KRod signs 2 year deal with Brew Crew

[Thurston Fluff]

Is there any reliever that Brewerfan likes?

Krod is terrible.

Broxton's a dumpster fire.

Kinzler's a waste of money.

Papelbon is about to crash and burn.

 

The guy who gets crapped on the least here seems to be Will Smith and how he's apparently not a loogy. The guy whose career OPS against RHB is .826.

 

Relief pitchers are unreliable, overvalued, and generally deserved to be crapped on. Outside of a handful of elite talents (like Kimbrel), any given RP could end up being fantastic or horrible next season. The reason people target the guys you've listed is because they are unnecessarily expensive given the above facts.

 

In his 13 year career he only had two seasons where he had an ERA about 4 and never had one above 4.5. Half the time he produced an ERA under3. His career ERA is 2.73 and is 10th in career saves. If it is true that relievers have to be classified as either elite or to be crapped on then K-Rod has to be put in the elite category. I would suggest a third alternative. A group that includes pitchers who can be relied upon to give you at least average production year in and year out. Personally that would be where I put Rodriguez. Which is well worth what he is being paid.

[SRB]

Is there any reliever that Brewerfan likes?

Krod is terrible.

Broxton's a dumpster fire.

Kinzler's a waste of money.

Papelbon is about to crash and burn.

 

The guy who gets crapped on the least here seems to be Will Smith and how he's apparently not a loogy. The guy whose career OPS against RHB is .826.

 

Relief pitchers are unreliable, overvalued, and generally deserved to be crapped on. Outside of a handful of elite talents (like Kimbrel), any given RP could end up being fantastic or horrible next season. The reason people target the guys you've listed is because they are unnecessarily expensive given the above facts.

 

In his 13 year career he only had two seasons where he had an ERA about 4 and never had one above 4.5. Half the time he produced an ERA under3. His career ERA is 2.73 and is 10th in career saves. If it is true that relievers have to be classified as either elite or to be crapped on then K-Rod has to be put in the elite category. I would suggest a third alternative. A group that includes pitchers who can be relied upon to give you at least average production year in and year out. Personally that would be where I put Rodriguez. Which is well worth what he is being paid.

 

A league average relief pitcher is worth nowhere near 3/$19M, which is what K-Rod's deal potentially gives him. He's had an elite career but RP are so volatile that it can go at any time (e.g. Trevor Hoffman). Mariano Rivera is the only guy in history who was untouchable his entire career.

 

I'm fine with the K-Rod deal, but that doesn't mean I don't think we might have gotten comparable performance from (for example) a full season of Knebel. There's a reason nobody signed K-Rod until spring training...

[MVP2110]

 

A league average relief pitcher is worth nowhere near 3/$19M, which is what K-Rod's deal potentially gives him. He's had an elite career but RP are so volatile that it can go at any time (e.g. Trevor Hoffman). Mariano Rivera is the only guy in history who was untouchable his entire career.

 

I'm fine with the K-Rod deal, but that doesn't mean I don't think we might have gotten comparable performance from (for example) a full season of Knebel. There's a reason nobody signed K-Rod until spring training...

 

3/19 is what it potentially gives him, which means if that third year option is picked up he has earned it so it must have been a pretty good deal. this allows knebal to get a little more time in AAA and when injuries eventually occur

[BarneyStinston]

You really have to wonder that if this were the NFL and not MLB, K-Rod would have been banned from playing for at least a year for what he did off the field. Baltimore Ravens and Minnesota Vikings eventually gave in and made the moral decision to drop their star players. You have to wonder why the Brewers moral compass has simply been ignored, and K-Rod essentially got away with battery without even expressing remorse. IMO, its really hard to root for this guy when he's such a monster and he blows ballgames.

[pacopete4]

You really have to wonder that if this were the NFL and not MLB, K-Rod would have been banned from playing for at least a year for what he did off the field. Baltimore Ravens and Minnesota Vikings eventually gave in and made the moral decision to drop their star players. You have to wonder why the Brewers moral compass has simply been ignored, and K-Rod essentially got away with battery without even expressing remorse. IMO, its really hard to root for this guy when he's such a monster and he blows ballgames.

 

Oh get off your high horse.

