Gomez should be trade bait

[rickh150]

Why?

1. Primarily, we can get more for him now, rather than next year, his last

2. Are we really going to pay him Braun money to keep him from 2017-2022?

3. We sorta have the OF covered for the short term (Parra, Davis, Braun) and long term (Coulter, Taylor, Harrison, Braun, Davis)

4. We could get younger and smarter

5. We could fill a hole or hole at 1B and/or 3B

 

Always, it depends on what teams are offering in return, but we should be aggressively looking to trade a unique talent in Carlos Gomez for the betterment of our club.

[TURBO]

You'll get no argument from me at all. If we can find someone to boost our minor leagues with a giant trade for Gomez, I think we'd have to consider it.

 

It got to the point for me, at the end of this season, I just plain couldn't stand to watch the guy any longer. His over swinging and screwing himself into the ground, his poor little league base running and over aggressiveness to the point of stupidity just took it's toll. I'm done with him, and I hope DM can trade him now, while he still has some inflated value on the market.

 

When things are going good for the team, it is easy to just say that is Carlos being Carlos, but when things are going bad, and he continues the same behaviors that now kill the team, it isn't so easy to overlook all the stupid things he does... It's kind of like when we had Nyjer. When things were going right, it was fun to watch him, even when he sometimes looked like a jackass, but when things were not going so well, it was easy to understand why non-brewer fans hated the guy...

 

Now is the best time to move Gomez, if we can find the deal that makes it worth it (future 3B or 1B especially), we just have to do it...

[DuWayne Steurer]

I would want to see a really excellent return. Gomez is in his prime years, signed cheaply for two more years, and has put up almost 14 WAR for the last 2 years.

 

He should really get a lot back for 2 years of control at the price he's getting paid.

 

I'm also not really excited about the idea of Parra being the everyday centerfielder. I know Gomez has an "ugly approach" but the last two years he's had a .338 and .356 OBP, and Parra has had .323 and .308 OBP in that same timeframe.

[NievesNoNO]

I would want to see a really excellent return. Gomez is in his prime years, signed cheaply for two more years, and has put up almost 14 WAR for the last 2 years.

 

He should really get a lot back for 2 years of control at the price he's getting paid.

 

I'm also not really excited about the idea of Parra being the everyday centerfielder. I know Gomez has an "ugly approach" but the last two years he's had a .338 and .356 OBP, and Parra has had .323 and .308 OBP in that same timeframe.

 

Pretty much agree with this. He's productive on offense and in the field. Especially with our fly ball pitchers, I think he's even more valuable to this Brewers team. I'm not against moving him, but you better make sure you get a sure thing back in return.. preferably young pitching.

[torts]

as entertaining and electric Gomez is, i'd rather cash in on this now, because we've all seen how bad he can be at the plate, and i'd rather avoid missing out on a solid return for him should he regress now that coaches are starting to be replaced.

[chadomac]

You can still get a good return on him AFTER 2015, so that's what I think will happen. They will retool and give this thing another go in 2015 - that's pretty obvious to me.

[rickh150]

Retool? Obvious? What does that mean exactly? We want the playoffs certainly next year. With or without Gomez, that's a different question.

 

If/when we lose ARam in a month, we have huge holes at 3B and 1B. Do we really want costly, aging FA players to fill these spots? If you say yes, are you prepared to pay over their prime players big money on 3 to 5 year contracts that would hamstring us later?

 

Trading Gomez and either Lohse/Gallardo to fill gaping holes at 3B and/or 1B (and/or young pitching) short term and long term looks better to me. Maybe nothing is out there to get at the corners. We should see first.

 

Finally, I disagree about the return after 2015. Gomez, with two very salary friendly contract years, could be dealt to any team on the market this offseason. Next year, only the big boys would be in on him in hopes of resigning him to a bigger deal. Small markets would be scared away, having to give up a bunch for just one year. We'd also be risking Gomez getting hurt or having a down year in 2015, both very real possibilities considering his wrist and his mediocre 2nd half.

[danzig6767]

I would want to see a really excellent return. Gomez is in his prime years, signed cheaply for two more years, and has put up almost 14 WAR for the last 2 years.

 

He should really get a lot back for 2 years of control at the price he's getting paid.

 

I'm also not really excited about the idea of Parra being the everyday centerfielder. I know Gomez has an "ugly approach" but the last two years he's had a .338 and .356 OBP, and Parra has had .323 and .308 OBP in that same timeframe.

 

Yea, i'd only trade Gomez if we got a big time haul in return, especially given his super cheap contract over the next two seasons.

