Morse to Marlins

[JohnBriggs12]

Morse has agreed to terms with Miami Marlins, ostensibly to platoon with Garrett Jones, though I suspect he'll get the full time job as he's the better hitter.

 

I never understood why Melvin didn't appear to have interest in him last year or this. He's terrorized Brewer pitching in the past.

[pacopete4]

Probably because he's really bad in the OF which makes him only a RH option at 1B.

[reillymcshane]

 

I never understood why Melvin didn't appear to have interest in him last year or this. He's terrorized Brewer pitching in the past.

Last year, Morse was coming off a pretty awful season. I guess I can't blame a club for being wary of a slow, poor fielding 32-year old player coming off a .651 OPS and a variety of injuries. Not that the alternative (Reynolds and Overbay) was such a great idea.

[JohnBriggs12]

 

I never understood why Melvin didn't appear to have interest in him last year or this. He's terrorized Brewer pitching in the past.

Last year, Morse was coming off a pretty awful season. I guess I can't blame a club for being wary of a slow, poor fielding 32-year old player coming off a .651 OPS and a variety of injuries. Not that the alternative (Reynolds and Overbay) was such a great idea.

 

I felt pretty confident his 2013 season was more a result of playing in Seattle in a big park in a lineup of lousy hitters and being slowed by injuries. This guy was one of the most feared hitters in the NL when he played for Nationals in 2011 and 2012. That's not that long ago. He was 32 heading into last season. That's not 36 or 37 when most guys decline. He was exactly the kind of guy you look for "on sale". Same went for Morneau. We aren't talking about guys who were average in their peak years like an Overbay or guys who had major contact issues like Reynolds. Morse and Morneau are guys who were as feared as any hitters in the game when they were at their best with the game on line. I'll never forget Axford pumping one 98 mph fastball after another to Morse when Axford was at this best and Morse fouling them off until finally he connected and drove one over the wall in right center in Miller Park. Morse fits his nickname (The Beast) to a tee, as imposing a RH hitter as there is.

 

He was forced to the OF in Washington because they had LaRoche. His best position is 1B, though he's not going to win gold gloves there. Still I'd take him.

[BrewBalls]

Looks like Morse is only guaranteed $12M over two years. This seems like a steal to me.

[3and2Fastball]

crazy to think that Morse started out as a SS with Seattle in 2005!

 

I'm OK with the Brewers not signing Morse, provided that Lucroy is the guy that platoons with Lind, and Martin Maldonado gets more playing time behind the plate. If they get someone worse than Morse to platoon with Lind, well that wouldn't make a bit of sense.

[logan82]

crazy to think that Morse started out as a SS with Seattle in 2005!

 

I'm OK with the Brewers not signing Morse, provided that Lucroy is the guy that platoons with Lind, and Martin Maldonado gets more playing time behind the plate. If they get someone worse than Morse to platoon with Lind, well that wouldn't make a bit of sense.

Neither does making room for Maldonado's bat.

[RobertR]

Yeah, minimizing the plate appearances of Maldonado is a way the team can improve. I'm fine with him getting a start every 5th day, but it's diminishing returns after that.

[reillymcshane]

Looks like Morse is only guaranteed $12M over two years. This seems like a steal to me.

Actually seems really light. I thought he'd be getting at least $10M. Last year he got $6M coming off a terrible year. Weird. Makes me think there are a lot incentives - or the number is misreported.

[brewcrewdue80]

crazy to think that Morse started out as a SS with Seattle in 2005!

 

I'm OK with the Brewers not signing Morse, provided that Lucroy is the guy that platoons with Lind, and Martin Maldonado gets more playing time behind the plate. If they get someone worse than Morse to platoon with Lind, well that wouldn't make a bit of sense.

Neither does making room for Maldonado's bat.

 

I posted this elsewhere...the allen Craig rumor. But Maldonado OPS's over .800 vs LH SPs last season. You do understand that the idea is to sit Lind vs. LHP? I just don't get why we ignore Maldonado's splits vs LH SPs? And then say we have to remove as many ABs from him as possible! He did great vs LHP last season. As well as any of these options-Morse/Craig are being suggested for the RH side of Platoon. I literally can sit here and beg for the Brewers to start Lucroy at 1b vs LHBats and Maldonado at Catcher(figuring 40-48games) which provide Lucroy with added Leg rest throughout the season+an additional roster space not to be taken up by a 1b only RH Platoon bat.

[Thurston Fluff]

I literally can sit here and beg for the Brewers to start Lucroy at 1b vs LHBats and Maldonado at Catcher(figuring 40-48games) which provide Lucroy with added Leg rest throughout the season+an additional roster space not to be taken up by a 1b only RH Platoon bat.

