Brewers Have Their New Pitching Coach - Cubs' Minor League Pitching Coordinator Derek Johnson

[Mass Haas]

Brewers Have Their New Pitching Coach - Cubs' Minor League Pitching Coordinator Derek Johnson

 

Or so say the unofficial reports amongst Cubs' bloggers --

 

MLB.com featured him in March 2013 after he was brought in following a long run at Vanderbilt

[brewmann04]

Young Coach for the projected Young Rotation I like it.

[jerichoholicninja]

I wonder if a guy like him would be better suited for coaching in the lower minors. Vanderbilt has had some great pitchers come out of there during his tenure and I feel like the job of a big league pitching coach is more about developing a game plan for each opponent than developing, which it seems like is his strength. I'm not opposed to it I just feel he's strengths would probably be best utilized in the minors. I understand there will be a young rotation and more young guys to come and that's probably their thinking as well.

[Brewer Fever]

Coaching pitchers in the minors is what he's been doing and doing well. The Brewers obviously feel he's ready for the next step. Talented coaches don't stay coaching in the minors their whole career.

[markedman5]

Confirmed by Cubs beat writer.....

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Carrie MuskatVerified account

‏@CarrieMuskat

Good luck to Derek Johnson, #Cubs minor league pitching coordinator, who is joining Brewers big league staff

[ZBTMP]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/going-low-and-away-with-the-brewers/

 

In the past the Brewers have had a very distinct pitching philosophy. How much of that is set by the Major League pitching coach, I don't know? Im not a pitching savant and low and away doesn't sound like a bad place to live, but you'd also like your 26 yo/mid 90's starter to to have a k rate greater than 5.0 k/9. Will be interesting to see how much changes and how the pitcher results change moving forward....

[Brewer Fever]

Only six teams had their starters pitch to more contact than the Brewers last year, so maybe the team just values weak contact over strikeouts.

 

Low and away is great in theory but doesn't jive with the Brewers organizational lack of emphasis on defense nor their focus on drafting power arms. Why teach your pitchers to pitch to contact and then on the other hand continue to draft all-hit no defense positional players? And why stress velocity in accumulating pitchers only to teach them an approach that lessens their ability to get swings and misses?

 

I look forward to the new regime having more well connected philosophy.

[JohnBriggs12]

Young Coach for the projected Young Rotation I like it.

 

Other than Kyle Hendricks, name a pitcher that the Cubs developed in his tenure that's made an impact?

 

Their bullpen was all castoffs from other organizations.

[JohnBriggs12]

Coaching pitchers in the minors is what he's been doing and doing well. The Brewers obviously feel he's ready for the next step. Talented coaches don't stay coaching in the minors their whole career.

 

There's no evidence that your statement is true. Cubs are sorely lacking in home grown pitching. The Brewers have better depth in minor league arms than the Cubs have.

[monty57]

I feel like the job of a big league pitching coach is more about developing a game plan for each opponent than developing

 

and

 

Talented coaches don't stay coaching in the minors their whole career.

 

...are both true, but seem to be almost contradictory.

 

As valuable as young pitching is, it seems to me that the most important pitching coaches are the ones in the lower minors. Since businesses pay their more important employees more money, it would seem logical to pay the guys developing the young guys into major leaguers more than you pay the guy who's biggest task is occasionally walking slowly to the mound to give the reliever more time to warm up.

 

I would think that developing a game plan is mostly done by the advance scouts, so the major league pitching coach just doesn't seem all that important unless he has the bigger task of managing the minor league coaches and telling them how he wants the youngsters coached.

[JohnBriggs12]

Lets face it. They went the cheap route here. Got to believe he's going to be paid at the bottom rung of major league pitching coaches. He's got zero track record at the major league level. Kind of disturbing when you think now the GM, manager and the pitching coach are all learning on the job.

[CheezWizHed]

Lets face it. They went the cheap route here. Got to believe he's going to be paid at the bottom rung of major league pitching coaches. He's got zero track record at the major league level. Kind of disturbing when you think now the GM, manager and the pitching coach are all learning on the job.

 

[sarcasm]You kids get off my lawn! [/sarcasm]

 

Isn't a fresh look what people wanted rather than retreads? He has 11 years at Vandy plus 3 in the Cubs minor leagues. Are they going cheap or being innovative? Seems like they are going for new perspectives, no matter how you look at it.

 

So I guess we will see how much coaches really matter anyway.

[brewmann04]

Young Coach for the projected Young Rotation I like it.

 

Other than Kyle Hendricks, name a pitcher that the Cubs developed in his tenure that's made an impact?

 

Their bullpen was all castoffs from other organizations.

 

I not sure I just like the idea of Younger coach handling a younger staff

[JimH5]

I guess it's as fine a pick as any.

