2014-08-01 Brewers (Peralta) at Cardinals (Wainwright), 7:15 PM CDT [Brewers win, 7-4]

[Polish Falcons]

I like it how we are in August and Wily Peralta leads all of MLB in wins. Havent heard people mentioning that at all.

[sargennm]

 

I don't know the answer to that. I know that not knowing the answer to that doesn't absolve us from a responsibility to take actions to protect our players. Gomez is going to end up injured one of these times, and that's not okay, and Matheny deserves discipline for carrying it this far.

 

I'm not directly suggesting retaliation, just suggesting that as one course of action. And if you do, I'm not advocating giving them a free runner. Just doing it in a situation that it doesn't hurt you (a blowout, or a situation where you would give an IBB anyway)

 

 

Ok, so tomorrow, we're up 10 - 1, and you bring in Kintzler, who drills Holliday. What have you proven? I want to know what tangible point have we proven? That we'll play tit for tat? You know how this goes. You KNOW that this will NOT result in the Cardinals ceasing to hit batters or pitch inside, so I'm asking, not sarcastically, what tangible benefit the scenario you're laying out will provide.

 

That if you continue to risk injuring our players by throwing up and in, you risk your players getting injured in retaliation. If they were hitting him with breaking balls in the thigh and back I wouldn't have the issue of retaliating. But they,re coming in and high. Retaliating feels like the only thing you can do. Not reacting hasn't stopped it. Scoring Gomez hasn't stopped it.

[lcbj68c]

I've said time and time again. They way to retaliate is intentionally walk their pitcher and then throw over to 1st base about 6 consecutive times with your first baseman applying a slap tag to the pitcher's dome as hard as possible. If he quits/doesnt slide in, then just slap it to his chest. Never again will that pitcher bean your team. Ever!

[FVBrewerFan]

Hitting them won't make it stop, that's their game. If anything, the brewers should do more of what drives them nuts. Bat flips, rounding the bases after a hr in a slowwww jog, crank up the ribbon lights....heck start un- tucking again. I'm serious, that stuff obviously gets in their heads.

[endaround]

 

I don't know the answer to that. I know that not knowing the answer to that doesn't absolve us from a responsibility to take actions to protect our players. Gomez is going to end up injured one of these times, and that's not okay, and Matheny deserves discipline for carrying it this far.

 

I'm not directly suggesting retaliation, just suggesting that as one course of action. And if you do, I'm not advocating giving them a free runner. Just doing it in a situation that it doesn't hurt you (a blowout, or a situation where you would give an IBB anyway)

 

 

Ok, so tomorrow, we're up 10 - 1, and you bring in Kintzler, who drills Holliday. What have you proven? I want to know what tangible point have we proven? That we'll play tit for tat? You know how this goes. You KNOW that this will NOT result in the Cardinals ceasing to hit batters or pitch inside, so I'm asking, not sarcastically, what tangible benefit the scenario you're laying out will provide.

 

Here's what would happen:

 

1. Kinztler gets ejected and get's a three game suspension.

 

2. The Cardinals throw at Gomez during the game Sunday, the benches clear and Gomez gets a 5 suspension for charging the mound.

 

EDIT: Oh yeah, the Brewers close the gap on the DBacks for manliness points!

[SRB]

I like it how we are in August and Wily Peralta leads all of MLB in wins. Havent heard people mentioning that at all.

 

And K-Rod leads all of baseball in Saves. Just like everybody predicted before the season started.

[yfinn6]

Hitting them won't make it stop, that's their game. If anything, the brewers should do more of what drives them nuts. Bat flips, rounding the bases after a hr in a slowwww jog, crank up the ribbon lights....heck start un- tucking again. I'm serious, that stuff obviously gets in their heads.

 

I like this idea.

[DuWayne Steurer]

 

I don't know the answer to that. I know that not knowing the answer to that doesn't absolve us from a responsibility to take actions to protect our players. Gomez is going to end up injured one of these times, and that's not okay, and Matheny deserves discipline for carrying it this far.

