Lind, Lucroy, K-Rod available (as per Olney)

[MrTPlush]

Is Schwaber not a good catcher? Why don't the Cubs just catch him?

 

The main problem is the fact his bat was so advanced it was ready in a year. Obviously learning how to catch at the pro level takes years. He is not a good enough catcher to throw back there at the MLB level...at least not if you are the competing Cubs. I guess a team like the Brewers could let him butcher it back there at the MLB level trying to learn it, but that would be quite the task. Not to mention before being called up this year he was only throwing out 18% of runners...yikes.

 

Realistically I don't think being a catcher is in his future. The Cubs still say they would like to put him back there, but I doubt it is worth it to them and probably any other team.

[jerichoholicninja]

Is Schwaber not a good catcher? Why don't the Cubs just catch him?

 

He's terrible. Imagine Yuni B trying to catch.

[JohnBriggs12]

Cubs aren't going to deal Schwarber, period. His bat is off the charts. He's right up there with the best young power bats I've ever seen. I was too young to see a young Eddie Mathews, but Mathews was getting compared to the Babe. He's not a good outfielder but there have been a lot worse.

[SRB]

The Chicago-helium going into the Schwarber hype is hilarious. Eddie Mathews???? Excuse me for being skeptical about a guy with a 30% K-rate (even in the minors).

 

Yankees prospects used to be hyped like this, now it's the Cubs I guess.

[anglotiger]

There are SO MANY reasons to trade Lucroy now. Only reason not to is if they just are getting low ball offers. His value will never get higher...never.

 

I am not necessarily disagreeing with you, but think about this - if you are correct that his value will never get higher, what makes you think that the GMs around MLB aren't aware of this too and aren't making low-ball offers?

[Jenkins5]

Because with his contract & production, they now there is no way to get him unless they pay up. Brewers are playing the unmotivated card. Can't low ball a team who is just as happy to keep the guy...or at least they say they are.

[anglotiger]

Because with his contract & production, they now there is no way to get him unless they pay up. Brewers are playing the unmotivated card. Can't low ball a team who is just as happy to keep the guy...or at least they say they are.

 

I would buy that if his offensive production in 2015 wasn't so much lower in 2015 than it was in 2014.

 

The comment I was responding to said:

 

His value will never get higher...never.

 

So my question stands... if his value will never get higher, why wouldn't the GMs out there know this and adjust offers down accordingly?

[Jenkins5]

Once Lucroy came back in June from all the injuries, he hit like Lucroy. Post All-Star he was .289/.347/ .461/ .808 OPS

 

But I get what you mean by questioning the "ever" remark

[pacopete4]

Lucroy could be a franchise changing trade, especially if paired with a pitcher like Peralta or Smith.

[TooLiveBrew]

Lucs value isn't going to change between now and July 31 baring an injury.

 

This is our last big tradeable asset. Let's not mess this up. I want a Shelby Miller haul or we can play Luc at 1B if we have to.

I agree that his value isn't likely to change by the trade deadline, but the market for him will almost certainly shrink. In the offseason, you're almost always going to have more clubs building to 'win now' than you will mid-summer.

[sheetskout]

I agree that his value isn't likely to change by the trade deadline, but the market for him will almost certainly shrink. In the offseason, you're almost always going to have more clubs building to 'win now' than you will mid-summer.

 

I couldn't agree more here. All you have to look at regarding the catching market is the qualifying offer handed to Matt Wieters and the early deals done for Iannetta, Flowers, Bethancourt, Ryan-Murphy etc. There is an absolute urgency when dealing for a catcher and especially so when dealing for your starter.

 

No team in their right mind contending for a playoff spot is going to disrupt their organization and pitching staff by having to acclimate a new catcher into their system at the trade deadline. At least, without checking I would imagine it's super-rare.

 

There's also no guarantee that there would be a suitable situation for Lucroy to be traded into AT ALL pre-trade-deadline. At least you know what you're playing with pre-season.

[trwi7]

Is Schwaber not a good catcher? Why don't the Cubs just catch him?

 

I took this picture mainly to show how bad of a hitter Segura is but it also shows how bad of a catcher Schwarber is.

 

http://i.imgur.com/Aagh1Zw.jpg

[trwi7]

Lucs value isn't going to change between now and July 31 baring an injury.

 

This is our last big tradeable asset. Let's not mess this up. I want a Shelby Miller haul or we can play Luc at 1B if we have to.

I agree that his value isn't likely to change by the trade deadline, but the market for him will almost certainly shrink. In the offseason, you're almost always going to have more clubs building to 'win now' than you will mid-summer.

 

Not only that but teams likely don't want a new catcher to have to learn their pitching staff midseason. I'm not sure how much of an adjustment there is but it's there and teams really seem to want to avoid that if at all possible.