 

Young, inexperienced guy looking to make a name for himself. The risk is that he's so outside the box that he ends up causing injuries, but he doesn't have that reputation, so, taking him from a division rival is good.

[Jenkins5]

Lets face it. They went the cheap route here. Got to believe he's going to be paid at the bottom rung of major league pitching coaches. He's got zero track record at the major league level. Kind of disturbing when you think now the GM, manager and the pitching coach are all learning on the job.

 

I strongly disagree that this had anything to do with money. He is a young guy with vision, he's considered to be a pitching guru, and has built a strong track record for producing great results! He can flat out coach! He has been highly sought out for years.

 

The Cubs were able to lure Derek Johnson from Vanderbilt, where he had been a successful pitching coach for 11 seasons, and hire him as their Minor League pitching coordinator. Several other Major League teams pursued Johnson, who won National Pitching Coach of the Year honors in 2004 and was named top assistant coach of the year in '10

.

 

n 2003, he began a streak of 10 consecutive years with having at least one pitcher drafted. Vanderbilt has had 32 pitchers drafted during Johnson's tenure and six first-round draft picks (four in the top eight picks), including David Price, who was a No. 1 overall pick in June 2007.

 

Johnson's other first-rounders are Jeremy Sowers (2004), Casey Weathers (2007), Mike Minor (2009), Sonny Gray (2011) and Grayson Garvin (2011). Jensen Lewis, a third-round pick in 2005, joins Sowers, Price and Minor as Johnson's pupils to reach the majors.

 

The second thing was the vision. After I came for the interview, the vision I saw from [president of baseball operations] Theo [Epstein] and [general manager] Jed [Hoyer] and the ownership, it was a situation for me where it's like, if I'm going to make a leap into the next phase of your life, you'd want to do it with guys who were around you like that.

 

Brewers are all about the vision for the future. They are bringing guys all who are all young with strong vision and are extremely passionate and highly regarded. More so, the coaches so far all are teachers of the game (Sedar, Cobbs, Johnson Pat Murphy (if he does come) all were minor league and/or college colleges who just know the game and how to develop) for Stearns, Counsell, Arnold.... and the guys they kept around in front office, are all highly regarded, young, rising stars/future GMs.

[MNBrew]

Brewers are all about the vision for the future. They are bringing guys all who are all young with strong vision and are extremely passionate and highly regarded. More so, the coaches so far all are teachers of the game (Sedar, Cobbs, Johnson Pat Murphy (if he does come) all were minor league and/or college colleges who just know the game and how to develop) for Stearns, Counsell, Arnold.... and the guys they kept around in front office, are all highly regarded, young, rising stars/future GMs.

Is this supposed to be Coles?

[QuevedosTongue]

I don't understand people not liking this hire, when they don't really know anything about this guy. And focusing on the negatives seems shortsighted. Maybe this will turn out to be a great hire, maybe not, but none of us have a clue right now.

 

And the idea that Stearns and Johnson are 'learning on the job' is silly, it's not like they plucked them off the street. These guys have both been in the industry and worked in their respective specialties for years. For both the promotions are the obvious next step in their careers and the Brewers certainly hope both are ready. They may end up being the wrong hires, but I applaud the Brewers for hiring people that aren't 'old school' retreads.

[brewmann04]

I AGREE no one really knows what to expect lets hope he get the Young arms to become better pitchers.

[JohnBriggs12]

I don't understand people not liking this hire, when they don't really know anything about this guy. And focusing on the negatives seems shortsighted. Maybe this will turn out to be a great hire, maybe not, but none of us have a clue right now.

 

And the idea that Stearns and Johnson are 'learning on the job' is silly, it's not like they plucked them off the street. These guys have both been in the industry and worked in their respective specialties for years. For both the promotions are the obvious next step in their careers and the Brewers certainly hope both are ready. They may end up being the wrong hires, but I applaud the Brewers for hiring people that aren't 'old school' retreads.

 

You're right and it could turn out to be a great hire. But there's an awful lot of inexperience at the top right now, starting with a 30 year old GM. Youth and energy is a great thing, don't get me wrong, but mixing in someone with a record of accomplishment in one of the major areas of responsibility might be a good idea. Derek Johnson might have been great at preparing college age pitchers, but the major leagues is a whole different deal. I'd prefer having a guy that knows what it's like to stand on a mound in front of 40,000 people and face major league hitters. You don't reinvent the wheel for guys who've made it to the big leagues. They know what it took them to get here. I'd prefer a guy who's can keep a pitcher's head right more than anything.

[ZBTMP]

You don't reinvent the wheel for guys who've made it to the big leagues. They know what it took them to get here. I'd prefer a guy who's can keep a pitcher's head right more than anything.

 

It might not be "reinventing the wheel", but we sure do need someone who can retool arms. Its clear our divisional rivals (superiors) are kicking out butts at this. Their pitching coaches are doing more than keeping their heads right...