 

Why does that roster spot have to be a 1b only RH platoon bat? Ideally I'd like to see them get a guy who covers both corners, maybe some outfield as well, and give Ramirez a day off here and there.

[3and2Fastball]

Why does that roster spot have to be a 1b only RH platoon bat? Ideally I'd like to see them get a guy who covers both corners, maybe some outfield as well, and give Ramirez a day off here and there.

 

Supposedly we don't have money for that. Unless we catch lightning in a bottle with some else's castoff player. If that is the case, I'd rather have Lucroy playing 1B vs LHP, which saves his legs from catching. Maldonado is solid defensively and offensively vs LHP it is a wash vs some AAAA scrub. Whatever precious tiny bits of money we have left over should be spent on the bullpen since Gallardo & others frequently can't pitch 7 innings in a game.

[reillymcshane]

Deal is for $18M over two years, plus incentives.

[logan82]

I posted this elsewhere...the allen Craig rumor. But Maldonado OPS's over .800 vs LH SPs last season. You do understand that the idea is to sit Lind vs. LHP? I just don't get why we ignore Maldonado's splits vs LH SPs? And then say we have to remove as many ABs from him as possible! He did great vs LHP last season. As well as any of these options-Morse/Craig are being suggested for the RH side of Platoon. I literally can sit here and beg for the Brewers to start Lucroy at 1b vs LHBats and Maldonado at Catcher(figuring 40-48games) which provide Lucroy with added Leg rest throughout the season+an additional roster space not to be taken up by a 1b only RH Platoon bat.

He has a .593 OPS against LHP over his career. I don't think under 45 PA is more relevant than his career line against LHP. He wasn't a good hitter coming up through the minors. He is just a bad hitter. Giving Lucroy a full day off is much better than squeezing Maldanodo and his horrible bat into the lineup any more than necessary.

 

The other side of the 1B platoon doesn't need to be restrained to 1B only.

[SRB]

Another signing that makes Lind look like a steal.

[BrewBalls]

Deal is for $18M over two years, plus incentives.

This looks a lot closer to what I thought Morse would sign for compared to the $12M which was originally reported.

[3and2Fastball]

Maldonado had a .320 OBP last season, which tied him for 6th on the team in OBP! He is not as much of a liability with the bat as some here are suggesting. Meanwhile he is borderline elite defensively. But most importantly, we have a player in Lucroy who is developing into a superstar, a Top 10 in all MLB player. And finding ways to keep him healthy is in the best interests of the Milwaukee Brewers

[logan82]

Maldonado had a .320 OBP last season, which tied him for 6th on the team in OBP! He is not as much of a liability with the bat as some here are suggesting. Meanwhile he is borderline elite defensively. But most importantly, we have a player in Lucroy who is developing into a superstar, a Top 10 in all MLB player. And finding ways to keep him healthy is in the best interests of the Milwaukee Brewers

He had a .236 OBP the year before. Fun with small samples.

[3and2Fastball]

Maldonado had a .320 OBP last season, which tied him for 6th on the team in OBP! He is not as much of a liability with the bat as some here are suggesting. Meanwhile he is borderline elite defensively. But most importantly, we have a player in Lucroy who is developing into a superstar, a Top 10 in all MLB player. And finding ways to keep him healthy is in the best interests of the Milwaukee Brewers

He had a .236 OBP the year before. Fun with small samples.

 

 

And .321 the year before that. I'm willing to bet that 2013 was just an off year for him. Is he going to be the next Buster Posey? Of course not. But I think he's a good solid catcher who has shown a propensity to draw walks and get on-base a little

[monty57]

But I think he's a good solid catcher who has shown a propensity to draw walks and get on-base a little

 

I'd say a good, solid backup catcher. He's a nice guy to have, but the goal should not be to find ways to get him extra at bats. Plus Lucroy needs some days off, so I don't think that having Lucroy catch every day vs RHP and playing 1B against LHP is the way to go. That's a lot of wear-and-tear on the body of one of your best players.

 

I think the likely scenario is that we'll start the season with Lind as the primary 1B, and either Rogers or Jimenez (most likely Jimenez) will be the RH-hitting 1B/backup 3B.

[brewcrewdue80]

Exactly my point on Maldonado. He did well in 2012, poor in 2013, and well again in 2014. It's not just the belief in his ability to bat vs LHP, but also that it comes with his +defense/pitch framing skills.