 

For all of the complaints over his free swinging ways, he was second on the team in OBP among regular players after Lucroy. His walk rate while still slightly below average, it's increased in back to back years. For a roster in need of guys who get on base better, getting rid of Carlos and replacing him with Parra won't help that cause, regardless if Gomez swings himself into the dirt often on first pitches. If he isn't the best defensive CF in the game, he's in the top 2 or 3.

 

Baseball isn't like the NFL or NBA though where one superstar in basketball or an elite QB in football can almost by themselves will a team into the playoffs each year even if the roster around them is very mediocre. So IMO only a handful of players in baseball should be considered off limits in trade talks. It's all about the exact return.

[logan82]

I agree that Gomez is our best piece to trade. I doubt Gomez is traded until at least midseason in 2015. I think they will try to build a competitive team and hope to luck into good health again next year. Probably end up in the low 80's for wins. If a big trade is made it is likely to be one of our starting pitchers for a position player. I doubt we see a position player traded.

[reillymcshane]

I agree that Gomez is our best piece to trade. I doubt Gomez is traded until at least midseason in 2015. I think they will try to build a competitive team and hope to luck into good health again next year. Probably end up in the low 80's for wins. If a big trade is made it is likely to be one of our starting pitchers for a position player. I doubt we see a position player traded.

I think this is right. The club thinks it can win in 2015. The only way they deal Gomez is if they falter badly and look like it's time to rebuild.

 

I still think the plan will be bring back Yo, bring back A-Ram, add a 1B (LaRoche), hope Segura and Braun rebound, and hope we avoid the injury bug. It's not necessarily what I would do, but I think it's what DM will do.

[DocLuna7]

I agree that Gomez is our best piece to trade. I doubt Gomez is traded until at least midseason in 2015. I think they will try to build a competitive team and hope to luck into good health again next year. Probably end up in the low 80's for wins. If a big trade is made it is likely to be one of our starting pitchers for a position player. I doubt we see a position player traded.

I think this is right. The club thinks it can win in 2015. The only way they deal Gomez is if they falter badly and look like it's time to rebuild.

 

I still think the plan will be bring back Yo, bring back A-Ram, add a 1B (LaRoche), hope Segura and Braun rebound, and hope we avoid the injury bug. It's not necessarily what I would do, but I think it's what DM will do.

 

This summarizes what I think WILL happen completely, not necessarily what should happen. The RR/DM combo will be given one more year to win with this group of guys and then the rebuild begins after DM retires following next season. If/when the Brewers fall out of contention next season earlier in the year we could start to see a rebuild a bit earlier, but I'd be surprised if this happens without DM's replacement already being part of the decision making process within the organization. (Craig Counsell?)

[monty57]

The only way they deal Gomez is if they falter badly and look like it's time to rebuild.

 

If the Brewers go 0-162 next year, I think Attanasio would believe the solution would be to sign one or two more veteran "name" players and to use the guys on the farm for their sole purpose... trade bait to get more "name" players.

 

Kidding aside, I think you nailed it. Attanasio can talk about "two paths" all he wants, but he's so far down his favorite path that it may take a demolition crew to clear out the "other path." To topic of this thread, Gomez is one of the few arrows we have in the quiver that has the potential to make the inevitable rebuild a little easier. He could bring back several good young players that could brighten up the future, but the cynical side of me doubts he'll be traded now. Instead, they'll wait until he has a couple of months left on his contract before they'll even consider trading him.

[rickh150]

Brewers officials no sure what to do this offseason.... like Attanasio said, "We're not at a crossroads, we can take take two paths." That being, one path is to come back with this veteran club, add an old first baseman, a new bench and a few new bullpen guys. The other is to back off, trade a few pieces for younger talent, and shoot for the playoffs in a year or three.

 

As said other places, the Brewers are seeing what fans are thinking....

http://www.brewcrewball.com/2014/10/15/6982697/brewers-survey-fans My take..... They don't know what to do and what ramifications will happen when they ultimately choose one of two paths. I'd rather take a different path than those two....

 

We could trade a SP and Gomez/Davis for something good now- a young 1B or 3B

Let Nelson be the 5

Play Parra in the OF and/or get Aoki back to leadoff

Start ARAM (if he's back) at 1B to save his legs

 

If the Brewers choose to stand pat, I see this as not a good sign for the season, both on the field and off. This chemistry of players was terrible down the stretch and when they struggle next season, it's going to be even tougher to bounce back with all this year's baggage around their necks. Also, standing pat is not going to get people in the seats early in the season. Going the other way and trading off players willy nilly won't get fans in the seats either, although that is probably the way they should go. Yet, the 3rd path, a good trade or two could keep us competitive for a playoff birth, make us younger and better in two or three years, and get the fans excitement up again.