Cubs: Arrieta, Hammel, Feldman, Dempster (revived under Bosio), Rondon (rule 5 selection)

Pirates: Burnett, Liriano, Volquez, Grilli, Melancon

Cardinals: Lackey, Lohse, Westbrook, I don't really feel like looking up the rest of their devil magic...

 

All these players where bought/acquired low or for nothing and made highly productive. And we keep throwing the little money we have at over-priced mid level free agents hoping they continue to give us 2.0 WAR seasons. Since the start of the 2009 season we've scored the 3rd most runs in the NL. Unfortunately we've also allowed the 3rd most. We need a pitching visionary and development strategy throughout the organization not some retread who has experience making a slow walk to the mound in front of 40,000 people.

[JohnBriggs12]

You don't reinvent the wheel for guys who've made it to the big leagues. They know what it took them to get here. I'd prefer a guy who's can keep a pitcher's head right more than anything.

 

It might not be "reinventing the wheel", but we sure do need someone who can retool arms. Its clear our divisional rivals (superiors) are kicking out butts at this. Their pitching coaches are doing more than keeping their heads right...

Cubs: Arrieta, Hammel, Feldman, Dempster (revived under Bosio), Rondon (rule 5 selection)

Pirates: Burnett, Liriano, Volquez, Grilli, Melancon

Cardinals: Lackey, Lohse, Westbrook, I don't really feel like looking up the rest of their devil magic...

 

All these players where bought/acquired low or for nothing and made highly productive. And we keep throwing the little money we have at over-priced mid level free agents hoping they continue to give us 2.0 WAR seasons. Since the start of the 2009 season we've scored the 3rd most runs in the NL. Unfortunately we've also allowed the 3rd most. We need a pitching visionary and development strategy throughout the organization not some retread who has experience making a slow walk to the mound in front of 40,000 people.

 

You made my point precisely. Who are the pitching coaches in Chicago, Pittsburgh and St. Louis? Chris Bosio, Ray Searage, and Derek Liliquist. Combined those three have 26 years of major league playing experience. Derek Johnson? I couldn't find his name in the baseball register, so apparently he never played professionally. I know if I'm an experienced major league pitcher, I'm more inclined to listen to advice from a guy who's had major league experience. I thought that was a weakness of Kranitz. Personally, I think Lee Tunnell deserved the pitching coach job for what he's done with a hodge podge Brewer bullpen the last several years. Look Johnson has a great resume for teaching pitching. But major league pitchers for the most part have doctorates in the art or they wouldn't be in the major leagues.

[And That]

I know if I'm an experienced major league pitcher, I'm more inclined to listen to advice from a guy who's had major league experience.

 

That's the rub, though. The Brewers are short on pitchers with any significant major league experience. Excluding Lohse, Garza, and K-Rod, the other 20 pitchers on the Brewers' 40-man have about 20 years of major league experience combined. Take out Jimenez, it's closer to 15.

 

Also want to touch on the cheapness of the signing. There really isn't much detailed info out there on how much ML pitching coaches are paid, but I would hazard a guess that the range of salaries for the 25 most inexpensive pitching coaches is extremely tight. If he's getting paid below average, you're likely talking about a difference of a few thousand dollars from the middle. It's not a place teams really can be cheap because there is so little substantive savings to be had.

[CheezWizHed]

Chris Bosio, Ray Searage, and Derek Liliquist. Combined those three have 26 years of major league playing experience.

 

Certainly, ML experience could be one element, but its not required either. Doing it and teaching it are two very different items. There are plenty of guys at the MLB level that you wouldn't want teaching young kids about pitching (Carlos Zambrano?). I can imagine there are plenty of great coaches that never sniffed the MLB level either.

[nate82]

I wouldn't be surprised if Lohse is offered a spot in the organization to be a pitching coach or bullpen coach if he doesn't get an offer this winter in free agency.

[DHonks]

Lets face it. They went the cheap route here. Got to believe he's going to be paid at the bottom rung of major league pitching coaches. He's got zero track record at the major league level. Kind of disturbing when you think now the GM, manager and the pitching coach are all learning on the job.

 

[sarcasm]You kids get off my lawn! [/sarcasm]

 

Isn't a fresh look what people wanted rather than retreads? He has 11 years at Vandy plus 3 in the Cubs minor leagues. Are they going cheap or being innovative? Seems like they are going for new perspectives, no matter how you look at it.

 

So I guess we will see how much coaches really matter anyway.

 

 

When I worked minor league spring training for the Dbacks 2 different years, we made note of how the front office looked like a bunch of frat boys. AJ Hinch, Josh Byrnes, etc etc. It's hard to describe, but stupid annoying stuff like wearing a visor upside down and backwards. I half expected them to start calling each other bro or bra, and randomly start high-fiving. Lots in the organization shook their head at their perceived lack of maturity.