 

How does Lucroy at 1b defensively rate over the other options? Lucroy played in 153games-149starts in the field last season. That's 9games off. I'm proposing him spending 40 games at 1b to save on wear and tear, this vs. the 16 games started last season at 1b. So you're removing 25 games more roughly of him behind the plate. I don't know if 13games on the bench with 9nights off overall is saving him as much on his body as removing an extra 25games from Catching? I'd think he'd be doing better with the time at 1b vs just random off days combined away from Catcher.

 

The other point in this is that you're going to want to keep Lucroy's bat in the lineup(see 9games off all of last season) so, If it's oh say 44 games Started in a 162game season vs Leftys, the whole idea pushing to have a RH Platoon bat at 1b seems best suited for Lucroy+ a Rogers if need be. Not a roster taking guy like Morse or Craig where you're not using them enough.

 

Also, 1b production last season Look at the OPS across MLB- with 150+PAs last season 19 players beat .750 OPS. 11 beat .800OPS. Lind would project to beat that. The production from Lucroy is around .800OPS vs LH SPs. I just see the need for a RH Platoon bat at 1b being exaggerated especially giving Lucroy more than 10Starts at 1b if not 20. One could easily assume a LH Starter on a Sunday lineup=Maldonado+ the utility player to throw in at 1b. I don't see a big enough gain to pay anyone more than 1mil to be this guy. He'd have to have super value as a backup OF in case of injury to Braun/Gomez/Davis for it to be worthwhile. Morse obviously doesn't qualify, and Craig coming off a Foot injury that plagued him in 2014? Yeah, I really want to trust his fielding skills in the OF under that circumstance? Never mind the enormous expense or complete failure at the plate last season.

 

Forgot to mention. Just for the sake more of arguing vs Maldonado. Catchers with a .750+OPS last season min. 125PAs-12. And Michael McKenry led the league at .910 playing for Colorado, a guy who hadn't exceeded .762OPS in any other year. Also a guy who is below avg defensively.

Move the bar to .800+OPS and its 7 including McKenry.

 

Catchers generally aren't good hitters. I don't get the necessary need to remove Maldonado's bat from Catcher if you're putting Lucroy's+bat at 1b.

 

To much focus on offense from Maldonado from a position where offense doesn't exist.

[logan82]

Catchers generally aren't good hitters. I don't get the necessary need to remove Maldonado's bat from Catcher if you're putting Lucroy's+bat at 1b.

 

To much focus on offense from Maldonado from a position where offense doesn't exist.

That is true but we should not compare how well he hits with other catchers. If we are talking about more than a normal amount of starts for a backup catcher, we should be comparing how well he hits with other 1B options.

 

I am looking at how well he has hit for his entire career including the minors. I don't think we can dismiss how pathetic he was in 2013. For his entire MLB career he has a .291/.360/.651(OBP/SLG/OPS) line. Outside of one year he was a less than .700 OPS and frequently less than .600 OPS guy. His overall batting line in the minors was .236/.313/.333/.646. That stinks.

 

He is fine for a backup catcher but you don't move a guy to put him in the lineup. Lucroy's health 5 years from now should not be a concern when you want to win today. He is likely to be paid big money by someone else to play for them.

[monty57]

The other point in this is that you're going to want to keep Lucroy's bat in the lineup(see 9games off all of last season)

 

They were trying to get him a meaningless "most doubles in team history" title. I personally think that not resting players more (notably Braun and Ramirez, but probably also Lucroy) probably had something to do with the team floundering as the season went on.

 

Lucroy's health 5 years from now should not be a concern when you want to win today. He is likely to be paid big money by someone else to play for them.

 

There's definitely some truth to that, but a business needs to take care of its assets, and an MLB team's greatest assets are its players. Overuse could effect the short-term as well as the long-term, be that injury or simply lessened performance due to fatigue.

 

But we're really looking at a small issue. Lucroy will get some starts at 1B, so we're looking at whether it makes sense to either:

 

(A) give Lucroy all the starts vs LHP at 1B, letting Maldonado get more playing time

 

(B) give Lucroy some starts vs LHP at 1B, letting Rogers/Jimenez get the remainder of the starts at 1B

 

© sign someone else who hits RH and can play 1B.

 

Since it's a relatively small number of games, I don't see the team spending money or prospects to make © a possibility. Therefore, the question is whether you'd like to give the extra PAs to Maldonado or to Rogers/Jimenez.

[logan82]

There's definitely some truth to that, but a business needs to take care of its assets, and an MLB team's greatest assets are its players. Overuse could effect the short-term as well as the long-term, be that injury or simply lessened performance due to fatigue.

Then give him at least normal rest not games "off" at 1B. I think giving him more full days off from catcher is better long term than having him play almost every game but some at 1B.