 

Also, what would happen if Lucroy were to struggle out of the gate again next year? He hit .133/.216/.178 before getting hurt. He came back and hit .278/.319/.352 in June. Better but nothing that says top 5 catcher on a bargain contract. He looked more like Lucroy in July hitting .283/.350/.424 but that only brought his season line to .253/.311/.347 at the trade deadline. Once again, not a top 5 catcher on a bargain contract.

 

If that happens again, teams aren't going to offer the kind of value we want, in which case we either trade him for less than we could have this winter, most likely or we have to keep him and hope he heats up through the rest of the season so we can trade him in the winter when he only has a year of control remaining.

[MrTPlush]

There are SO MANY reasons to trade Lucroy now. Only reason not to is if they just are getting low ball offers. His value will never get higher...never.

 

I am not necessarily disagreeing with you, but think about this - if you are correct that his value will never get higher, what makes you think that the GMs around MLB aren't aware of this too and aren't making low-ball offers?

 

The thing is the value mid season won't be there. The amount of suitors will be lower and teams won't be as motivated putting in a catcher in the middle of the season with the pitchers. So if teams consider Lucroy much like his 2014 I see no reason this is his values high point. Even if he absolutely crushes this year suddenly you only get one year not two...big decline in value I don't care what kind of season he has. Then if he ends up having a down season suddenly you are looking at something close to what Gomez got. Not a bad deal by any means, but no where near what we "should" get now.

 

GMs know this is his values peak, but it is also the highest value for them too.

[CheeseheadInQC]

Just tossing this out there, but who says no: Lucroy to the Cubs for Torres, Contreras, Cease and de la Cruz.

 

Brewers pros: Upside. Four BA top 10 for the Cubs including Nos. 1 and 2, plus two higher upside pitchers. Plus, Contreras fills an organizational hole. Cons: Risk. Contreras is a bit of a one-year wonder and the rest likely would likely start the season in BC or Wisconsin.

 

Cubs pros: Get Lucroy without giving up any of their young big leaguers, leaving them more guys who can contribute this year, or widening the scope of their possibilities for trading for another starter (a contender is more likely to deal a young starter for Baez or Soler because they can help immediately).

Cons: Lot of top prospects and giving up two higher upside pitching prospects, even if they are a ways away, hurts given that might be one of their few organizational weaknesses.

[1992casey]

Not only that but teams likely don't want a new catcher to have to learn their pitching staff midseason. I'm not sure how much of an adjustment there is but it's there and teams really seem to want to avoid that if at all possible.

It's been documented here somewhere. A starting catcher is very unlikely to change teams mid-season.

[yfinn6]

Is Schwaber not a good catcher? Why don't the Cubs just catch him?

 

I took this picture mainly to show how bad of a hitter Segura is but it also shows how bad of a catcher Schwarber is.

 

http://i.imgur.com/Aagh1Zw.jpg

 

Classic Segura. Probably had a hitter's count, too.

[MrTPlush]

Is Schwaber not a good catcher? Why don't the Cubs just catch him?

 

I took this picture mainly to show how bad of a hitter Segura is but it also shows how bad of a catcher Schwarber is.

 

http://i.imgur.com/Aagh1Zw.jpg

 

Classic Segura. Probably had a hitter's count, too.

 

Segura? Hitters count? He swings at the first pitch non stop. Not possible.

[jerichoholicninja]

Is Schwaber not a good catcher? Why don't the Cubs just catch him?

 

I took this picture mainly to show how bad of a hitter Segura is but it also shows how bad of a catcher Schwarber is.

 

http://i.imgur.com/Aagh1Zw.jpg

 

Classic Segura. Probably had a hitter's count, too.

 

I imagine that ump is hoping he remembered to put his cup in before the game.

[trwi7]

You guys had me curious so I looked it up. It was an 0-2 count and he actually hit that ball.

[yfinn6]

 

Classic Segura. Probably had a hitter's count, too.

 

Segura? Hitters count? He swings at the first pitch non stop. Not possible.

 

http://www.bleachernation.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/jim-mora-playoffs.jpg

[CheezWizHed]

You guys had me curious so I looked it up. It was an 0-2 count and he actually hit that ball.

 

What was the result?

[Mass Haas]

It's complicated: Brewers in tough spot with possible trade of Lucroy

By Jeff Sullivan, FanGraphs

[3and2Fastball]

It's complicated: Brewers in tough spot with possible trade of Lucroy

By Jeff Sullivan, FanGraphs

 

 

That's a great article, thanks for posting. I would imagine many of us (including myself), are overestimating the trade value of Lucroy

[pacopete4]

It's complicated: Brewers in tough spot with possible trade of Lucroy

By Jeff Sullivan, FanGraphs

 

 

That's a great article, thanks for posting. I would imagine many of us (including myself), are overestimating the trade value of Lucroy

 

 

Another case as to why he might need to paired with another player like Smith or Peralta.