 

I'm not directly suggesting retaliation, just suggesting that as one course of action. And if you do, I'm not advocating giving them a free runner. Just doing it in a situation that it doesn't hurt you (a blowout, or a situation where you would give an IBB anyway)

 

 

Ok, so tomorrow, we're up 10 - 1, and you bring in Kintzler, who drills Holliday. What have you proven? I want to know what tangible point have we proven? That we'll play tit for tat? You know how this goes. You KNOW that this will NOT result in the Cardinals ceasing to hit batters or pitch inside, so I'm asking, not sarcastically, what tangible benefit the scenario you're laying out will provide.

 

That if you continue to risk injuring our players by throwing up and in, you risk your players getting injured in retaliation. If they were hitting him with breaking balls in the thigh and back I wouldn't have the issue of retaliating. But they,re coming in and high. Retaliating feels like the only thing you can do. Not reacting hasn't stopped it. Scoring Gomez hasn't stopped it.

 

So, I'm not trying to put words in your mouth, but that is not a benefit to the Brewers. Do you believe that this will put an end to the Cardinals hitting Brewers batters? That's what I'm asking, and no one will say "yes, I think hitting Holliday/Adams in the back of the hand and risking injury will actually change the way the Cardinals play". That's what I'm asking, and no one will actually affirm that. (I suspect because nobody believes it to be true).

 

So again, what actual BENEFIT will we get? Will they stop throwing at Gomez? No. So what have you gained? Except maybe a suspension, and a further beanball war?

[folly412]

Hitting them won't make it stop, that's their game. If anything, the brewers should do more of what drives them nuts. Bat flips, rounding the bases after a hr in a slowwww jog, crank up the ribbon lights....heck start un- tucking again. I'm serious, that stuff obviously gets in their heads.

 

I like this idea.

 

[sarcasm]Maybe Braun can even eat some (actual) gummy bears in the outfield just to draw scorn. Sell it, sister![/sarcasm]

[TURBO]

If Gomez continues to get hit by the Cards, he will snap and get that 5 game suspension anyway... If this continues, we are going to have a mess on our hands, watch and see.

[areacodes]

If Gomez continues to get hit by the Cards, he will snap and get that 5 game suspension anyway... If this continues, we are going to have a mess on our hands, watch and see.

 

So the Brewers intentionally hitting a Cardinals batter will decrease the odds that the Cardinals will retaliate? Don't think that is how they operate.. odds are it will increase the chance that one of our players get plunked again.

[Fear The Chorizo]

I think the whole point of this back and forth is even if the Brewers start hitting Cardinal batters, it isn't going to stop Gomez getting hit by the Cardinals. So, if you're trying to retaliate in a bean ball war, it's not going to stop.

 

To me, there's enough smoke with the Cards hitting Gomez that the ump would be completely entitled tomorrow to tell Matheny that his team is under a warning when they are exchanging lineup cards before the game. Not warnings to both sides, but issue a warning to the Cardinals and tell them they've earned it. That won't happen, and that's why IMO the league needs to grow a pair and start going after organizations that regularly incite this stuff. I think it's headed in that direction, as the league has gotten rid of home plate collisions as an acceptable part of the game. To me the next step is eliminating the intentional beanball wars. Retaliation only ends up leading to bench clearing brawls, it doesn't keep your own hitters healthier.

[sargennm]

 

That if you continue to risk injuring our players by throwing up and in, you risk your players getting injured in retaliation. If they were hitting him with breaking balls in the thigh and back I wouldn't have the issue of retaliating. But they,re coming in and high. Retaliating feels like the only thing you can do. Not reacting hasn't stopped it. Scoring Gomez hasn't stopped it.

 

So, I'm not trying to put words in your mouth, but that is not a benefit to the Brewers. Do you believe that this will put an end to the Cardinals hitting Brewers batters? That's what I'm asking, and no one will say "yes, I think hitting Holliday/Adams in the back of the hand and risking injury will actually change the way the Cardinals play". That's what I'm asking, and no one will actually affirm that. (I suspect because nobody believes it to be true).

 

So again, what actual BENEFIT will we get? Will they stop throwing at Gomez? No. So what have you gained? Except maybe a suspension, and a further beanball war?

 

I believe you must do something to protect your players. It has the best chance of working. Doing nothing has not worked. I don't want to see Gomez boil over and take it into his own hands.

[NievesNoNO]

Hitting them won't make it stop, that's their game. If anything, the brewers should do more of what drives them nuts. Bat flips, rounding the bases after a hr in a slowwww jog, crank up the ribbon lights....heck start un- tucking again. I'm serious, that stuff obviously gets in their heads.

