BF.net Fan Community Top 25 Prospects - 2015 Mid-Season Edition

[BrewersAA]

So, am I seeing something real in Cotto, Pena, Allemand, and Suter - or am I just seeing smoke and mirrors?

 

We all have our own way of evaluating these players, have our pet projects, etc. Nothing wrong with that. Allemand, for example, is a guy who could easily be in the Top 25 down the road.

 

Heck, I had the only vote for Carlos Luna. But I looked at his stat line, and even with a small sample I felt I needed to reward him with a vote. The absolutely dominating complete game he threw sealed it.

 

Brandon Diaz is another I put on my list that didn't make the Top 25. His numbers aren't deserving, but I have seen him play enough that I think he's real close to breaking out. Nice, short swing, has some power, has speed...just a lot of tools to work with there.

 

For me its CRAZY that NEITHER of the Diaz's made the list... both should firmly be in the top 25. I had Brandon in my top10 and i truly believe he has top 10 talent. I also like Carlos Luna, but i have a hard time with DSL players until we see them stateside.

 

Now to speak to Cotto, pena, allemand, and suter, it would seem that you are ranking/rating them strictly off numbers. There is nothing wrong with that, but often times it can be a big mistake when it comes to "prospecting".

 

Allemand is a guy that has a small sample, nothing jumps out about him, and he was REALLY old for his level and now that he got bumped hes just pretty old for his level and the production has fallen off a cliff, I hope he turns out to be an allstar because thats amazing for the brewers, but there are alot of players ahead of him in mostly every area. Cotto shares my birthday so he gets points there but you can add everything i said about allemand here and also include that he went undrafted meaning every team in the MLB thought there were rouchly 1000 players better as well as all the players already in their systems, if he keeps producing he might start to move up but it would have to be at a much higher level since his age is the average for double A.

 

Yerison Pena is different again than the above 2 as he is on average 6... SIX years older than the guys hes playing against. If he had any potential he would not still be in the DSL. Again, i hope im wrong, and he turns into an allstar for the brewers but its HIGHLY unlikely.

 

Now Suter might have the best case of the guys you mentioned. He has done nothing but produce! But, there are a TON of red flags. His whip isnt bad, but its not good either, his K-rate is bad... he odesnt quite have a 2 to 1 k to walk rate, the brewers moved him to a relief role to start the year, hes a little old for his level, and by all accounts he doesnt have great stuff (generally a guy need at least 1 plus pitch for people to bet on him). On top of that hes a hard guy for me to rank until there been a full season every year so far hes come out like gangbusters and he falls off a cliff to end the season, im not sure what that means, but i almost looks like once guys have seen him a couple times his lack of Stuff catches up to him.

 

I hope that doesnt sounds like i am being a jerk, because thats not my intention and in the end i hope you are right on all 4 and that i am wrong and you can pull up this post to prove it!!!

[Mr Southpaw]

Looks like the list needs an update. Guessing...

 

2. Brett Phillips

4. Domingo Santana

9. Josh Hader

 

Lots of OF depth. DM, Parra and the likes for quality young pitching!

[TheCrew07]

It will get updated at the end of the season.

[Mr Southpaw]

Thanks for sharing.

[Mass Haas]

Compare with the Brewerfan community rankings, here's the new Top 40 from Miller Park Prospects.

 

Perhaps next summer, the timing can be such that it's post-trade deadline here at Brewerfan, just a thought.

[igor67]

I'd suggest the following times for the community list:

1) End of the regular season (give or take a few but before the AFL starts)

2) Beginning of the season (captures fall and winter leagues, deals and spring)

3) Pre-draft (I'd close it the day of the draft) so we can hammer out the impact of the first half of the season, and it provides a jumping off point for starting to discuss how the new draftees would slot it.

4) Post deadline (gets any deals and is long enough after the draft that we know who actually signed and have seen them play a bit)

[clancyphile]

I'd suggest the following times for the community list:

1) End of the regular season (give or take a few but before the AFL starts)

2) Beginning of the season (captures fall and winter leagues, deals and spring)

3) Pre-draft (I'd close it the day of the draft) so we can hammer out the impact of the first half of the season, and it provides a jumping off point for starting to discuss how the new draftees would slot it.

4) Post deadline (gets any deals and is long enough after the draft that we know who actually signed and have seen them play a bit)

 

That sounds good to me.

[Mass Haas]

Nicholas' Top 15 at Disciples of Uecker

[reillymcshane]

I'd suggest the following times for the community list:

1) End of the regular season (give or take a few but before the AFL starts)

2) Beginning of the season (captures fall and winter leagues, deals and spring)

3) Pre-draft (I'd close it the day of the draft) so we can hammer out the impact of the first half of the season, and it provides a jumping off point for starting to discuss how the new draftees would slot it.