[jerichoholicninja]

You really have to wonder that if this were the NFL and not MLB, K-Rod would have been banned from playing for at least a year for what he did off the field. Baltimore Ravens and Minnesota Vikings eventually gave in and made the moral decision to drop their star players. You have to wonder why the Brewers moral compass has simply been ignored, and K-Rod essentially got away with battery without even expressing remorse. IMO, its really hard to root for this guy when he's such a monster and he blows ballgames.

 

Oh get off your high horse.

 

Ditto to this. ^

 

He was suspended when he plead guilty to assaulting his girlfriend's father and never charged after his girlfriend refused to testify that he assaulted her. Ya, the guy's probably a grade A turd but he's served his punishment before and no one should be suspended for something they are never charged with.

 

Do you feel the Brewers "ignored their moral compass" by not releasing Gallardo after his DUI?

[pete]

You really have to wonder that if this were the NFL and not MLB, K-Rod would have been banned from playing for at least a year for what he did off the field. Baltimore Ravens and Minnesota Vikings eventually gave in and made the moral decision to drop their star players. You have to wonder why the Brewers moral compass has simply been ignored, and K-Rod essentially got away with battery without even expressing remorse. IMO, its really hard to root for this guy when he's such a monster and he blows ballgames.

 

Breaking news: the NFL has treated their employees, the players, like human garbage. The Ray Rice suspension is about public image. I doubt Ray Rice's wife likes it.

 

You speak as if you have inside information. You've determined that he's a "monster." This couldn't be based on a misdemeanor battery allegation. I'd guess that there are a couple hundred calls a day just in Milwaukee that involve allegations of violence. That's just a starting point of inventorying violence that occurs or is alleged.

 

It couldn't be based on the witnesses not cooperating. That's so common that there are all sorts of euphemisms for doctors not testifying against doctors or law enforcement not testifying against law enforcement. Go ahead and ask that a medical procedure be videotaped. Until recently videotaping a crime occurring could make you a criminal, if the criminal was a law enforcement officer!

 

What amazes me is that the popular response is that people who do certain things shouldn't be employed. Bad news: Australia is occupied now and all the misogynists, juvenile delinquents and pot smokers can't be banished to another land to maintain purity of the good people. I don't know if Ray Rice was convicted of anything, but given the evidence he could have been and treated as if he were a dishwasher. During the season he could have reported after work to spend the night in jail and spent off days there and in the offseason he could spend it in prison till he served his sentence. What happened instead almost certainly cost his wife millions of dollars.

 

For all we know, the Brewers could have fully investigated the incident and engaged both Francisco and his wife in discussion if they felt it was necessary. They might have required him to engage in treatment as well. It could be far and away the best thing for him, his wife and his family.

 

To steal from Solzhenitsyn*, good and evil cuts through the heart of every one.

 

I don't think declaring someone a "monster" when you don't know the truth is the right moral direction. Check your compass.

 

*Gulag Archipelago

[TheCrew07]

The high horse comments are in incredibly poor taste.

 

Perhaps you've been fortunate to not have anyone in your circle of friends and family be abused. That is not my reality and as such I have an incredibly low tolerance of men who prey, and make no mistake, K-Rod is a predator. He may not have been convicted or prosecuted of any crimes, but that has more to do with the psychology of abuse victims than anything else. He put a woman in the hospital, he then beat up her dad, and then came to Milwaukee and beat up another girlfriend.

 

If you're naive enough to believe that those are the only 3 instances he's abused someone in his life and deserves a second chance I'd say he's already had a 2nd and 3rd chance, and no there's no way these are 3 isolated instances. He's a piece of human garbage, I don't care what the other players say about him as a "good locker room presence".

 

I root for the Brewers, not so much individual players like I used to because I believe in cycling talent, and I find extremely it irritating that Mark A will keep bringing a known predator back and employing him to win an extra couple of games per season. He should be in jail, instead he's making millions of dollars playing baseball, and I realize he's not first athlete to skate by and won't be the last, but right and wrong should matter.

 

I guess it's okay though because it wasn't your mom, sister, or friend and he'll help the Brewers win games.