 

But we're really looking at a small issue. Lucroy will get some starts at 1B, so we're looking at whether it makes sense to either:

 

(A) give Lucroy all the starts vs LHP at 1B, letting Maldonado get more playing time

 

(B) give Lucroy some starts vs LHP at 1B, letting Rogers/Jimenez get the remainder of the starts at 1B

 

© sign someone else who hits RH and can play 1B.

 

Since it's a relatively small number of games, I don't see the team spending money or prospects to make © a possibility. Therefore, the question is whether you'd like to give the extra PAs to Maldonado or to Rogers/Jimenez.

Definitely not A. My choice would be B.

[brewcrewdue80]

Catchers generally aren't good hitters. I don't get the necessary need to remove Maldonado's bat from Catcher if you're putting Lucroy's+bat at 1b.

 

To much focus on offense from Maldonado from a position where offense doesn't exist.

That is true but we should not compare how well he hits with other catchers. If we are talking about more than a normal amount of starts for a backup catcher, we should be comparing how well he hits with other 1B options.

 

I am looking at how well he has hit for his entire career including the minors. I don't think we can dismiss how pathetic he was in 2013. For his entire MLB career he has a .291/.360/.651(OBP/SLG/OPS) line. Outside of one year he was a less than .700 OPS and frequently less than .600 OPS guy. His overall batting line in the minors was .236/.313/.333/.646. That stinks.

 

He is fine for a backup catcher but you don't move a guy to put him in the lineup. Lucroy's health 5 years from now should not be a concern when you want to win today. He is likely to be paid big money by someone else to play for them.

 

Lucroy is roughly a top 10 1b with the bat when he's at 1b. Brewers can't find anyone better on the market like that.

Maldonado, never mentioned, for his poor 2013, how does having to learn how to play 1b on the run potentially have affected his bat? Rather than spend an extra 20min to an hour working on his batting, he's instead learning how to field balls at 1b?

 

I would just rather use Maldonado's 25man roster spot that's guaranteed regardless of how we play 1b vs LH pitchers at C more often and Lucroy at 1b more often. And then field that 25th man on the roster be it a Bullpen guy to keep the other arms fresh or a Super Utility player that can play all over...ala Emilio Bonifacio as been mentioned, Who's Bat is just as poor as Maldonado's. Only he can go play OF/2b/ even 3b when in a pinch. Someone like that. Vs a Stuck in the mud 1b or even worse pathetic fielding OF as a versatility. Who you hope on a good year bats over .700OPS for you.

 

I'd love to hear the 1b options out there that even remotely possess a chance of batting over .700OPS. We tried Reynolds last season it went awful after the early going. Craig is a 3year commitment getting only more expensive. He's coming off a Lisfranc fracture on his foot, so already I question his mobility skills even if 100% healthy. That pretty much takes away his OF ability leaving him as an expensive RH bat for a 1b platoon. You put the two of Lind and Craig together in a platoon at 1b theyre making what combined as a player? Tied for 2nd most with Braun on the team! More than Gomez/Lucroy/Garza and Lohse. Less than ARam. 13mil in 2015-17mil(2nd most behind Braun) for both in 2016?

 

Meanwhile, we'll sit here watch the Bullpen blow games in the 6th/7th/8th innings due to the Avg Pitching staff we possess, and wonder why we didn't address putting money to purchase this guy or this guy? Or trade for this guy? We gave up so and so for Allen Craig?

 

One of the biggest reasons the team got off to a torrid start in 2014 was the Bullpen was lights out when called upon in tight games. Problem was there was only so many guys RRR felt comfortable handing over in tight games, or keeping their arms fresh if given 2 games off pitching, and wore them out.

From the 85th game on the Bullpen had a w/l record of: 6-10. This with them being 15-11 prior to that. So overall 21-21 record by the bullpen. An no doubt losing Thornburg/Henderson meant a lot for them, but the problem is they didn't have that extra piece to call upon when needed either in their minors or just on the staff who was pitching in a whenever needed situation. I've said it earlier, I am not a fan of Kinztler, his stuff looked awful, his velocity was low. Here we are going to use him again, and as it stands, I'd be it's a 7th inning role in close games or a 9th/10th inning role in tie games. The team doesnt have KRod at this time either. We're going to rely on Broxton who in 2013 was a negative value RP. So if he falls to that again, who will we turn to? Jeffress? Henderson/Thornburg if they ever get healthy? Smith? Who had a terrible RH split?

 

That's where I'd rather save a 25man roster spot for vs. plugging in a Veteran RH platoon bat at 1b. Lucroy at 1b/Maldonado at C is still a +Positive duo at their positions overall in batting, nevermind the Defensive+ Maldonado brings to C.