Garza done starting for the season

[logan82]

Makes you wonder if he was pitching through an injury. I hate to say that but he was goid after extended rest. SS appliies of course.

[monty57]

the point where he even called his agent to talk to the Brewers... what is next? His mommy? He shouldn't be shocked or insulted that the Brewers pulled him.

 

This is called being a professional. He didn't storm up to the front office and make a scene. He did the chain of command approach because he is frustrated with the situation and probably himself as well. Had he stormed up there, all people would be talking about is how big of a jerk he is and would hate him. I commend him for being a bigger person and taking the appropriate steps in this matter. Sure he's sucked this year, but this is one area you can't knock him on.

 

This is professional sports, where players get promoted/demoted all the times... often with far less "leash" than the Brewers have given Garza. If he wanted to "be a professional," he should have knocked on Counsell's door (not Melvin's) and had a civil discussion about how he can best help the team. He should then have thanked Counsell for guaranteeing him a spot in the 2016 rotation instead of making him earn it.

[CheezWizHed]

“I told them what I felt,” Garza said. “Had my agent call up top and tell them how I felt, and that’s that. I’ve played with guys who have gone through similar-type situations, just a rough year, and never once have I seen a guy shut down.

 

I'm inferring that he meant that he told Melvin, but maybe it was Counsel when Counsel informed Garza of the decision. Either way, he made his objection. Then he involved his agent.

 

Getting his agent involved is normally done only when you think some gross atrocity has been done against you. (Like the Mets shutting down K-Rod to prevent him hitting performance goals when he was pitching well).

 

And that is my main point. If Garza thinks he can pitch at a 5+ ERA all season long and removing him from the rotation is an egregious crime... he is showing his selfishness or cluelessness.

[jerichoholicninja]

“I told them what I felt,” Garza said. “Had my agent call up top and tell them how I felt, and that’s that. I’ve played with guys who have gone through similar-type situations, just a rough year, and never once have I seen a guy shut down.

 

I'm inferring that he meant that he told Melvin, but maybe it was Counsel when Counsel informed Garza of the decision. Either way, he made his objection. Then he involved his agent.

 

Getting his agent involved is normally done only when you think some gross atrocity has been done against you. (Like the Mets shutting down K-Rod to prevent him hitting performance goals when he was pitching well).

 

And that is my main point. If Garza thinks he can pitch at a 5+ ERA all season long and removing him from the rotation is an egregious crime... he is showing his selfishness or cluelessness.

 

This sort of thing happens often with players with playing time incentives in their contracts. The player becomes terrible and gets upset when they don't play as much because they won't reach their incentives. These clauses are made with the intent of rewarding health not performance. It almost happened with Weeks. It was getting close to happening with Chase Utley before he got hurt.

 

Once again, I think we are all making too much of this. Garza knows he was playing poorly and also knows that the Brewers quite possibly cost him a lot of money. I don't blame him for being mad. If the team was in a playoff race I don't think he'd be having the same reaction. He'd probably agree with the move. But these games don't count and because, he at least says, he's healthy he should be in the rotation but I understand why he's not. The last couple games I've watched he's been in the dugout and been the first guy to congratulate someone when they score, hit a homerun, etc. Everyone on the team and in the office has moved past this and it's a non-story.

 

For those that feel he should just go to the bullpen and figure it out, I don't know how you can expect a guy to go do something he's never done before to get better. That'd be like telling a slumping Braun we're not going to start you but instead are going to give you a pinch at bat every 3 games for the rest of the season and hope you figure your swing out. The best thing for Garza is to not pitch until Spring Training 2016 to clear his mind and get healed up.

[adambr2]

“I told them what I felt,” Garza said. “Had my agent call up top and tell them how I felt, and that’s that. I’ve played with guys who have gone through similar-type situations, just a rough year, and never once have I seen a guy shut down.

 

I'm inferring that he meant that he told Melvin, but maybe it was Counsel when Counsel informed Garza of the decision. Either way, he made his objection. Then he involved his agent.

 

Getting his agent involved is normally done only when you think some gross atrocity has been done against you. (Like the Mets shutting down K-Rod to prevent him hitting performance goals when he was pitching well).

 

And that is my main point. If Garza thinks he can pitch at a 5+ ERA all season long and removing him from the rotation is an egregious crime... he is showing his selfishness or cluelessness.