 

Yep, I agree with this. It's up to the Brewers manager/coaches to bring it to the attention of the umpires, maybe before the game and let them know they think they're being thrown at.. let them know how many times Gomez has been hit.. that sort of thing.

 

I'm not completely against some sort of subtle retaliation, but the best way to get them is to beat them in their house and hey... maybe over-celebrate on their field a little or something. Let them be the ones to lose their cool.

[SRB]

Everybody wearing elbow guards to the plate and flipping bats on anything out of the infield is the correct response.

 

*Edit* Though we could also just bring Wang back and have him start intentionally hitting people until he gets a 30 days suspension.

[areacodes]

I believe you must do something to protect your players. It has the best chance of working. Doing nothing has not worked. I don't want to see Gomez boil over and take it into his own hands.

 

But if we hit them, aren't they just as likely (or more likely) to hit us in retaliation? That is how they play, so all we would be doing is increasing the chances of our players getting hit while putting a runner on base.

[superfly]

Hell of a win tonight, awesome to woop some Cardinal ass no matter the circumstance.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Doing nothing has not worked

 

Doing something almost got Braun's head taken off in 2011, too.

 

The error in retaliating against the Cardinals is that you assume they remember that they started it. They typically end up viewing the retaliation as reason to go headhunting.

[sveumrules]

Since Roenicke has been managing the team our pitchers have ranked 30th, 30th, 24th and 26th in HBP. You can wish or hope or pray that he starts drilling people in retaliation but it ain't gonna happen. Me personally, I like to say a prayer and drink to world peace.

[gregmag]

Just watched Matheny's post-game interview. What a whining tool. A true heir to Tony LaRussa. I'm ashamed he played for us.

[Pugger]

Not sure what the replay umpires were looking at, he was clearly out, but I'll take it.

 

Wasn't there a replay recently - in one of our games in the last home stand (the Mets?) - where the replay umpires got it clearly wrong and it hurt us?

[brewcrewdue80]

My solution to the Cardinals HBP ways. Charge the mound halfway everytime it occurs. Start doing this game 1 of the season series. Stop argue how intentional that was, and turn to the ump saying your displeasure(in Gomez's case this is the umpteenth time they've hit me)

 

Every single FB that's hbp. Do this. Benches will clear you as a Brewer with this strategy, never throw a punch, it's all for show. Delay the game 5-10min...all for show.

 

Game 2 this happens repeat. At some point the Umps will just avoid this "Show" and toss the Cardinal Pitcher first before you charge at him. MLB will have all these mound charging due to HBPs they will take notice. Delay the game, delay the game, empty the benches, bullpen make this a fiasco for the intentional HBP that appears unintentional. Keep doing this vs. the Cardinals only, Maybe the rest of Baseball will catch up and do so to, and that HBP Cardinal way will disappear because the immense Nuisance it causes every single game.

[Pugger]

If u are squeamish, don't watch the Paul George video from tonight. Just brutal...

 

I wasn't near a TV last night. What happened?

[Invader3K]

My solution to the Cardinals HBP ways. Charge the mound halfway everytime it occurs. Start doing this game 1 of the season series. Stop argue how intentional that was, and turn to the ump saying your displeasure(in Gomez's case this is the umpteenth time they've hit me)

 

Every single FB that's hbp. Do this. Benches will clear you as a Brewer with this strategy, never throw a punch, it's all for show. Delay the game 5-10min...all for show.

 

Game 2 this happens repeat. At some point the Umps will just avoid this "Show" and toss the Cardinal Pitcher first before you charge at him. MLB will have all these mound charging due to HBPs they will take notice. Delay the game, delay the game, empty the benches, bullpen make this a fiasco for the intentional HBP that appears unintentional. Keep doing this vs. the Cardinals only, Maybe the rest of Baseball will catch up and do so to, and that HBP Cardinal way will disappear because the immense Nuisance it causes every single game.

 

It's an interesting idea, though Molina would probably tackle the Brewers batter when he stops halfway to the mound.

[superfly]

If u are squeamish, don't watch the Paul George video from tonight. Just brutal...

 

I wasn't near a TV last night. What happened?

 

 

Kevin Ware.