[jerichoholicninja]

Detroit is always going all in. Next year they don't have a CF and they will probably be looking for a SP after Scherzer leaves. Do the Tigers have anything worthwhile for a Gomez and Lohse/Garza/Gallardo package?

[nate82]

Detroit is always going all in. Next year they don't have a CF and they will probably be looking for a SP after Scherzer leaves. Do the Tigers have anything worthwhile for a Gomez and Lohse/Garza/Gallardo package?

 

Prospect wise? Nothing that would be worth trading Gomez to the Tigers for. The best bet would be to see if the Tigers would do a Price for Gomez swap so they can resign Scherzer and possibly a closer in FA.

 

Other than the Gomez for someone that is already on the Tigers roster now there isn't much left in the Tigers farm system to target. The Tigers farm system is actually more barren than the Brewers and the Angels system. The only thing that kept the Tigers above the Brewers and the Angels at the beginning of this season was Castellanos and now that he is in the majors for good the Tigers now have the worst farm system in all of baseball and it is by a wide margin. No one comes close to the Tigers in terms of a bad farm system.

[MNBrew]

Detroit is always going all in. Next year they don't have a CF and they will probably be looking for a SP after Scherzer leaves. Do the Tigers have anything worthwhile for a Gomez and Lohse/Garza/Gallardo package?

 

Prospect wise? Nothing that would be worth trading Gomez to the Tigers for. The best bet would be to see if the Tigers would do a Price for Gomez swap so they can resign Scherzer and possibly a closer in FA.

 

Other than the Gomez for someone that is already on the Tigers roster now there isn't much left in the Tigers farm system to target. The Tigers farm system is actually more barren than the Brewers and the Angels system. The only thing that kept the Tigers above the Brewers and the Angels at the beginning of this season was Castellanos and now that he is in the majors for good the Tigers now have the worst farm system in all of baseball and it is by a wide margin. No one comes close to the Tigers in terms of a bad farm system.

Much like the previous Price trade, could sending Gomez and Gallardo to DET AND involving a 3rd team allow the Brewers to net the type of return those two would justify?

 

I think I'd still rather trade Gallardo than Gomez in spite of the rare chance to sell high on Gomez, and I'd prefer to see if the package of Gallardo & Davis would net us David Price. That said, Gomez may be just what it takes to land us enough solid in return to positively alter the makeup of the everyday lineup in a significant & favorable direction, whether by that trade alone or in tandem with other moves.

 

If Gomez were traded, I'd hope the end result isn't Gerardo Parra as the everyday CF simply b/c his bat's not terribly promising.

[JohnBriggs12]

"If Gomez were traded, I'd hope the end result isn't Gerardo Parra as the everyday CF simply b/c his bat's not terribly promising."

 

Parra's going to be a very expensive 4th OF as it is and I agree he doesn't have the punch to play everyday. That might be different if they knew Braun would be back to his old self, and they filled holes at 1B and potentially 3B with potent bats.

[TooLiveBrew]

Brewers officials no sure what to do this offseason.... like Attanasio said, "We're not at a crossroads, we can take take two paths." That being, one path is to come back with this veteran club, add an old first baseman, a new bench and a few new bullpen guys. The other is to back off, trade a few pieces for younger talent, and shoot for the playoffs in a year or three.

 

As said other places, the Brewers are seeing what fans are thinking....

http://www.brewcrewball.com/2014/10/15/6982697/brewers-survey-fans My take..... They don't know what to do and what ramifications will happen when they ultimately choose one of two paths. I'd rather take a different path than those two...

1) Isn't that kind of the definition of a crossroads?

 

2) It's concerning to me, & makes me worry about a lack of leadership, that they're polling fans to determine the direction the franchise might take. Bascially confirms 100% that Attanasio doesn't want to make major changes for fear of pain in ticket revenues.

[monty57]

"If Gomez were traded, I'd hope the end result isn't Gerardo Parra as the everyday CF simply b/c his bat's not terribly promising."

 

Parra's going to be a very expensive 4th OF as it is and I agree he doesn't have the punch to play everyday. That might be different if they knew Braun would be back to his old self, and they filled holes at 1B and potentially 3B with potent bats.

 

If the Brewers would take the "step back to take two steps forward" approach and target 2-3 years down the road, then Davis in LF and Parra in CF is perfectly fine for a season. At least they're really MLB players, which is a lot better than most "rebuilding" teams get, plus it gives Parra the opportunity to shine so he can be flipped at the deadline. So, if Gomez, Gallardo, Lohse and Broxton could bring us back young talent that could really help us in 2-3 years as some of our other promising prospects are getting MLB-ready, I'd be all for it. Other than Gomez, all of the other players would be gone after 2015 anyways, so really all the Brewers would be doing is saying "we don't think we have a playoff team this year, so we're going to give ourselves a better chance of having a playoff team in the near future."