 

For those that feel he should just go to the bullpen and figure it out, I don't know how you can expect a guy to go do something he's never done before to get better. That'd be like telling a slumping Braun we're not going to start you but instead are going to give you a pinch at bat every 3 games

 

Lohse seems to be doing just fine with it. And pitching out of the bullpen to me is different than pinch-hitting every few days. You're still an active member of the pitching staff, just in a different role.

[jerichoholicninja]

“I told them what I felt,” Garza said. “Had my agent call up top and tell them how I felt, and that’s that. I’ve played with guys who have gone through similar-type situations, just a rough year, and never once have I seen a guy shut down.

 

I'm inferring that he meant that he told Melvin, but maybe it was Counsel when Counsel informed Garza of the decision. Either way, he made his objection. Then he involved his agent.

 

Getting his agent involved is normally done only when you think some gross atrocity has been done against you. (Like the Mets shutting down K-Rod to prevent him hitting performance goals when he was pitching well).

 

And that is my main point. If Garza thinks he can pitch at a 5+ ERA all season long and removing him from the rotation is an egregious crime... he is showing his selfishness or cluelessness.

 

For those that feel he should just go to the bullpen and figure it out, I don't know how you can expect a guy to go do something he's never done before to get better. That'd be like telling a slumping Braun we're not going to start you but instead are going to give you a pinch at bat every 3 games

 

Lohse seems to be doing just fine with it. And pitching out of the bullpen to me is different than pinch-hitting every few days. You're still an active member of the pitching staff, just in a different role.

 

Lohse didn't have a choice. It was bullpen and attempt to salvage your career or be out of a job. Garza could go to the pen and the change in routine to get ready to pitch causes him to get hurt or change his mechanics or he hurts himself throwing all out because he's only going one inning. Garza is going to be in a rotation next year, in Milwaukee or not. I just don't see how having him throw a few garbage time innings this year is going to be any good for him or the team.

[gregmag]

Here's an excellent piece from Baseball Prospectus Milwaukee that puts Garza's handling of this latest event in the context of his history:

 

http://milwaukee.locals.baseballprospectus.com/2015/09/11/brewers-lay-out-an-unwelcome-matt/

 

The author concludes (I'm paraphrasing) that Garza has crossed a character line that should make the Brewers want to dump him before next season. I agree. From a pure talent standpoint, the smartest move would be to let him try to regain his value in the first half of next year (though I'm not sure how his fastball command is coming back). But this team seems to be trying to build a culture where guys get fair opportunities and have to show something in order to play. Garza's diva act dumps all over that ethos. Eat most of his salary, get anything you can for him, and move forward with better pitchers and better people.

[markedman5]

@AdamMcCalvy: Matt Garza has gone home to California to be with his wife, who is expecting twins imminently. He's not expected to return this season.

[markedman5]

@AdamMcCalvy: Craig Counsell had a long chat with Garza before he left. Said they parted on good terms. Garza will be part of #Brewers '16 rotation.

[MadScientist]

Best thing for him. Having two newborns in the house should really help him appreciate baseball

[brewmann04]

I would hope that at some point he will be an ex brewer.

[jerichoholicninja]

I would hope that at some point he will be an ex brewer.

 

It's a guarantee that at some point in the future he will be an ex-Brewer.

[TURBO]

So let me get this straight, Garza pitched like absolute crap, loses his spot in the rotation, refused to pitch out of the bullpen, and is now being rewarded for these behaviors by being sent home for the rest of the season to be with his wife and kids without a dock in pay?

 

Another perk for his behavior, he has also been told that he has one of the starting 5 spots for the 2016 season?

 

This is ridiculous.

[Polish Falcons]

This guy makes me sick. I wouldn't mind seeing Garza being booed out of miller park at the start of next season.

[jwill535]

So let me get this straight, Garza pitched like absolute crap, loses his spot in the rotation, refused to pitch out of the bullpen, and is now being rewarded for these behaviors by being sent home for the rest of the season to be with his wife and kids without a dock in pay?

 

Another perk for his behavior, he has also been told that he has one of the starting 5 spots for the 2016 season?

 

This is ridiculous.