4) Post deadline (gets any deals and is long enough after the draft that we know who actually signed and have seen them play a bit)

I ran into the following issues with #3 and #4 (which was how we did things in 2014).

 

First, if wait until after the trade deadline your pushing toward the end of the regular season (assuming you give everyone a couple of weeks to vote, take a few days to tabulate things, etc.). So let's say you get a prospect list up in the third week of August. At this point, the minor league season is close to being done. We've got six weeks of regular season, but for the most part the minor league numbers are pretty well set by mid-August. 2-3 more weeks isn't likely to change things that much. It makes doing an end-of-season poll somewhat redundant since there's not that much that has changed since the mid/late August poll.

 

Second, with regards to waiting until after the trade deadline - it usually doesn't matter that much. This year, however, was the exception. In 2014, we waited until after the deadline and the only change was Mitch Haniger wasn't eligible anymore.

 

Third, if you do a pre-draft vote then some people will say we should wait until after the draft so you can include those picks (sort of a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario).

 

Fourth, having a poll in late March, then late May, then mid-August, then early October gives you four polls in the year - as opposed to three. Just more work, and the closer you make the polls, the less things change (as noted in point #1).

 

How would I do things going forward?

 

1. Do a post season poll in October or November.

2. Do a pre-season poll in March.

3. Plan on doing a mid-season poll like this year, wrapping up after the July 15 deadline.

4. However, with the mid-season poll, I think we could consider reserving the right to extend it to the trade deadline if the team appears to be in a major selling mode (like this year). It's not a perfect way to do this since you would need to have people come back and update their selections. Again, we'd have to see how the team is doing and what the buzz is around the league. In the past, Milwaukee hasn't done many deals at the deadline - usually dealing guys if anything (albeit, mediocre players since we don't make a lot of big deals.) The other option would be to do a supplemental poll after the deadline, asking people to rank any new comers. But we can sort of feel that out, see what is in the cards next summer.

 

One thing I want to start doing is bumping people off the list as they become ineligible (either because they are traded, cut or get too much service time). Thus everyone can slot in any eligible player when they vote and know that the guy will go away if he gets too much service time. This way no one is setting up their own eligibility standards. It's sort of what MLB Pipeline does. They bump people off, add new guys, etc., as they go. Thus when Jungmann became ineligible, he'd just be go off the list, everyone below him gets bumped up, and player 26 joins the Top 25.

 

This is something we could do right now if people wanted. It makes the list less stagnant.

 

Also, if we did do a poll after the draft, but before the signing deadline (like this year), I'd ask people to include an extra player for any unsigned draftees they want to include in their list. We did this when the possibility of Kirby not signing was brought up - people just started adding an extra guy to their list. I think that worked out fine.

 

There are certainly some advantages to doing four polls in the year. The more you do them, the more the list is fresh. A mid-August poll gives people more feel for the draft picks and rookie ball players. But again, you do that in August, then the October poll is sort of redundant.

 

I'm totally open to suggestions - and if someone has the burning desire to run one of these, they are certainly welcome. I'll do whatever works best for the community.

[igor67]

Those are reasonable points, I think it would be possible to do the multiple in season polls if we had the dates arranged ahead of time. Instead of announcing it's time for another one. If we posted warning a week before the deadline that we'd open the voting the day after the deadline and only take submissions for a couple of days it could work.

[Mass Haas]

Nicholas at Disciples of Uecker -- Prospect Narratives

[FVBrewerFan]

I like the timing of the four polls, with that flexibility of the mid-season poll. I do think end of season should be done early- beginning of Oct. (Always in a hurry to do a new one when you know it will be better than the last.)

[Mass Haas]

Via John Sickels at MinorLeagueBall.com --

 

Today we continue our summer reviews of the pre-season Top 20 Prospects lists with the Milwaukee Brewers.

 

This is a review of the pre-season list.

 

It is not a new list.

 

These are the pre-season grades.

 

This list was originally published January 2, 2015

 

Read on at the link...

[reillymcshane]

I like the timing of the four polls, with that flexibility of the mid-season poll. I do think end of season should be done early- beginning of Oct. (Always in a hurry to do a new one when you know it will be better than the last.)

I'll plan on doing one right after the season, then we'll do one toward the end of spring training. How exactly we do the in-season polls can be decided at that time.

 

No matter, it'll be fun adding all the new prospects to the list.