[SRB]

Perhaps you've been fortunate to not have anyone in your circle of friends and family be abused. That is not my reality and as such I have an incredibly low tolerance of men who prey, and make no mistake, K-Rod is a predator. He may not have been convicted or prosecuted of any crimes, but that has more to do with the psychology of abuse victims than anything else. He put a woman in the hospital, he then beat up her dad, and then came to Milwaukee and beat up another girlfriend.

 

When did he do this? Not defending K-Rod, I think he's a chump, but I only remembered the two other incidents.

[pete]

I think its completely inappropriate to claim that all the people who don't make a string of assumptions are ignorant or don't care about women being [abused]. That's pretty much the definition of being on a high horse.

 

I can assure you that i'm not ignorant of the issues, the psychology or the politics, both through decades of involvement on the periphery of law and politics and recent experiences. The 911 people admit that they are used as a tool of manipulation in significant numbers.

 

I don't know about Sussex, but in Milwaukee if there is a domestic violence call, 911 or not, if there is any evidence of an altercation and certainly if there is blood, someone has to be taken into custody. Its self serving or incompetent for people to write stories that include allegations without the insight brought about by full reports, follow ups or details like nobody taken into custody.

[Baldkin]

Perhaps you've been fortunate to not have anyone in your circle of friends and family be abused and/or raped. That is not my reality and as such I have an incredibly low tolerance of men who prey, and make no mistake, K-Rod is a predator. He may not have been convicted or prosecuted of any crimes, but that has more to do with the psychology of abuse victims than anything else. He put a woman in the hospital, he then beat up her dad, and then came to Milwaukee and beat up another girlfriend.

 

When did he do this? Not defending K-Rod, I think he's a chump, but I only remembered the two other incidents.

 

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/k-rod-details-history-violent-abuse-mets-player-charged-defying-judge-contact-article-1.440233

 

The hurler was in court to face seven counts of criminal contempt charges for violating an order of protection by sending 56 text messages to the mother of his two children, Daian Peña. Rodriguez had been ordered not to contact Peña after his Aug. 11 arrest at Citi Field for attacking her father.

 

Kessler said K-Rod's violent streak with Peña dates back to 2005, when he hit her so hard that she had to be hospitalized in Venezuela.

[pete]

You're quoting a prosecutor in a NY Daily News Story. Following up would be trivial and profitable for NYDN. For that matter, the NYPD could likely gain information from Venezuela and perhaps did.

 

What are the details? What are the facts? Please post the follow up information. How about the court's actions?

[TooLiveBrew]

Since (to my knowledge) there has never been any indication or allegation around K-Rod involving rape, it's best to stop that chain of discussion right now. It can't lead anywhere good.

 

Continuing to discuss his domestic abuse allegations/incidents seems relevant to a thread about him, but please remember to keep the discussion civil & based in facts.

[TooLiveBrew]

You're quoting a prosecutor in a NY Daily News Story. Following up would be trivial and profitable for NYDN. For that matter, the NYPD could likely gain information from Venezuela and perhaps did.

 

What are the details? What are the facts? Please post the follow up information. How about the court's actions?

He posted a direct answer to another poster's question about when it was reported that K-Rod put a woman in the hospital.

[TheCrew07]

My point wasn't that K-Rod had raped anyone, it was that once these terrible things happen to someone you care about, your perspective forever changes. I come from a small town in northern WI and I unfortunately have people close to me that have been raped, abused, and sexually assaulted. Predatory men are an issue, and while the NFL has taken the majority of the heat for it, this is a problem that crosses all racial and economic boundaries.

 

My best friend's wife was abused in her first marriage by a guy who I actually used to stick up for, in fact the last fight I was in my life to this point was because I was defending him. She's an absolutely adorable woman in every single way, not to mention one of my sister's best friends, and it took me a long time to understand her mentality regarding the abuse and why she wouldn't press charges. It took quite a bit of reading and watching of documentaries to finally wrap my mind around it as her actions didn't fit my "fighter mentality". Once I realized how brave she truly was to leave in a relatively short time I was ashamed, most women in that situation take far more abuse than she did it. The shame and terror these women live through... well I honestly don't know how to put it into succinct enough terms to post it here, but it breaks my heart.