 

However, I don't think Attanasio could ever do this, so it's far more likely that we add a couple of "names" to big contracts and continue the same discussion next offseason that we've had the previous few offseasons, wondering why the team "fell apart," and what magic cure is out there to vault them to the World Series next year.

[logan82]

1) Isn't that kind of the definition of a crossroads?

 

2) It's concerning to me, & makes me worry about a lack of leadership, that they're polling fans to determine the direction the franchise might take. Bascially confirms 100% that Attanasio doesn't want to make major changes for fear of pain in ticket revenues.

1) Kind of. I think of a crossroads as where 2 roads meet so you have 4 directions to go. One being backwards. He is probably thinking of a fork in the road. Not a heck of a lot of difference.

 

2) My takeaway from that questionnaire is all they really care about is selling tickets.

[TheCrew07]

I have a huge problem with the questionnaire, why are they asking us what to do?

 

Even though it's likely a window dressing PR move this kind of shoots down the theory that the Brewers have had a long-term strategy all along doesn't it? Let's just keep patching season to season shall we?

[TooLiveBrew]

1) Isn't that kind of the definition of a crossroads?

 

2) It's concerning to me, & makes me worry about a lack of leadership, that they're polling fans to determine the direction the franchise might take. Bascially confirms 100% that Attanasio doesn't want to make major changes for fear of pain in ticket revenues.

1) Kind of. I think of a crossroads as where 2 roads meet so you have 4 directions to go. One being backwards. He is probably thinking of a fork in the road. Not a heck of a lot of difference.

 

2) My takeaway from that questionnaire is all they really care about is selling tickets.

"When you come to a fork in the road, take it"

[sheetskout]

As much as I am FOR a Gomez deal it would have to bring someone at the major-league level I would think. I just can't see Mark A. giving Roenicke one virtual-last shot and then selling off his players. To me the Roenicke decision guarantees we're not in a conventional rebuilding mode at the moment.

 

Disclaimer: Personally, I would prefer a Gomez deal that brought us controllable young talent back. This is just what I think will happen instead.

[brewcrewdue80]

As much as I am FOR a Gomez deal it would have to bring someone at the major-league level I would think. I just can't see Mark A. giving Roenicke one virtual-last shot and then selling off his players. To me the Roenicke decision guarantees we're not in a conventional rebuilding mode at the moment.

 

Disclaimer: Personally, I would prefer a Gomez deal that brought us controllable young talent back. This is just what I think will happen instead.

 

I agree that if Gomez is dealt someone who's ML ready or maybe 1year in to the Majors would be the first piece in the package put together. Now the question is who qualifies to put that package together and needs Gomez in CF?

Mets/Twins his former teams just don't see them trading back for him. But they have some of the best packages you could build for Gomez.

 

Pirates/Cubs/Cardinals also have pieces to make a deal but in division deals likely aren't going to be done.

Dodgers have the package pieces but I believe they are going to go with those guys/Pederson/Seager/Urias so another no.

 

You start looking at the top 100 prospects then between divisions and work your way down for potential deals.

Giants, I don't think they have what we'd want.

Padres, Again not likely a proper package of what we'd want

Rockies, not putting a package worthwhile.

DBacks Can.

 

Braves, not exactly what we need

Marlins, if they had just kept Colin Moran!

Phillies can but would they acquire Gomez in that aging lineup?

Nationals can but do they need Gomez

 

Orioles, not what we need for Gomez

Red Sox can but don't think Gomez fits them

Yankees, don't see them having the package

Rays, don't see them having the package

Blue Jays, maybe

 

White Sox, don't have the package

Indians, don't think they need Gomez

Tigers, don't have the package

Royals, can but don't need Gomez

 

Astros can but don't see them moving to acquire Gomez to win some more in 2015/16

Angels don't need Gomez

Athletics can I believe but doubtful after losing Russell

Mariners certainly can

Rangers certainly can.

 

So that's Dbacks, Phillies, Nationals, Red Sox, Blue Jays, Royals, Astros, Athletics, Mariners, Rangers imo of who to disect trade ideas from.

 

And I'm going to guess half those teams have zero use for Gomez.

[JohnBriggs12]

I think the White Sox could come up with a package, but they don't really have a need in CF. They like Eaton a lot in CF and as a leadoff hitter.