I think about guys like Katin, who before all his knee issues, continued to dominate the PCL, but there were concerns over his "long swing" and felt that he would be exposed at the MLB level. maybe the administration was right or maybe he could have provided a year or two of solid production. we'll never know. of course his knee ended that possibility regardless.

 

guys in this position must wait for a plague of injuries or get on a hot streak during their PH duties before a team will play them extensively. this is a good filter that has worked the majority of the time, but there are bound to be a handful of players whose careers never flourished, because they never really got the chance. evidence of this is through some "AAAA" players who finally did get that chance due to a variety of circumstances and found some MLB success: ex. Steve Pearce, Bryan LaHair, Grant Balfour, Brandon Moss, Justin Ruggiano, Dan Johnson.

 

This hypothetical AAAA team would obviously benefit the players, but also benefits the teams, who are able to "discover" players they have and add their production to their team. win-win.

 

3) again- not sure how scheduling would work, but I'm guessing it would be mid-April-August, giving teams time to set their rosters and then time to add them if desire to the expanded rosters in September.

[Crash2303]

All you need to do is follow the money. This team won't have any this MLB doesn't have any incentive. The expansion idea of expanding to Mexico City is the best idea I have heard. The whole country would become an instant fan and you would be placing a team in a city the size of New York City. If Mexico City got a team their fan base would be enormous.

 

this is probably the biggest argument against the Traveling AAAA team. Money. although it would be good for the players and teams, there isn't a real incentive for the league. whereas mexico city has obvious global incentives $$$.

[Crash2303]

oh well- its fun for me to think about, but I'm still left wondering about the hypothetical question: the minor league (non-prospect) field vs major league teams- how would they do? one could say it would be a team of replacement level players- although technically true- I think they would perform better, because they are the cream of the crop of "replacement players". so, what's the over/under on the avg. amount of games they might win per season (if they played 162)?

[MrTPlush]

Wow I missed the 27 or older requirement. Assuming it is just old prospects I think that team losses at least 120 games. What exactly is going to propel them to wins? The pitching rotation would be historically horrible, the line up would have nothing good, and the bullpen would be below average at best. The offense would be lucky to average a few runs a game. The pitching staff won't be able to win when they only score 2-3 runs a game if that.

 

I also think(being a stat geek) that it would really mess with some historical things. I would not be surprised if in 120 games that team isn't no hit/perfect gamed multiple times. Wouldn't be a fan of pitchers getting achievements that way.

 

I give you credit for writing that up. That is pretty crazy and technically doable somehow. It might not make sense, but interesting none the less. Now I can fantasize about a real Chicago Scrubs team.

[502 to Right]

Such a team already exists. In basketball. They're called the Washington Generals and they play the Harlem Globetrotters.

[JohnBriggs12]

How about dividing teams into a premier and major divisions ala soccer? Last place team in premier league gets relegated to major division the next year and first place team in major division moves up.

[MrTPlush]

How about dividing teams into a premier and major divisions ala soccer? Last place team in premier league gets relegated to major division the next year and first place team in major division moves up.

 

We already have this it is called A,A+, AA, etc. Sure the teams themselves can't move, but it is that general system.

 

If you are trying to say lets split up the teams into two leagues where one plays for the World Series and the other doesn't there is no way. Fan interest would plummet for half the teams. People want to watch there team play for a World Series and face the top talent. I don't want to watch the Brewers play the Phillies all the time. That would be painfully boring. Most importantly what if we are in the lesser league in 2011 and win 97 games? You are trying to tell me we don't get to play for the world series, but next year when we aren't good anymore we can?

[clancyphile]

You know, travelling AAAA teams might not be a bad idea.

 

Call it six teams, owned by MLB. The teams would have 30-man rosters. Each MLB team could put three players on that roster (so a AAAA team would have 15 players from a MLB system, and 15 free agents). A player that a MLB team assigns to a AAAA team would be protected from the Rule V draft, and assignment to a AAAA team would also enable a team to keep a Rule V pick.

 

You could play the games in the MLB stadiums - assign a AAAA team to five MLB teams, and they play their home games as MLB stadiums that are vacant because the MLB club is on a road trip.

[Outlander]

It is kind of a far out idea but in theory I could perhaps see it happen. It would certainly appease the union adding 25 additional major league jobs. The scheduling could be an issue but maybe it can be seen as built in bye days for each team. With an odd number of teams each team would get an additional 4 days off, maybe during the May - early September time period. I don't know if it would work to have players affiliated with teams as I think it could impact the integrity of the game for example if Matt Clark was batting against the Brewers in a close game last year or Jim Henderson is trying to close out a game. Maybe MLB would force teams to release players if they have an opportunity to play for this team or the team could protect a certain amount of players who meet the criteria. Also have to give the GM of this team flexibility to remove players who are not producing and I don't know if the 15 reserve players would be enough over the course of the season. Perhaps once September rolls around all players on the AAAA team have an opportunity to latch on with a MLB team for the playoff stretch and could be eligible to be added to the playoff roster.

[MrTPlush]

There is no way MLB would add 4 more games each and 4 off days. That would add 8 days to the season. They don't want the season lasting another second let alone over a week longer.

[reillymcshane]

Such a team already exists. In basketball. They're called the Washington Generals and they play the Harlem Globetrotters.

The Globetrotters dropped the Generals as their primary opponent a couple of months ago.

 

http://espn.go.com/espn/story/_/id/13433859/harlem-globetrotters-drop-washington-generals-primary-opponent

[645]

Never work,

 

1) without a home base travel would be a killer

 

2) Doubleheaders, The only way they could make scheduling work is if they schedule 4 Doubleheaders for each team and I don't think that is going to fly too well.