 

Had he been on a cy young campaign, he still would have likely left the team to be with her. Apparently there were/are chances of complications.

[MNBrew]

So let me get this straight, Garza pitched like absolute crap, loses his spot in the rotation, refused to pitch out of the bullpen, and is now being rewarded for these behaviors by being sent home for the rest of the season to be with his wife and kids without a dock in pay?

 

Another perk for his behavior, he has also been told that he has one of the starting 5 spots for the 2016 season?

 

This is ridiculous.

It's been reported many times over: He was offered the chance to pitch out of the bullpen and declined. That's probably not the coolest move on his part, but it's not the same as being told to do so and him refusing a directive.

 

Garza's not too high on my list, either, but there's an accuracy issue that's separate from (obviously widely shared and arguably well-justified) emotion & bias.

[1992casey]

Had he been on a cy young campaign, he still would have likely left the team to be with her. Apparently there were/are chances of complications.

I hadn't heard that there might be complications. I hope everything goes well.

 

Yeah, he would have been gone for a while either way. And the fact that the birth is in California would make for a longer paternity leave than if the birth were in Milwaukee.

[EauClaireNWL]

Just because they told him he'd be a part of the rotation next year doesn't mean they aren't going to try and ship him elsewhere. Problem is his trade value is so low at this point, you'd probably be lucky to get a decent single A prospect in return for him and would probably still have to eat a good portion of that 25 million.

 

Regardless, it's going to be a tough decision for the new GM. Do you try to sell low on him in the off-season or do start him in the rotation next year and hope he can regain some of his trade value to be a somewhat worthwhile trade piece at the deadline?

[trwi7]

Had he been on a cy young campaign, he still would have likely left the team to be with her. Apparently there were/are chances of complications.

 

He probably would've been with her even if there wasn't a chance of complications. Remember when the Mets player (name escapes me) went on paternity leave last year and some dolt in the NY media (might have been Boomer Esiason) said his wife should've scheduled a C-section in spring training so he wouldn't have to miss regular season games?

[LouisEly]

What they don't need is Garza going to the pen at the end of a lost season and pulling a Thornburg and damaging his elbow because now he's pitching shorter stints more frequently and not on a starters routine/schedule. It's one thing to have to come in on an emergency because of an extra innings game, but it's another to move to the pen entirely. I think that's why the team gave him the option to do it, and didn't request or ask that he do it.

 

Lohse is a different story - his contract is up, and he's fighting for any kind of job with any team next year. It's also a different story when you're a AAA guy without a guaranteed contract; those guys (such as Pena, Thornburg, Cravy, etc.) are also fighting for any kind of major league job, starter or bullpen. But we saw the risk of that with Thornburg. Thornburg may have already had some damage to his elbow, but the last thing the Brewers need is Garza making $13M next year unable to pitch or be traded because he has a busted elbow or shoulder.

[jerichoholicninja]

What they don't need is Garza going to the pen at the end of a lost season and pulling a Thornburg and damaging his elbow because now he's pitching shorter stints more frequently and not on a starters routine/schedule. It's one thing to have to come in on an emergency because of an extra innings game, but it's another to move to the pen entirely. I think that's why the team gave him the option to do it, and didn't request or ask that he do it.

 

Lohse is a different story - his contract is up, and he's fighting for any kind of job with any team next year. It's also a different story when you're a AAA guy without a guaranteed contract; those guys (such as Pena, Thornburg, Cravy, etc.) are also fighting for any kind of major league job, starter or bullpen. But we saw the risk of that with Thornburg. Thornburg may have already had some damage to his elbow, but the last thing the Brewers need is Garza making $13M next year unable to pitch or be traded because he has a busted elbow or shoulder.

 

Exactly. I made this exact same post earlier in this thread but some posters just like to focus on the "Garza refused to pitch" line which is probably not even true.

[1992casey]

We talked about the merits of doing (pitching in relief) and we ended up not doing it. It was his decision but I think the best thing going forward for Matt is how do we best get ready for 2016. Let's get him ready for 2016. That's what's important right now.

 

I understand Matt's frustration with this whole thing. But we're getting ready for 2016. We gave Matt news he didn't like and he was frustrated by it. But the important thing for him right now is getting ready to pitch at a high level in 2016.

It sounds like a collaborative decision to me.

 

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/328112021.html