[wildcat2237]

I like the timing of the four polls, with that flexibility of the mid-season poll. I do think end of season should be done early- beginning of Oct. (Always in a hurry to do a new one when you know it will be better than the last.)

I'll plan on doing one right after the season, then we'll do one toward the end of spring training. How exactly we do the in-season polls can be decided at that time.

 

No matter, it'll be fun adding all the new prospects to the list.

 

Thanks for taking the time to put this content together guys. Excellent reads. Its really exciting that the Brewers farm system is once again relevant.

[BrewersAA]

sooo...... is it time to put together another list? I dont have the time or knowledge to put together the list of guys who no longer qualify. I know jungmann for sure has way too many innings, and i think santana has too many at bats, but im not sure on davies, cravy, knebel, goforth, rogers, sardinas etc.

 

I have digested the season and am ready to put together my top 30 heading into next year!

[reillymcshane]

sooo...... is it time to put together another list? I dont have the time or knowledge to put together the list of guys who no longer qualify. I know jungmann for sure has way too many innings, and i think santana has too many at bats, but im not sure on davies, cravy, knebel, goforth, rogers, sardinas etc.

 

I have digested the season and am ready to put together my top 30 heading into next year!

I'll put together something in the next couple of days.

 

Santana, Knebel, Rogers, Sardinas, Peterson and Jungmann are for sure ineligible.

 

Regarding pitchers, Davies has 34 IP, Goforth 24, Cravy 43, Wagner 13 and Pena 27. No other rookies else has more than 10 IP. In the past, I've just said if a guy has less than 50 IP, he's eligible. That would make all these guys eligible. My only question is if people think we should use some other criteria. I don't think any of these guys are locks to make the team next year (Davies looks like the one guy who is as close to a sure thing).

 

Any thoughts?

[nate82]

 

Regarding pitchers, Davies has 34 IP, Goforth 24, Cravy 43, Wagner 13 and Pena 27. No other rookies else has more than 10 IP. In the past, I've just said if a guy has less than 50 IP, he's eligible. That would make all these guys eligible. My only question is if people think we should use some other criteria. I don't think any of these guys are locks to make the team next year (Davies looks like the one guy who is as close to a sure thing).

 

Any thoughts?

 

Davies is probably a lock to make the team out of spring training and only Pena, Cravy, and Goforth would be the others with an outside chance. Wagner may make it as a long reliever. Davies I am going to assume will win the #5 spot with Pena landing in the bullpen. I don't think Pena has an option left so he is going to have to stay I think.

 

I think 50 IP is fine though I would prefer less but 50 IP is fine.

[MrTPlush]

I think all of those pitchers are fine. The thing different with them vs. the Jungmann debacle was the fact Jungmann was literally pitching right then on the team. Davies and company are not locks and could easily blow an elbow before the season even begins and never throw a pitch. I just think it was different mid season with the player in question dominating at the time.

 

I really think a post draft mid season list is best:

 

Pre-Season= To cover any offseason moves and any AFL play.

 

Post Draft= Add the draftees and assess players after half a season.

 

Postseason= To cover any deadline moves and possibly assess players after full season

 

If we were to wait until after the deadline for the in season one what is the point of a post season one? What major changes will you possibly have?

[FVBrewerFan]

In my opinion, Davies, Cravy would no longer be on prospect list. Both had a number of starts, not just September call-ups.

[CheezWizHed]

Just pick an IP number and go with it. Don't include/exclude people based on when the IP came or other subjective criteria. Keep it simple and stick with it.

[igor67]

I agree for this one with it's best just to pick a cut off and stick to it.

[clancyphile]

sooo...... is it time to put together another list? I dont have the time or knowledge to put together the list of guys who no longer qualify. I know jungmann for sure has way too many innings, and i think santana has too many at bats, but im not sure on davies, cravy, knebel, goforth, rogers, sardinas etc.

 

I have digested the season and am ready to put together my top 30 heading into next year!

I'll put together something in the next couple of days.

 

Santana, Knebel, Rogers, Sardinas, Peterson and Jungmann are for sure ineligible.

 

Regarding pitchers, Davies has 34 IP, Goforth 24, Cravy 43, Wagner 13 and Pena 27. No other rookies else has more than 10 IP. In the past, I've just said if a guy has less than 50 IP, he's eligible. That would make all these guys eligible. My only question is if people think we should use some other criteria. I don't think any of these guys are locks to make the team next year (Davies looks like the one guy who is as close to a sure thing).

 

Any thoughts?

 

I say stick with 50 IP, as it is the major league standard for rookies.