 

I don't need present anymore facts than are already in public, this is an unfortunately very common cycle. Instead of rallying in defense to the abuser because he wasn't convicted of a crime and can help your team, I'd rather people take the time to educate themselves on how unfortunately common this K-Rod story is.

 

I don't have the power to keep K-Rod out of baseball so all I can do is voice my opinion in regards to my favorite team employing him. I thought the commentary posted by Outlander was spot on, I find it very difficult to balance my hatred of K-Rod against how badly I want the Brewers to win:

 

Here is a link to a well written article and comments about K-Rod and the conflict that some fans have with him and the team.

Link

[StearnsFTW]

High horse. Gimme a break. He's trash.

 

WRT baseball, meh. Not great, not horrible. Probably an overpay, but not an egregious one. I agree with other posters who think this smacks of meddling by Attanasio, which I don't like at all.

[MNBrew]

It was well documented recently that Boras was routinely talking with OWNERS about his available clients with significant closing experience. When Boras gets desperate, he circumvents GMs.

 

The Brewers themselves (read: Melvin) stated often through the winter that the team was looking for another reliever with closing experience. It was well documented that they aggressively pursued a Papelbon trade (which the GM abandoned when Amaro's price was too high in prospects or assumed fiscal responsibility) and regularly kept in touch w/ K-Rod's camp.

 

Given those facts, that hardly points toward a meddling owner. But in recent years on this site, those who are inclined to think Attanasio's a meddler inevitably seem to take any big-money and/or late signing a self-fulfilling prophecy or as further evidence of that perception.

[MNBrew]

I think K-Rod can be pretty dang good again but there are plenty of reasons watching him pitch easily makes us all nervous, too, strong stats notwithstanding. I do believe quality bullpen depth & experience goes a long way toward helping a good team make it to the playoffs, and I think the Brewers could be quite a good team again this year (yes, a lot of things have to go right... etc., etc., etc.).

 

I'm not crazy about the 2-year aspect, but if all goes well or at least well enough, it'll be nice next year not having to chase rumors about potential closer acquisitions all winter.

 

K-Rod's behavioral past has given many folks pretty strong reason to mistrust or outright dislike him. At the moment, he's on the Brewers (well, technically not yet, but essentially) and I want him to do well because that helps the Brewers win. I'm no fan of his character, but that's a separate issue.

[monty57]

Given those facts, that hardly points toward a meddling owner. But in recent years on this site, those who are inclined to think Attanasio's a meddler inevitably seem to take any big-money and/or late signing a self-fulfilling prophecy or as further evidence of that perception.

 

There was a quote from Melvin a few days before the K-Rod signing stating that he wasn't involved in those discussions, and that Boras was speaking directly to Attanasio.

 

I find extremely it irritating that Mark A will keep bringing a known predator back and employing him to win an extra couple of games per season.

 

Well, he's the same guy who is a buddy to the felon Michael Milken (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Milken), and trots him into the booth every year with a big smile on his face. Milken donates money, K-Rod helps win games, so I guess to Attanasio that outweighs any personal issues.

[Point Beer Is Best]

It was well documented recently that Boras was routinely talking with OWNERS about his available clients with significant closing experience. When Boras gets desperate, he circumvents GMs.

 

The Brewers themselves (read: Melvin) stated often through the winter that the team was looking for another reliever with closing experience. It was well documented that they aggressively pursued a Papelbon trade (which the GM abandoned when Amaro's price was too high in prospects or assumed fiscal responsibility) and regularly kept in touch w/ K-Rod's camp.

 

Given those facts, that hardly points toward a meddling owner. But in recent years on this site, those who are inclined to think Attanasio's a meddler inevitably seem to take any big-money and/or late signing a self-fulfilling prophecy or as further evidence of that perception.

 

However, in this case it wasn't an assumption. There were reports that Boras was dealing directly with Attanasio, and I believe that was also the case last year.

[Thurston Fluff]

I think K-Rod can be pretty dang good again but there are plenty of reasons watching him pitch easily makes us all nervous, too, strong stats notwithstanding.

 

Personally I'll take reality over perception any day of the week. I sometimes think fans see the homeruns and lack of velocity and get nervous regardless of the outcome. I think it even goes to the perception that he never has a clean inning. Yet in reality his WHIP last season was only.075 worse than Kimbrel's.

[MNBrew]

It was well documented recently that Boras was routinely talking with OWNERS about his available clients with significant closing experience. When Boras gets desperate, he circumvents GMs.

 

The Brewers themselves (read: Melvin) stated often through the winter that the team was looking for another reliever with closing experience. It was well documented that they aggressively pursued a Papelbon trade (which the GM abandoned when Amaro's price was too high in prospects or assumed fiscal responsibility) and regularly kept in touch w/ K-Rod's camp.

 

Given those facts, that hardly points toward a meddling owner. But in recent years on this site, those who are inclined to think Attanasio's a meddler inevitably seem to take any big-money and/or late signing a self-fulfilling prophecy or as further evidence of that perception.

 

However, in this case it wasn't an assumption. There were reports that Boras was dealing directly with Attanasio, and I believe that was also the case last year.

Nonetheless, that's still Boras' MO. Boras was quoted again this winter, as in past years, that signing "his" headliner FA (Scherzer in this case) is a franchise/ownership decision . . . presumably b/c of the mega-dollars involved (just like A-Rod signing in Texas, which was NOT Melvin's call or negotiation). Late in the winter, he takes a very similar approach to his upper-tied, still-unemployed clients . . . whom he usually refers to as "elite" as part of his sales pitch.

[monty57]

It was well documented recently that Boras was routinely talking with OWNERS about his available clients with significant closing experience. When Boras gets desperate, he circumvents GMs.

 

The Brewers themselves (read: Melvin) stated often through the winter that the team was looking for another reliever with closing experience. It was well documented that they aggressively pursued a Papelbon trade (which the GM abandoned when Amaro's price was too high in prospects or assumed fiscal responsibility) and regularly kept in touch w/ K-Rod's camp.

 

Given those facts, that hardly points toward a meddling owner. But in recent years on this site, those who are inclined to think Attanasio's a meddler inevitably seem to take any big-money and/or late signing a self-fulfilling prophecy or as further evidence of that perception.

 

However, in this case it wasn't an assumption. There were reports that Boras was dealing directly with Attanasio, and I believe that was also the case last year.

Nonetheless, that's still Boras' MO. Boras was quoted again this winter, as in past years, that signing "his" headliner FA (Scherzer in this case) is a franchise/ownership decision . . . presumably b/c of the mega-dollars involved (just like A-Rod signing in Texas, which was NOT Melvin's call or negotiation). Late in the winter, he takes a very similar approach to his upper-tied, still-unemployed clients . . . whom he usually refers to as "elite" as part of his sales pitch.

 

This was discussed in the Transactions forum before K-Rod was signed. JimH posted the following from a JS article:

 

Melvin wouldn't comment on the state of possible talks with the Phillies, but acknowledged the lines of communication have remained open with "K-Rod."

 

"I don’t know if it’s active, but we still have conversations," Melvin said. "Mark deals more with that. (Agent) Scott (Boras) keeps calling Mark."

 

While I understand that every owner signs off on big deals, I doubt that many simply circumvent the GM entirely and deal directly with the agent themselves. Also, I wouldn't consider K-Rod to be a "big deal," so I would think that the signing of a so-so reliever to a relatively low money free agent deal would normally not be something most owners would even feel the need to "sign off" on.

 

If Attanasio trusts Melvin, and if he is not a "meddling owner," then he should simply tell Boras that he needs to deal with the GM. That he does not do that leads me to believe that he either lacks confidence in Melvin, or that he likes "playing GM" himself.

[Thurston Fluff]

If Attanasio trusts Melvin, and if he is not a "meddling owner," then he should simply tell Boras that he needs to deal with the GM. That he does not do that leads me to believe that he either lacks confidence in Melvin, or that he likes "playing GM" himself.

 

It's possible but there is another alternative. They have an understanding of where they are headed and divided up the task of getting there. I am sure Melvin and Attanasio discussed the limits of what K-Rod was worth and how far along discussions with him, as well as others Melvin was talking to, were. I seriously doubt it could ever have happened that Melvin finalized a deal for Pappelbon only to find out afterward Mark agreed to a deal with K-Rod.

[jerichoholicninja]

If Mark was as meddling as some seem to think he is I 'd imagine Doug would have resigned by now.